Banned from AH for trolling

MadsL

This evening in AH I posted a parody thread of a thread that was mistakenly posted three times. Others followed until there were nine parody threads. i believe mine was the first of these parody threads.

I also posted a poll about if it was time to stop with the "torch meme" infecting other threads on AH of which I was also guilty.

I was banned by an AH mod for trolling. I believe the only thing I am guilty of is not being funny. I certainly never intended to troll anyone by it.

I don't believe I broke any rules and caught an over-reaction by the mod.

Could a CMod take a look at this please and review the ban.

MadsL

By the way the AH mod has responded and said they are away for a few days and to fire away at a DRP thread.

MadsL

Here is the thread I posted as a parody thread. It has been merged with other threads.

http://www.boards.ie/vbulletin/showpost.php?p=85984771&postcount=3

The poll thread has been deleted, I'm not sure why, rather than closed.

Micky Dolenz

Hi MadsL.

I can see deleted threads. Give me a few hours and ill get back to you.

Thanks.

MadsL

Cheers appreciate it.

Micky Dolenz

Hi MadsL.

I've had a look over things. There seemed to be a lot of messing last night. While I do enjoy a bit of messing myself, you and others brought it a bit far.

A core group made work for the mod team and annoyed more than a few users. You a bigpart of this group. No-one wants to wake up to a gillizon RP's to have to go through them.

However, you are a good guy and I and the banning mod are willing to lift the ban.

In future, by all means have the craic, but do so in a way that does not imped on others.

Is this agreeable?

MadsL

Hi Micky,

I appreciate that, yes there was some messing but it was all done with the intent of humour and nothing malicious.

Thanks for taking a look at this.

Cheers!

Micky Dolenz

Cool,

Banned lifted.

Resolved.

MadsL

Thanks.

But 'lifted' ? not 'reversed' ?

Hate to be pedantic but this is the internet

Am I being allowed back in as I'm a good chap, or because the ban wasn't deserved?

Cheers.

Micky Dolenz

MadsL wrote: »

Thanks.

But 'lifted' ? not 'reversed' ?

Hate to be pedantic but this is the internet

Am I being allowed back in as I'm a good chap, or because the ban wasn't deserved?

Cheers.

Oh, you deserved to be banned, for the reasons I stated above. Making work for the mod team, annoying other users. The length of the ban was probably a bit much. A one day ban would have stopped you in your tracks.

So, taking the ban length and circumstance, I felt it was appropriate to shorten the ban. Either way, it will be shown that it was over ruled here.

MadsL

Micky Dolenz wrote: »

Oh, you deserved to be banned, for the reasons I stated above. Making work for the mod team, annoying other users. The length of the ban was probably a bit much. A one day ban would have stopped you in your tracks.

So, taking the ban length and circumstance, I felt it was appropriate to shorten the ban. Either way, it will be shown that it was over ruled here.

Hi Micky,

I appreciate the clarification. And I'm not trying to be awkward, just trying to understand how to stay away from the mods ire in future and keep a clean record.

But I'm still not sure how I broke the rules. Please help me to understand.

I started a parody thread, then others spammed 8 or so more. I cannot be held responsible for what others do after me, can I?

I started a poll thread on the torch meme to see what other users who were not participating had to say about the meme.

Are either of those actions against the charter?

The torch thread has been locked, with a warning about starting "similar" threads will result in a ban - but the OP was only asking a genuine question.

Is participating in comedy derailments/in jokes on thread now bannable?

I'm just trying to be clear about what the rules are...

Micky Dolenz

MadsL wrote: »

Hi Micky,

I appreciate the clarification. And I'm not trying to be awkward, just trying to understand how to stay away from the mods ire in future and keep a clean record.

But I'm still not sure how I broke the rules. Please help me to understand.

I started a parody thread, then others spammed 8 or so more. I cannot be held responsible for what others do after me, can I?

I started a poll thread on the torch meme to see what other users who were not participating had to say about the meme.

