Thoughts on mounted cameras

hueylewis

I've been considering purchasing a camera for the last few months for a couple of reasons. I'd like one for the fun of capturing footage of routes I take, and also as a bit of (hopefully not needed) security for myself in the event of an accident on the road.

The latter reason has really been prompted by the odd aggressive driver giving no room on overtakes, or repeatedly pushing up behind me and trying to overtake approaching bends or taking a chance with oncoming traffic. In my experience, on average I'd say 1 in every 6 drivers on the routes I take behave as described (most drivers give me plenty of room), though there have been cases where 3 or 4 people will "follow the leader" and perform the same dangerous manoeuvre one after another. Sooner or later it feels like one of these risk takers are going to realise a mistake too late and I could be the one facing the consequences.

I was wondering what people felt about the usefulness of a camera in these sorts of situations, and the practicality of bringing one on a ride. If a driver is clearly captured on camera being reckless on the road, albeit without causing an accident - is it worth having the footage and reporting it to the Gardaí? If an accident does occur, surely video evidence (assuming it's clear enough) will be of great benefit in the case of a driver denying any wrong doing? In terms of practicality, I'm not thrilled by the idea of sticking a camera on top of my helmet, and sticking it on the frame would greatly reduce it's field of view, and thereby effectiveness as "evidence". The camera being obvious and visible on top of a helmet might be a deterrent, but might also give the impression that I'm out looking for trouble, which is the last thing I'd want to bring upon myself.

So, I'd love to hear opinions on this, especially from anyone who uses a camera themselves.

wotdef

I've been thinking of getting one as well for much the same reason. If you don't want it to attract too much attention go for one of the smaller ones as well as keeping some dignity. Seen guys with GoPros on helmets and they look like Tellytubbies. More and more car drivers are using in-car cameras now so why shouldn't cyclists. As for the Guards, they don't really want to know about near misses.

dogsears

hueylewis wrote: »

I'm not thrilled by the idea of sticking a camera on top of my helmet, and sticking it on the frame would greatly reduce it's field of view, and thereby effectiveness as "evidence".

Not so sure it would. I have a Contour Roam (course the buggers went out of business yesterday, so all the research I put in before preferring it over the GoPro was a total waste) and the side to side field captured is quite large. Indeed it brings so much into picture that there's a slight fish eye aspect on playback.

I used to put it on my helmet but much prefer now to mount it on the bars. I get a much more consistent result (the bars move less than my head) and don't really lose anything in the span of the scene captured. All I really lost was the occasional sight of my hands on the bars. I suppose the one thing a bar mounted cam might lose over a helmet mounted one is evidence that you were looking behind you, but as I mainly use it to record occasional pretty rides rather than as a security measure, I'm not pushed about that.

You could of course get both types of mount and decide where to mount it based on your objective on the day i.e. going up the Connor Pass - put it on the bars, going through the centre of town, on your head.

hueylewis

wotdef wrote: »

I've been thinking of getting one as well for much the same reason. If you don't want it to attract too much attention go for one of the smaller ones as well as keeping some dignity. Seen guys with GoPros on helmets and they look like Tellytubbies. More and more car drivers are using in-car cameras now so why shouldn't cyclists. As for the Guards, they don't really want to know about near misses.

Yeah, I'd pretty much ruled out GoPros due to their bulkiness. The Contour Roam, like dogsears mentioned, would be my preference.

I suppose I wouldn't have expected the gardai to care too much about something that didn't involve an accident. Could be a waste of time reporting it, though if it was some real mad driving it might be worth letting them know.

dogsears wrote: »

Not so sure it would. I have a Contour Roam (course the buggers went out of business yesterday, so all the research I put in before preferring it over the GoPro was a total waste) and the side to side field captured is quite large. Indeed it brings so much into picture that there's a slight fish eye aspect on playback.

I used to put it on my helmet but much prefer now to mount it on the bars. I get a much more consistent result (the bars move less than my head) and don't really lose anything in the span of the scene captured. All I really lost was the occasional sight of my hands on the bars. I suppose the one thing a bar mounted cam might lose over a helmet mounted one is evidence that you were looking behind you, but as I mainly use it to record occasional pretty rides rather than as a security measure, I'm not pushed about that.

