Fencing

farmers101

Hi lads,
Have to put up some fences on roadway into my yard and also around the yards! What is the best way fencing it (sheep & cattle)... I am looking for ideas and prices?

flat out !!

Pile of pallets tied together with baler twine is the only job, odd sheet of old galvanised sheeting thrown in too would make it look the part.

loveta

Getting a guy in monday to do a bit of fencing i like sheep with 2 row of barb on top your done with it then i normally use phone line poles as strainers, going to use the octagon posts this time "it for a bog area" so leaving it more expensive but have a 20yr Waranty.
Sheep wire "tornado 8box heavy duty" E1 meter
Strainers E7-10 Post
6'x4" octagon post E6.5 post +vat
200 tinsley barb wire think its round the E30 a roll but not sure exactly


With paying a guy to put it up for me i reckon around the E4.8 a meter, hope this helps

jomoloney

we always 3 foot sheep wire with 2 rows of barbed wire on top

6 foot cresoted posts , 8 ft strainers and turners as required



remember VAT is reclaimable and you may also qualify for the 40% grant

whelan1

used sheep wire and 2 strands of barbed , got hymac driver to put down posts before he left , saved alot of work

Bizzum

whelan1 wrote: »

used sheep wire and 2 strands of barbed , got hymac driver to put down posts before he left , saved alot of work

Where do you buy the used sheepwire?
:-)

Muckit

OR substitute the top barbed strand for electric....... so sheep wire, row of barbed and HT electric on top. Great job for cattle. If they jump that nothing will keep them in!!

Bizzum

Muckit wrote: »

OR substitute the top barbed strand for electric....... so sheep wire, row of barbed and HT electric on top. Great job for cattle. If they jump that nothing will keep them in!!

If you go with this way the cattle won't loosen the top strands scratching. The row of electric will see to that.

paddysdream

loveta wrote: »

Getting a guy in monday to do a bit of fencing i like sheep with 2 row of barb on top your done with it then i normally use phone line poles as strainers, going to use the octagon posts this time "it for a bog area" so leaving it more expensive but have a 20yr Waranty.
Sheep wire "tornado 8box heavy duty" E1 meter
Strainers E7-10 Post
6'x4" octagon post E6.5 post +vat
200 tinsley barb wire think its round the E30 a roll but not sure exactly


With paying a guy to put it up for me i reckon around the E4.8 a meter, hope this helps

All the following is off the top of my head (havent fenced anything for a few months).

Where are you buying strainers for that sort of money?Any 8ft. strainer will be 14 to 16 euro inc. vat.7ft. turning posts are not strainers and wouldnt exactly be the thing if you strain two strands of barbed over sheepwire on them.

Tornado ht. will cost a little more than 1 euro per metre;maybe 1.20 or so.Barbed wire price looks about right.

So at 1.20 (sheepwire) ,30 cent (two barbed) strainers(min.3 per 100 metres) 45 cent ,stakes(1 every 5 yards plus props (4)at say 4 euro for cheaper stake)1.45,staples 5 cent.A lot use a plain ht wire to line the fence and then nail it between the bottom of the sheepwire and the ground(using it would cost maybe 15 cent per metre)

Ignoring the ht plain you are looking at 3.50 approx per metre on a dead straight run for materials.Possibly out a little either way on the prices but not a lot.Factor in a few (slight )bends and you can add in a few strainers or turners.Doesnt take a major bend to require a bit more than a 6ft. stake.
I know (from bitter experience!!)

Good luck if you can get someone in to drive stakes and help wire it for 1.30 per metre.Personally would look at 3 euro per metre labour as a min. charge(postdriver ,tractor ,2 men) for sheep plus barbed.
Costing it to myself ie on my own farm without help would you do 100 meters a day ??1.5 per metre so without costing diesel wear and tear tools etc.

All above is assuming its done half right ie strainers propped(correctly), sheepwire tied off half right(proper c**t of a job,hate it with a passion!)
barbed strained no more that 50/60 metre a go etc etc

whelan1

Bizzum wrote: »

Where do you buy the used sheepwire?
:-)

actually did use used sheepwire:D was from when gas pipeline had their temporary fencing up along the pipeline they left it here after

loveta

paddysdream wrote: »

All the following is off the top of my head (havent fenced anything for a few months).

Where are you buying strainers for that sort of money?Any 8ft. strainer will be 14 to 16 euro inc. vat.7ft. turning posts are not strainers and wouldnt exactly be the thing if you strain two strands of barbed over sheepwire on them.

Tornado ht. will cost a little more than 1 euro per metre;maybe 1.20 or so.Barbed wire price looks about right.

