New PC build for development

smacl

So my trusty old precision workstation died again today, and while I'm hoping for one more resurrection, it's time to bite the bullet and build a successor. This PC will be for C++ development and working with lots of large datasets (typical input file 5-100GB). Needs lots of memory, lots of storage, some fast storage, and a fast processor. High end graphics not needed, but must be reliable enough to run unattended for days on end.

So for the boilerplate

1. What is your budget? [<2000]
2. What will be the main purpose of the computer? [Software development, running large spatial models]
3. Do you need a copy of Windows? [No]
4. Can you use any parts from an old computer? [Old monitors]
5. Do you need a monitor? [No]
6. Do you need any of these peripherals? [Keyboard/Mouse]
7. Are you willing to try overclocking? [No]
8. How can you pay? [Credit Card]
9. When are you purchasing? [Next week]
10. If you need help building it, where are you based? [No help needed]

Current build plan is looking like this

Item|Price
Sabertooth 990FX AM3+ AMD 990FX SB950 DDR3 ATX TUF R2.0|€129.21
FX8-8350 AM3+ 4.0GHz processor 16MB 125W|€150.77
32GB (4 x 8GB) Vengeance LP 1600MHz RAM|€216.68
GeForce GT 640 901MHz 2GB|€70.66
240GB Extreme II SATA 6GB/s 2.5" 7mm SSD|€157.87
2x1TB SSHD SATA 6GB/s 64MB 9.5mm HD|€180.76
TX850 V2 850W EnthusiastSeries|€93.56
Carbide Series 300R Gaming Case|€63.19
BH16LS38.AUAU10B 16x SATA Internal BDRW Bare + Software|€69.28
Air Series AF140 Quiet Edition (Single Pack)|€15.53
Air Series AF120 Quiet Edition (Double Pack)|€23.45
Wireless Desktop 800 for Business|€19.69
1TB Touro Mobile MX3 USB 3.0 2.5" Portable Hard Drive|€51.53


Shipping|€10.09
Total (ex VAT)|€1,252.27

I think I've got pretty much everything I need, and price seems pretty good. Have I missed anything? I'll be putting Windows 7 64 Enterprise on, which I have plenty of licenses for, along with a crate load of MS and 3rd party dev tools.

Monotype

Considering the budget, you could consider an i7 if the software you use benefit directly from hyperthreading. If not, then AMD might do just as well.

Hybrid drives are ideal for systems that don't have SSDs, but lose their value when you don't have system files etc., that you use regularly. Also, that a laptop one, so the HDD part is going to be slower than regular desktop ones. I'd just get a regular drive.
http://www.dabs4work.ie/products/wd-1tb-blue-sata-6gb-s-7200rpm-64mb-3-5--hard-drive-8757.html

You absolutely do not need an 850W PSU. Half that would be plenty. If it's something that's going to be on a lot, I'd go for high efficiency.
Platinum efficiency 450W:
http://www.dabs4work.ie/products/antec-ea-450-platinum-8282.html
Spec page - http://store.antec.com/Product/power_supply-earthwatts/EA-450-PLATINUM/0-761345-27450-0%20%20.aspx

Take a look at homeplugs as well instead of wireless.

raymix

Someone just posted in bargain thread:
FX-8320 €126,2 (£108.94)

http://www.amazon.co.uk/AMD-FX8320-Edition-4-0GHz-Socket/dp/B009O7YU56/ref=sr_1_1?ie=UTF8&qid=1374860219&sr=8-1&keywords=fx+8320

If you are going to use air cooling, you'll have hard time getting past 4.5Ghz on fx-8350 anyway. 8320 is the same chip, only that it requires little extra volts for the same clock. Depends on what you are after, ofcourse.

Since you are not overclocking, another viable option is Intel Xeon E3-1230v2, it is almost the same chip as i7-2600, and on stock it should in theory outperform fx-8350.

smacl

Monotype wrote: »

Considering the budget, you could consider an i7 if the software you use benefit directly from hyperthreading. If not, then AMD might do just as well.

I looked at i7 but for a similar spec on paper they came out quite a bite more expensive than AMD. My experience to date of hyperthreading is that two actual cores run faster than one core split as two hyperthreaded ones, so the i7 would need to be > 4 core to compete with the AMD.

Hybrid drives are ideal for systems that don't have SSDs, but lose their value when you don't have system files etc., that you use regularly. Also, that a laptop one, so the HDD part is going to be slower than regular desktop ones. I'd just get a regular drive.
http://www.dabs4work.ie/products/wd-1tb-blue-sata-6gb-s-7200rpm-64mb-3-5--hard-drive-8757.html

Fair point, I had some bad experiences with WD drives a while back, and have found the Seagate SSHDs very reliable. Probably not a great choice for this system. Might go for a pair of Seagate barracudas instead, possibly mirrored via RAID 1 for reliability.

You absolutely do not need an 850W PSU. Half that would be plenty. If it's something that's going to be on a lot, I'd go for high efficiency.
Platinum efficiency 450W:
http://www.dabs4work.ie/products/antec-ea-450-platinum-8282.html
Spec page - http://store.antec.com/Product/power_supply-earthwatts/EA-450-PLATINUM/0-761345-27450-0%20%20.aspx

Ok, 450w antec PSU it is.