You could of course get both types of mount and decide where to mount it based on your objective on the day i.e. going up the Connor Pass - put it on the bars, going through the centre of town, on your head.

Damn, the Roam was what I had in mind and all! That's a good idea about having two mounts to switch between, though the prices for the official pieces of plastic are insane. What I like about the idea of having it attached to the helmet is being able to look directly at what I want to record, but aside from frequent glances over the shoulder, having it mounted at the bars would probably cover 90% of what I'd want to be recording anyway. I suppose another option would be to pick up two Roams (roughly the cost of a new GoPro), and have one on the bars at the front, and one further back on the frame angled between the rear and the middle of the road; but that's getting into real overkill territory I think :pac: Might make for some interesting footage though!

dogsears

hueylewis wrote: »

Damn, the Roam was what I had in mind and all!

No doubt you can still get them and they might even drop in price now, but I wouldn't hold out much hope for aftersales etc.

Rew

Just spotted Action Cameras are doing a sale including Contour but the deals don't look that good:

https://www.actioncameras.co.uk/sale-special-offers

hueylewis

Rew wrote: »

Just spotted Action Cameras are doing a sale including Contour but the deals don't look that good:

https://www.actioncameras.co.uk/sale-special-offers

Thanks for that, but yeah, looks like it'll be cheaper to just buy a previous generation Contour Roam. Hopefully the prices will keep going down.

GreyEagle

I’m mulling over getting a bike cam as well.
A colleague recommended a Dogcam, see http://www.dogcamsport.co.uk/dogcam-bullet-hd-2.html for all the info. The advantages of this one seems to be HD quality and ruggedness. But seems a bit dear at Stg£200 plus postage.

beauf

I've been thinking of something cheap and cheerful.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=QppW_0_DuiE&feature=c4-overview-vl&list=PL9AE23A7F0C9FDC91

blahblah06

I've been using the contour roam 2
I've a helmet mount and a frame mount.
Quality is amazing.
Bought mine on amazon via flubit
Bit heavy and you do look like an arse with it on your helmet and its quite heavy.
I tend to use it on the frame but it makes more sense to be on your head as it sees everything you look at. Unlike the frame it's just straight ahead
One bad thing also is that the memory doesn't overwrite itself so once full the camera stops and needs a reformat
ContourROAM2 Handsfree HD Action Camera - Black (5MP, Still Photo Sensor)
http://amazon.co.uk/dp/B009CN8VRK

£134.99

I got it for 125

aFlabbyPanda

beauf wrote: »

I've been thinking of something cheap and cheerful.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=QppW_0_DuiE&feature=c4-overview-vl&list=PL9AE23A7F0C9FDC91

I was going to order the 808 but this looks a better option.

Which is the better placement, helmet or bars?

dogsears

BrianjG wrote: »

I was going to order the 808 but this looks a better option.

Which is the better placement, helmet or bars?

That's up to you man. What do you want?

Helmet mounted is more jerky cos of all the head moving but that might be better if you ever want to show your footage to gards. Otherwise I prefer bar mounted for a steady shot.

tfrancer

dogsears wrote: »

Not so sure it would. I have a Contour Roam (course the buggers went out of business yesterday, so all the research I put in before preferring it over the GoPro was a total waste) and the side to side field captured is quite large. Indeed it brings so much into picture that there's a slight fish eye aspect on playback.

I used to put it on my helmet but much prefer now to mount it on the bars. I get a much more consistent result (the bars move less than my head) and don't really lose anything in the span of the scene captured. All I really lost was the occasional sight of my hands on the bars. I suppose the one thing a bar mounted cam might lose over a helmet mounted one is evidence that you were looking behind you, but as I mainly use it to record occasional pretty rides rather than as a security measure, I'm not pushed about that.
.

I bought a Contour Roam 2 recently and I am very pleased with it. I have used it for recording rides while on holiday in France. But I found that if there were a lot of people around, I switched it off as I felt that I should not be filming people without their permission.

