Driver of the race: Round 10 - Hungarian Grand Prix

frostie500

Who was the driver of the day in Hungary?

11811

Romain Grosjean

Kimi for me, great drive and result considering where he started from and a great display of defensive driving against Vettel.

zom

11811 wrote: »

Kimi for me, great drive and result considering where he started from and a great display of defensive driving against Vettel.

Me too - I always thought they're friends, but no friends on the grid ;-)!!

vectra

Nico Rosberg

Was going to go for Kimi but to be fair and respectful I gave it to Roman. He was brilliant and unfairly punished.

He got a drive through for making the track longer and Alonso get a puny fine for illegal use of drs. What a crock of crap.

Donnelly117

Nico Hulkenberg

vectra wrote: »

Was going to go for Kimi but to be fair and respectful I gave it to Roman. He was brilliant and unfairly punished.

He got a drive through for making the track longer and Alonso get a puny fine for illegal use of drs. What a crock of crap.

Defiantly, and he got a 20 second penalty too. There's a serious lack of consistency in the stewards at every race.

11811

Romain Grosjean

vectra wrote: »

Was going to go for Kimi but to be fair and respectful I gave it to Roman. He was brilliant and unfairly punished.

He got a drive through for making the track longer and Alonso get a puny fine for illegal use of drs. What a crock of crap.

Was also considering Roman, just that lapse of concentration with Button let him down. Other than that Roman drove a great race. In fairness to the guy he's improving greatly.

Yeah the stewards are so inconsistent its not funny.

Slutmonkey57b

Nico Hulkenberg

How are the stewards inconsistent? He went off the track to pass someone, gained an advantage, and didn't give the place back. Same punishment was handed out to vettel last year.

He clearly chopped across the front of button, caused a collision, and then cut the chicane.

In both cases, it was his own fault, and in both cases he deserved the penalty.

In Alonso's case, the stewards actually looked at the maths involved and made a decision that while there was a breach, it was due to a technical problem and didn't punish the driver because he didn't gain an advantage in the end. They applied a similar get-out to Grosjean about the splitter the day before.

flazio

Nico Hulkenberg

I'm voting, along with the silent majority, for Lewis. He pulled off a great strategy, passed Webber straight out of the pits, and just drove consistently.

Slutmonkey57b

Nico Hulkenberg

Driver of the day...

Grosjean drove quickly but haphazardly as usual. Kimi got 2nd because of strategy, and would have been beaten by his teammate if not for the mistakes. Hamilton drove well but a pole-to-flag victory is always boring to watch. Vettel could and should have done better, the lack of top speed killed him.

I liked button's defence against vettel/grosjean/alonso but while it was good driving it wasn't exactly thrilling.

Hamilton, I suppose.

NobodyImportant

Romain Grosjean

Button was a close 2nd. Raikonnen for sure.

Grosjeans penalty for passing Massa was a joke. He took on a bold pass, made it stick, used road that people use in both quali/race (although not for passing) and got stung for it. Massa was happy with the move. If Grosjean had stayed more to his left there would have been a collision. So he was damned if he did, damned if he didnt. So he shouldnt have made the move? Just pulled back and waited for Massa to pit? "If you no longer go for a gap, you are no longer a racing driver".

But then he should have gotten a small penatly for the button incident.

Slutmonkey57b

Nico Hulkenberg

That senna quote was a load of balls then, and it's a load of balls now. The whole context was a world champion asking him why he crashed so much.

Knowing what is a gap you can go for, and what is a gap you can't, was a question Senna wasn't able to answer in that interview, something which always tends to get glossed over when people parrot it.

If Grosjean couldn't get past without going off the track, then it wasn't a legitimate pass in the first place. If the circuit boundaries don't need to be respected, what is the point in defining a track at all?

vectra

Nico Rosberg

Slutmonkey57b wrote: »

That senna quote was a load of balls then, and it's a load of balls now. The whole context was a world champion asking him why he crashed so much.

Knowing what is a gap you can go for, and what is a gap you can't, was a question Senna wasn't able to answer in that interview, something which always tends to get glossed over when people parrot it.

If Grosjean couldn't get past without going off the track, then it wasn't a legitimate pass in the first place. If the circuit boundaries don't need to be respected, what is the point in defining a track at all?

