How it MUST be in this situation

arcius

Hi
Please see the attached picture. This is Belgard road and n81 junction in Tallaght Dublin 24.
My friends instructor told her to do as in the picture no one, but then examiner told her that version two is right.
Here is the question:
Can somebody explain in which picture rules were not breached? Which lane cars 1 and 2 must take? Is this right to say that car no 1 must get into lane "b" and car no 2 must get into lane "c"? Or the right version is that car 1 MUST choose ONLY lane "a" and then later only change the lane. And the car no 2 MUST get into lane "b" and then only change lanes if needed? Or maybe there are some other versions?? How it should be in this situation?

stimpson

You should always keep left except when overtaking, so I'd say the instructor is in the wrong here.

arcius

stimpson wrote: »

You should always keep left except when overtaking, so I'd say the instructor is in the wrong here.

Thanks for that. That's what I said as well. But there is another thing... rules of the road state: Turning left from a minor road to a major road .... 5) If a left-turn slip lane is provided, you SHOULD use it...
But "should" doesn't mean "must". Also it is not clear which lane car no 2 MUST use...

stimpson

arcius wrote: »

Thanks for that. That's what I said as well. But there is another thing... rules of the road state: Turning left from a minor road to a major road .... 5) If a left-turn slip lane is provided, you SHOULD use it...
But "should" doesn't mean "must". Also it is not clear which lane car no 2 MUST use...

Should/must - you're splitting hairs.

Car no 2 should keep left also, which is the middle lane as the leftmost lane is occupied.

Marks Motoring

The second picture is correct.

HurtLocker

2nd picture.

The driver in right lane has immediate access to B and C if clear
Driver in left lane should stay in furthest left lane while entering new road and can then change lane if necessary and when safe. The busier the traffic the longer that will take for it to be safe generally though you could get a break in traffic. Remember it is illegal to pass a car on the left (undertake).

J_R

arcius wrote: »

Hi
Please see the attached picture. This is Belgard road and n81 junction in Tallaght Dublin 24.
My friends instructor told her to do as in the picture no one, but then examiner told her that version two is right.
Here is the question:
Can somebody explain in which picture rules were not breached? Which lane cars 1 and 2 must take? Is this right to say that car no 1 must get into lane "b" and car no 2 must get into lane "c"? Or the right version is that car 1 MUST choose ONLY lane "a" and then later only change the lane. And the car no 2 MUST get into lane "b" and then only change lanes if needed? Or maybe there are some other versions?? How it should be in this situation?

Hi,

would it not depend on the directions given by the examiner as to what direction he wants you to take at the following junction ?. Am unfamiliar with the area but I think the next junction would come under the heading " a short distance ahead", if so, then on approach to the Belgard and n81 junction does the examiner not give the driver double directions. ?

That is "At the next junction I want you to turn left, then left again at the following junction. ?
If so, then it would be 1 - A.

"Left and straight on" or just a simple "Left" , then
1 - B

Left and then right
2 - C.. ?

In all the cases above the driver should go directly to that lane

If the examiner only gives a single direction "Turn left", then 1 and again directly to B

So, what directions did the examiner give your friend. ?

munchkin_utd

Marks Motoring wrote: »

The second picture is correct.

+1

I remember my instructor giving me similar instructions as HE KNEW the lane merges up ahead and wanted me to anticipate these in advance.
Its very confusing for the poor learner driver I must say.

nuttlys

J_R wrote: »

That is "At the next junction I want you to turn left, then left again at the following junction. ?
If so, then it would be 1 - A.

"Left and straight on" or just a simple "Left" , then
1 - B

Left and then right
2 - C.. ?

technically 1 & 2 are both turning left. The main issue here is that if you went directly from 1 -> B you would be crossing lanes and could cause a crash. Regardless of the examiners directions and whether you start in 1 or 2, I don't think they would mark a fault as long as you could change lanes A, B or C correctly & safely after (I'm assuming here there are no signs before 1&2 which state otherwise).

arcius

munchkin_utd wrote: »

+1

I remember my instructor giving me similar instructions as HE KNEW the lane merges up ahead and wanted me to anticipate these in advance.
Its very confusing for the poor learner driver I must say.

Well what if your instructor didn t know the road. This is the main thing. It shouldn't be like ''I know this lane will merge to the other'' simply because it will be a lot of situations where you will not know the road so you must know what to do in situation like this. So I d say (and the way would be in my country) picture 2 is the right one.

DriversEd

picture 2 is correct, but as there are broken lines on all lanes, other traffic, and their intentions and your are the real considerations, and your decisions are what the examiner will be looking at, mainly!

J_R

arcius wrote: »

Hi
Please see the attached picture. This is Belgard road and n81 junction in Tallaght Dublin 24.
My friends instructor told her to do as in the picture no one, but then examiner told her that version two is right.
Here is the question:
Can somebody explain in which picture rules were not breached? Which lane cars 1 and 2 must take? Is this right to say that car no 1 must get into lane "b" and car no 2 must get into lane "c"? Or the right version is that car 1 MUST choose ONLY lane "a" and then later only change the lane. And the car no 2 MUST get into lane "b" and then only change lanes if needed? Or maybe there are some other versions?? How it should be in this situation?

Hi,

Technically, both photos are wrong. Car 2 in both photos cross a continuous white line. But on Google sttreet view it appears that this is normal practice.

See :-

My previous answer was also wrong as I assumed lane A was a normal driving lane - not a slip road. (There is no continuos line/hatch markings to mark the end of a slip road). But Google street view shows it turns into a hard shoulder.

See this view :-

My opinion. If going straight ahead or left, take up position Car 1. If turning right then Car 2.

Now, strictly obeying the road markings, both cars should share lane A until they pass the white line. :eek: :eek: Then Car 2 gets into lane C as soon as possible. Car 1 to get into lane B as soon as possible. If there is no car in lane 2 then car 1 immediately after clearing the white line. changes to lane B.

The road markings are atrocious. Any instructor operating in that area should seek clarification from the RSA supervisor as to how to navigate that junction. It may be quite acceptable to cross the continuous white line. Also if in lane A and due to heavy traffic impossible to get into lane B it may also be acceptable to continue on using the hard shoulder.

arcius wrote: »

Thanks for that. That's what I said as well. But there is another thing... rules of the road state: Turning left from a minor road to a major road .... 5) If a left-turn slip lane is provided, you SHOULD use it...
But "should" doesn't mean "must". Also it is not clear which lane car no 2 MUST use...

Hi,

That is for the benefit of the drivers who instead of driving onto the slip road, stop at the entrance of the junction and wait there for their lane to clear, . Stopping at the entrance blocks the road/junctions behind them. But it is unnecessary to use a slip road if it is possible to join the lane you want immediately.