There was a link here to an article in the UK Independent which suggested that cyclists using cameras antagonised motorists leading to distrust and an overall lowering of road safety.

Is it acceptable for individual cyclists or car-owners to install cameras for the explicit purpose of monitoring the behaviour of other road-users?

Yes, we are constantly being filmed on CCTV in shops, on buses etc but we implicitly give our permission for this in the interest of security.

enas

tfrancer wrote: »

There was a link here to an article in the UK Independent which suggested that cyclists using cameras antagonised motorists leading to distrust and an overall lowering of road safety.

Anything that allows someone (here, the bad motorist) to blame someone else (especially cyclists) for their own bad behaviour is good to take. Why not, we've heard worse arguments.

tfrancer wrote: »

Is it acceptable for individual cyclists or car-owners to install cameras for the explicit purpose of monitoring the behaviour of other road-users?

Yes, we are constantly being filmed on CCTV in shops, on buses etc but we implicitly give our permission for this in the interest of security.

This has been covered gazillions of times before, but I believe that when on a public place, there's not expectation of privacy, therefore your consent is not needed in order to be filmed. Besides, I'd say the issue arises mainly when you want to publish the footage (make it public). As long as you're just showing to yourself a footage of what you've seen anyway, I don't see what's wrong, whether legally or morally. Of course, you might decide not to make public footage with recognisable features, such as faces or number plates, but that's out of courtesy and entirely up to you -- although that would be very understandable.

tfrancer

enas wrote: »

Anything that allows someone (here, the bad motorist) to blame someone else (especially cyclists) for their own bad behaviour is good to take. Why not, we've heard worse arguments.



This has been covered gazillions of times before, but I believe that when on a public place, there's not expectation of privacy, therefore your consent is not needed in order to be filmed. Besides, I'd say the issue arises mainly when you want to publish the footage (make it public). As long as you're just showing to yourself a footage of what you've seen anyway, I don't see what's wrong, whether legally or morally. .

I would have misgivings about footage of, for example, women and children who were filmed without their permission. As a cyclist or motorist I think that I should be able to proceed lawfully along the road without being filmed by some individual.

GreyEagle

I bought the SVC200 after seeing a review by Techmoan, http://www.techmoan.com/
Took it out today for the first spin and I'm really pleased with the quality. Plenty of mounting options too.

It's got a Nokia sized battery: Li-ion BL-Sc 3 7V 1050mAh 3.885Wh
Can I use a standard Nokia battery in the camera as a spare without causing any damage to the camera?

Alanstrainor

Yup.

CramCycle

dogsears wrote: »

I used to put it on my helmet but much prefer now to mount it on the bars. I get a much more consistent result (the bars move less than my head) and don't really lose anything in the span of the scene captured.

dogsears wrote: »

Helmet mounted is more jerky cos of all the head moving but that might be better if you ever want to show your footage to gards. Otherwise I prefer bar mounted for a steady shot.

Helmet mounted cam should be less jerky, particularly in Ireland, due ot the road quality, your body absorbs the vibration. As said, it is also IMO more useful as it looks at what you look at, in terms of both security and scenery, it is what I opt for.

tfrancer wrote: »

I bought a Contour Roam 2 ...
There was a link here to an article in the UK Independent which suggested that cyclists using cameras antagonised motorists leading to distrust and an overall lowering of road safety.

Got one too, great camera, i have thoughht that motorists here give more leeway if they cop the camera before they react, I also find the red light on the front great at night as it seems to act as a warning signal that they are being recorded (pure conjecture).

Is it acceptable for individual cyclists or car-owners to install cameras for the explicit purpose of monitoring the behaviour of other road-users?

Have no idea, you can do it for research, so I suppose it is possible so long as you don't publish faces without permission.

No Pants

Aldi catalogue this week has a helmet mounted HD camera, available from Thursday, for €99. It's part of their ski gear offering. I'm not getting one and I'm offering no opinion as to it's suitability or performance.

Unknown Soldier

I have a couple of those 808 yokes and they are quite good. Use one in the car from time to time. Never did get around to making a bracket to attach one to the bike though.