Are either of those actions against the charter?

The torch thread has been locked, with a warning about starting "similar" threads will result in a ban - but the OP was only asking a genuine question.

Is participating in comedy derailments/in jokes on thread now bannable?

I'm just trying to be clear about what the rules are...

Ok, Let me make it clearer for you.

You were banned for trolling. You started a parody thread of a parody thread of a parody thread etc. Then you start a thread to object to said parody threads. The joke wasn't funny any more and you crossed over into trolling territory and quite rightly were removed from the forum.

Of course jokes aren't a bannable offence but trolling AH certainly is.
You made work for an already hard working mod team, you agitated other users of the forum. While you see it as a bit of fun, we do not.

In short, you trolled AH, I am sure, or I was sure, you didn't mean to, hence why I lifted the ban.

MadsL

Micky Dolenz wrote: »

Ok, Let me make it clearer for you.

You were banned for trolling. You started a parody thread of a parody thread of a parody thread etc.

Emm, respectfully. No I didn't. I started a parody thread of lkionm's mistakenly triple posted thread. It may not have been funny, but surely not against the rules.

I was (I believe) according to the time stamp, the first poster to do this.
Others started parody threads of lkionm's thread after me.
I don't believe others who started those thread were banned, so I bizarrely appear to have been punished for being the first to post what became annoying spam for the mods. Whilst the spam threads posters went unpunished.

Then you start a thread to object to said parody threads. The joke wasn't funny any more and you crossed over into trolling territory and quite rightly were removed from the forum.

I can be banned from AH for not knowing when a joke is no longer funny without a mod warning being given...uh...ok?

Of course jokes aren't a bannable offence but trolling AH certainly is.

Which of my actions were trolling? I'm really struggling here to understand what happened except a mod got annoyed with the amount of threads and then went "here you - banned".

You made work for an already hard working mod team,

I fully fully appreciate the mod team, but I think it reasonable to object to being banned for what the mod thought I did, rather than what I actually did.

you agitated other users of the forum. While you see it as a bit of fun, we do not.

Agitated how? By starting a thread asking them if they would like the funny joke that is not now funny to stop? How is that different from asking "Is it time to ban thinly-veiled?"

Out of interest were any other users banned as part of this bit of AH's getting giddy?

In short, you trolled AH, I am sure, or I was sure, you didn't mean to, hence why I lifted the ban.

You see that is the problem, I cannot actually see how posting within the rules is trolling. I can see how posting a parody thread of a parody thread of a parody thread would be. I didn't do that. Could you check that again?

I can also see how "agitated other users of the forum" can be seen as trolling; but which of my posts agitated other users. Was my poll thread reported for instance?

If you are referring to the "Petersons" posts - sure a mod was having great fun with that all evening. And if so, why was I singled out for a ban?

I'm really not trying to be difficult, but I genuinely A. Appreciate the mod team and B. Hope that they see fairness and even-handedness as important.

If B. is true - then I don't think I deserved any ban.

Micky Dolenz

I can not nor am I willing to discuss actions against other posters with you.

I have stated my reasoning as clearing as I can. If you don't see where you went astray, I am afraid this drp is not resolved and I have little choice but to reinstate the original ban.

MadsL

Micky,

This makes no sense.

You have lifted the ban for something far worse than what I actually did.

Now you want to reinstate the ban because I am trying to be treated fairly for what I actually did.

I did not start a "a parody thread of a parody thread of a parody thread" that simply isn't true.

So am I being punished for;

A. Starting a parody thread?
B. Starting a poll thread?
C. Posting "Peterson" comments

or as it seems to be:

D. Being in the wrong place at the wrong time.

I really don't want to have an Admin review this, but if you cannot point to which of my actions broke the rules then clearly I don't deserve ANY ban.

If you wish to scale it back to a yellow card, I'll accept a warning. Otherwise perhaps another CMod could arbitrate.