Take a look at homeplugs as well instead of wireless.

The wireless is just keyboard/mouse, not a network.

Thanks for the feedback

Monotype

Re: The wireless. Oops. Dabs went down when I was in the middle of seeing what each part was so I couldn't check the last few items. Took a guess that it was a wireless card.

You could save a bit going for a cheaper motherboard if you're not going to use all those extras such as slots for multiple graphics cards.
http://www.dabs4work.ie/products/asus-m5a97-r2-0-am3--amd-970-ddr3-atx-87SZ.html

BloodBath

I assume you are buying from dabs for tax reasons. As mentioned above you should go for a xeon E3 1230v2. Since you aren't overclocking it outperforms those amd processors and uses about half the power. Grab an Asrock b75 pro 3 board to go with it.

It's basically a cheaper i7. The board + cpu combo works out about the same as an 8350 combo and it will outperform it.

http://www.amazon.co.uk/Intel-BX80637E31230V2-Processor-LGA12C-Socket/dp/B0084JTFMI/ref=sr_1_1?s=computers&ie=UTF8&qid=1374893141&sr=1-1&keywords=Intel+Xeon+E3-1230v2&tag=fczbkkcom04-21

smacl

BloodBath wrote: »

I assume you are buying from dabs for tax reasons.

Yep, VAT registered limited company here, and I've used them before and found them prompt and reliable.

As mentioned above you should go for a xeon E3 1230v2. Since you aren't overclocking it outperforms those amd processors and uses about half the power. Grab an Asrock b75 pro 3 board to go with it.

It's basically a cheaper i7. The board + cpu combo works out about the same as an 8350 combo and it will outperform it.

http://www.amazon.co.uk/Intel-BX80637E31230V2-Processor-LGA12C-Socket/dp/B0084JTFMI/ref=sr_1_1?s=computers&ie=UTF8&qid=1374893141&sr=1-1&keywords=Intel+Xeon+E3-1230v2&tag=fczbkkcom04-21

Food for thought ok. Scanning the performance charts, a 3.5gh 4 core i7 seems to outperform a 4ghz 8 core AMD by about 10%. I had initially looked at an i7 3820 @ €234 on an Asus P8Z68-V @ €145 but the extra money didn't seem to buy me signficant additional performance. To be fair, I'm not sure where the bottleneck on this system will be. The main heavy task will be compiling large C++ projects, where 16gb of the ram will be used as a scratch ram drive, and the VS2010 compiler keeping all the cores busy most of the time. A 10-15% theoretical performance gain probably wouldn't be worth much more to me than bragging rights.

Of more interest is that the system can run reliably for extended periods of time (i.e. this PC will rarely get turned off at night, and I'd rather not walk into a blue screen in the morning too often), hence the overspecced PSU, roomy case and plenty of fans. Not sure what went wrong on my Precision workstation this time, but it's already been through a few graphics cards, failed hard drives and a replacement PSU. My feeling is that heat is main cause of failure, as my PCs tend to die more often in the summer. I've had three cases of popped capacitors on Optiplexes recently, also down to a combination of heat / small form factor.

BloodBath

If you want to keep heat levels down and improve reliability grab one of these for the cpu.

The lower power consumption on the xeon also means less heat generated and it doesn't require crazy vrm power from the board meaning it should be more reliable.

smacl

Thanks for the feedback. I've been reading up on air flow design for the new build, and will possibly add some extra cooling once the PC has been running for a few days if it's heating up. Was half thinking of a Corsair hydro H60 if the CPU showed signs of running very hot. Given I'm not overclocking, I'm hoping a reasonably thought out air cooling system in the large case should be ok.

BloodBath

The 212 evo would at the very least match if not outperform that H60 for less than half the price.

smacl

Many thanks for all the feedback, just finished the build and installing Windows 7 right now! While I've taken apart and upgraded many PCs over the years, this is the first computer I've built from all new parts since my ZX81 (nice not to have to take the soldering iron out). First impressions are that the PC is quiet and cool, and the build process was very straightforward. Will post again once its been up and running for a few days

..Brian..

What was your final spec?

smacl

..Brian.. wrote: »

What was your final spec?

Ended up with my original shopping list, as I'd pressed the purchase button before the later replies were in. I've a couple of laptops here that need upgrading, so plan is they'll get the SSHDs, and I'll pick up 4 x Seagate 2TB Barracuda or similar which I can put in a raid 10 organisation for bulk storage & local backup while keeping my SSD for boot, source code and apps. The system gives me temperature feedback, so if I see it getting out of range I'll swap out the AMD heatsink with the 212 evo that Bloodbath linked. I've five fans in addition to CPU, GPU and PSU fans, 2x140mm intake front bottom, 2x130mm exhaust at top, and 1x130mm exhaust back top, so given I'm not overclocking, I'm hoping heat won't be a problem.

If I hadn't been so trigger happy, I possibly would have done better with with an i7 or Xeon build, but I'm still well chuffed with what I've got. I also kind of fancied the AMD / Sabertooth combo for no good reason, other than having been running xeons for the last few years. The 850w cpu was much bigger than needed, but it's in a big case which might end up with more added in future.