I bought the following yoke in one of the Amazon lightning deals during last week. It should strap on with the kit I already use for a torch like light, it actually looks identical to the light. The light came with one of those fitting kits with the rubber band type thing going on.

http://www.amazon.co.uk/exec/obidos/ASIN/B005PK5J74/ref=ox_ya_os_product

Should get it during the week. I'll try an post a sample of it later during the week so people can judge it for themselves.


[EDIT] Light fitting kit example added https://www.aldi.ie/en/specialbuys/thursday-26th-september/products-detail-page/ps/p/front-and-rear-led-bicycle-light-set/

GreyEagle

Got the SVC200 up and running at last. Here are some sample videos on YouTube, two on the bike and one mounted on a tripod for comparison. Note the slight bounce on the first clip due to the uneven surface.

Short clip on the busy R 132, handlebar mount
http://youtu.be/KP5AIUGFPlE

Laytown, camera mounted on front fork
http://youtu.be/5UsLfrhguf8

Belfast to Dublin express passing Laytown (tripod mount)
http://youtu.be/iXvkZlw3GU8

cdaly_

Nice bounce removal in the first clip. Is that software that came with the camera or what?

GreyEagle

cdaly_ wrote: »

Nice bounce removal in the first clip. Is that software that came with the camera or what?

YouTube suggested that the clip could be optimised. I accepted their offer and the results did seem better, although they do chop down the image quality somewhat.

The files I uploaded are enormous. A one minute clip is about 178Mb in size and looks really good quality HD on the laptop.

Alanstrainor

That youtube auto stabiliser butchers videos, gives them this wavy sea sick inducing look.

And word to the wise, be careful with mounting it on forks. That's how my last cam bit the dust. Mount came loose through a rough surface and it went into the spokes and I annihilated the yoke! Still works mine, but the screen on it does not.

idiottje

BUMP - Sorry for the bump. I am thinking of getting a Helmet mounted bullet cam for the security thing also. Has anyone found that dirvers react diffrently if they see the Camera? Visual deterent thing? A Knobster/Knobette will always be one, but for the rest of the drivers does it have an effect? I know when I see one on a cyclist when driving, I am aware that they can be recording, but as a cyclist also, I always tend to give plenty of room.

GreyEagle

Went out for a spin today to mark the New Year. Hit some floods on the Piltown road near Bettystown, just under the railway bridge. Flood depth did not reach the bottom bracket but I had to pedal to get through so the feet got a little wet to say the least.

See: http://youtu.be/-95Xm3RPHe4

I had the cam in it's waterproof case which accounts for some of the bounce. I'm designing a fix which should cure that.

Alanstrainor

idiottje wrote: »

BUMP - Sorry for the bump. I am thinking of getting a Helmet mounted bullet cam for the security thing also. Has anyone found that dirvers react diffrently if they see the Camera? Visual deterent thing? A Knobster/Knobette will always be one, but for the rest of the drivers does it have an effect? I know when I see one on a cyclist when driving, I am aware that they can be recording, but as a cyclist also, I always tend to give plenty of room.

Just saw this now, I find I do notice a difference to be honest, even if its just someone paying a half seconds worth of attention then that's all the difference.

gman2k

GreyEagle wrote: »

Got the SVC200 up and running at last.] quote]
Where did you get the svc200? Seem out of stock everywhere!

GreyEagle

gman2k wrote: »

Where did you get the svc200? Seem out of stock everywhere!

I got mine from Handtec.co.uk but they seem to have switched to GoPro now. Techmoan.com, who does the reviews, usually has a list of stockists.

GreyEagle

It's been a month since I started using the cam and today I had my first encounter. See http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=frv0zcJ8D1s

I do not have an exact measure but I thought this one was rather close.

beauf

Yeah no need for that at all, especially at speed.

couerdelion

GreyEagle wrote: »

It's been a month since I started using the cam and today I had my first encounter. See http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=frv0zcJ8D1s

I do not have an exact measure but I thought this one was rather close.

Seems to be a regular occurance on roads with solid white lines. I'm not sure if some car drivers think that they aren't allowed to cross them or try not to. I usually position myself further out so they have to break the line to overtake and that way they seem to give more room.