MadsL

Micky, Respectfully, just to lay out some timings to try and be objective and help with the decision.

Ikiomn posted at 01.11am
http://www.boards.ie/vbulletin/showpost.php?p=85984644&postcount=1

I posted the first parody of Ikionm's thread at 01.25am
Where to go in Ireland
http://www.boards.ie/vbulletin/showpost.php?p=85984771&postcount=3

Mammanabammana posted at 1.33am
Where to glow in Ireland
http://www.boards.ie/vbulletin/showpost.php?p=85984834&postcount=8

Audman posted 1.37am
Where to go in Ireland
http://www.boards.ie/vbulletin/showpost.php?p=85984877&postcount=16

Mammanabammana posted at 1.33am
Vertigo in Ireland
http://www.boards.ie/vbulletin/showpost.php?p=85984898&postcount=22

So, objectively with links and timings, I did not, as you said:

Micky Dolenz wrote: »

Ok, Let me make it clearer for you.

You were banned for trolling. You started a parody thread of a parody thread of a parody thread etc. Then you start a thread to object to said parody threads. The joke wasn't funny any more and you crossed over into trolling territory and quite rightly were removed from the forum.

So - as shown above I didn't do that. I started the first (after Ikionm) of a number of parody threads that were then merged.

You then say "Then you start a thread to object to said parody threads" but again I didn't do that. I started a thread about the torch/Peterson meme, a completely different topic . I cannot link to it as it has been deleted.

Micky Dolenz

Thank you for pointing out other trolly posts. They will be dealt with accordantly.

I am reversing my earlier decision and upholding the original ban. You seem to want to time sink mod time. The spirit of the charter is far more important than the wording.

You may seek for an Admin review if you so wish.

MadsL

Micky Dolenz wrote: »

Thank you for pointing out other trolly posts. They will be dealt with accordantly.

I am reversing my earlier decision and upholding the original ban. You seem to want to time sink mod time. The spirit of the charter is far more important than the wording.

You may seek for an Admin review if you so wish.

Micky, I absolutely do not wish to "time sink" mod time. I am following the DRP as proscribed and as instructed. I didn't make the rules, in fact I am trying to establish which rules I broke.

I would however like to be dealt with accurately for what I have done and not what the mods think I did. There are serious inaccuracies about what you say I was banned for:

I did not start "a parody thread of a parody thread of a parody thread etc."
I did not then start "a thread about the parody threads"

Neither of these things happened. Yet they are being held by you as the reason for the ban, if they didn't happen...how can I be banned for it?

So now, having pointed that out to you, using the DRP process, as instructed - now apparently I am banned for wasting mod time and breaching the spirit of the charter.

That's as close to saying "you are banned because we say so" as I can find.

Please, an admin review or a infraction card. Up to you. I would prefer not to waste an admins time, however I maintain the ban was unwarranted and unfair.

MadsL

*bump*

Would appreciate an admin taking a look, this is still unresolved.

Thank you.

Spear

I've nudged the admins on this one.

MadsL

Thanks Spear - appreciate it.

Mr E

OK, I've had a look at this one. There was a lot to go through, so apologies for the delay.

What it boils down to is this - the first parody thread that night was yours, and that started the chain reaction of other threads. In addition to that, you started the pointless Torch-free AH thread (which was reported multiple times).

One of the rules of AH (9th line in the charter) is No pointless threads, posts or polls, stating:

Think before you post.
Pointless threads (e.g. 1,000 posts \o/), polls (e.g. Daddy or chips?) will be locked or deleted. Please contribute to your own threads. If you're asking somebody to forward an opinion put one forward yourself first. Pointless posts (e.g. yore ma, first!, w00t!, +1, ibtl) will be removed on sight. Persistent offenders may be banned for this.

The first parody thread was the pebble that turned into snowball, and the torch-free thread took you over the line.

After Hours is one of the busiest forums on this site, and this kind of stuff (particularly in the middle of the night) just adds to the mods' workload.

Ban upheld.