I would imagine he had more than enough room to complete the pass had Massa gave him room.

As it happens Massa had no issue with him passing him there.

Was I imagining things or did Hamilton complete a clean pass in that exact corner?

Going forward...

Nico Hulkenberg

I gave it to Lewis. Getting pole and being on the clean side of the track and his ability to quickly pass after pitting whereas Vettel couldn't do either were key to his victory. Fouth win at Hungry too for him, equaling Schumacher.

Kimi's positioning to ward off Seb at the end and his tyre management was great too.

Cookie_Monster

Nico Rosberg

LIGHTNING wrote: »

So why bother even have a white line on the track in that case? The rule is simple to stop people abusing it. Otherwise why bother taking a chicane, just straight line it to pass people. If there was a wall just after the curb he wouldn't have had it.

So why only punish it when overtaking. Vettel notably ran well wide when behind someone, Button? No penalty, several other drivers did the same. Still gained an advantage, just because they didn't physically gain or keep a place it's ignored. Same in quali several times. Completely inconsistent.

lolie

Nico Hulkenberg

Went with lewis, faultless race and no messing about with his overtakes. Looks in a different class to rosberg lately.
Feel a bit for grosean, looks like he understeered over the white line but why the fcuk did it take so long to give him the penalty.
Surely the stewards or the team should have told him to give the place back as it was fairly obvious what would happen.

Slutmonkey57b

Nico Hulkenberg

Cookie_Monster wrote: »

So why only punish it when overtaking. Vettel notably ran well wide when behind someone, Button? No penalty, several other drivers did the same. Still gained an advantage, just because they didn't physically gain or keep a place it's ignored. Same in quali several times. Completely inconsistent.

I would agree that drivers shouldn't be allowed to get away with ignoring track limits during the race, but it doesn't follow that the stewards are inconsistent.

There is a very clear precedent:
Drift over the line slightly during a racing lap = no penalty.
Ignore the track limits egregiously or repeatedly = reprimand followed by penalty, or penalty depending on the offense.
Overtake offline, or cut the track to get past = penalty, unless you give the place back.

You could argue the famous Kimi/Hamilton incident was inconsistent, because they ignored Lewis giving the place back, but not this one, I'm afraid.

the culture of deference

LIGHTNING wrote: »

So why bother even have a white line on the track in that case? The rule is simple to stop people abusing it. Otherwise why bother taking a chicane, just straight line it to pass people. If there was a wall just after the curb he wouldn't have had it.

He would have made it, he avoided Massa.
it was a great move

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=SGaIyBtiAos

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=FmZ9oKXXHHQ



Ant Davidson shows the move on the skypad. look at vettels pass around the same corner, his could be argued against.

Slutmonkey57b

Nico Hulkenberg

He quite clearly followed a constant line around the outside of Massa.

Massa did not deviate from the racing line.

At no point did Massa "move over" on him.

The move was only possible if he went off track. Either that, or he got far enough ahead early enough in the corner to force Massa to take a different line. He didn't do so, and had to go off track to complete the move.

Did you see a similar incident, which could have been punished, but wasn't picked up by the stewards?

That's possible evidence that the stewards missed something. Not that this move was legitimate.

the culture of deference

Slutmonkey57b wrote: »

He quite clearly followed a constant line around the outside of Massa.

Massa did not deviate from the racing line.

At no point did Massa "move over" on him.

The move was only possible if he went off track. Either that, or he got far enough ahead early enough in the corner to force Massa to take a different line. He didn't do so, and had to go off track to complete the move.

Did you see a similar incident, which could have been punished, but wasn't picked up by the stewards?

That's possible evidence that the stewards missed something. Not that this move was legitimate.

Vettels OT is about 1 inch to the left of Grosjeans, he partially touches the line, the skypad review shows exactly where massa was.

Slutmonkey57b

Nico Hulkenberg

the culture of deference wrote: »

Vettels OT is about 1 inch to the left of Grosjeans, he partially touches the line, the skypad review shows exactly where massa was.

Vettel not being punished for the same offense does not make this move suddenly legitimate.

NobodyImportant

Romain Grosjean

Stewards need to be very careful to avoid any sort of racing. Passing should only be done safely within the DRS zone. We wouldnt want a race to break out.