So at 1.20 (sheepwire) ,30 cent (two barbed) strainers(min.3 per 100 metres) 45 cent ,stakes(1 every 5 yards plus props (4)at say 4 euro for cheaper stake)1.45,staples 5 cent.A lot use a plain ht wire to line the fence and then nail it between the bottom of the sheepwire and the ground(using it would cost maybe 15 cent per metre)




Ignoring the ht plain you are looking at 3.50 approx per metre on a dead straight run for materials.Possibly out a little either way on the prices but not a lot.Factor in a few (slight )bends and you can add in a few strainers or turners.Doesnt take a major bend to require a bit more than a 6ft. stake.
I know (from bitter experience!!)

Good luck if you can get someone in to drive stakes and help wire it for 1.30 per metre.Personally would look at 3 euro per metre labour as a min. charge(postdriver ,tractor ,2 men) for sheep plus barbed.
Costing it to myself ie on my own farm without help would you do 100 meters a day ??1.5 per metre so without costing diesel wear and tear tools etc.

All above is assuming its done half right ie strainers propped(correctly), sheepwire tied off half right(proper c**t of a job,hate it with a passion!)
barbed strained no more that 50/60 metre a go etc etc

"USED phone line poles" for strainers not much better out there 20 euros each some you get 2 strainers out of "11' each" some poles are over 24' ya get 3 strainers.wire is actually 104 a 100m roll but i left it at the round 100:) have a 1000m to do and have the material got and my fence guy who i am using for about 10-15 years looked at it 4-5 days work for two of them at E240 a day cheque, hope this explains my sums but tight for time here so got to go.

max12

loveta wrote: »

"USED phone line poles" for strainers not much better out there 20 euros each some you get 2 strainers out of "11' each" some poles are over 24' ya get 3 strainers.wire is actually 104 a 100m roll but i left it at the round 100:) have a 1000m to do and have the material got and my fence guy who i am using for about 10-15 years looked at it 4-5 days work for two of them at E240 a day cheque, hope this explains my sums but tight for time here so got to go.

where can ya buy the used phone line poles.........

paddysdream

Sorry missed the used pole bit.Best strainer you can get.Still dont think ht sheepwire down to 100 euro inc.vat but admit havent priced it in a while.
If fencer supplying two men plus tractor and postdriver for that sort of money then not a lot if anything in it for him.

jomoloney

whelan1 wrote: »

used sheep wire and 2 strands of barbed , got hymac driver to put down posts before he left , saved alot of work

hymac will only work on good soil or soft ground, saw the fellow next door making a dog's boll$% of an expensive fence using a digger

paddysdream

jomoloney wrote: »

hymac will only work on good soil or soft ground, saw the fellow next door making a dog's boll$% of an expensive fence using a digger

Thats spot on.Quiet difficult to drive strainers or stakes PROPERLY with a track machine.Only use it if impossible to get near with a post driver and even at that it aint easy to get them straight. One press and they could end up crooked.

Maybe I am too fussy but why go to all the bother of getting good materials and ending up erecting a fence that looks like it was thrown up in the dark.

Lashing down here so have lots of time to reply!!!

ps missed the bit where you said two strainers from an 11 ft. pole.This bit I can assure you is plain wrong.Anyone straining 2 barbed plus sheepwire from a 5 and a half ft. strainer either aint telling the truth or has never fenced in their life.In good ground with a properly propped 8ft. strainer ,have seen them pull with the top strand of barbed.Also can twist if not propped in line with pull.All the above is assuming its strained right.Was in a field Monday where I put up a fence about 5 years ago and you could still play a tune on the wire it was still nice and tight.

td5man

jomoloney wrote: »

hymac will only work on good soil or soft ground, saw the fellow next door making a dog's boll$% of an expensive fence using a digger

Suppose it was the drivers fault as usual

whelan1

we are not all fortunate enough to have a post driver, given the option of belting down 40 odd posts with a sledge hammer or getting the hymac driver to do it , which would you pick, ours worked out well

jomoloney

td5man wrote: »

Suppose it was the drivers fault as usual

not really,

we have used a 14 ton digger in past to drive posts,


no way would we attempt to drive turners or strainers on the home farm with anything except a p/ driver

on some of the out farm we could drive them with a lump hammer :o

td5man

jomoloney wrote: »

not really,

we have used a 14 ton digger in past to drive posts,


no way would we attempt to drive turners or strainers on the home farm with anything except a p/ driver

on some of the out farm we could drive them with a lump hammer :o

Have to drive some today id say theyd go down 20' without hitting a stone

paddysdream

td5man wrote: »

Suppose it was the drivers fault as usual

Wouldnt think so ,very difficult to do even for an experienced driver.

paddysdream

whelan1 wrote: »

we are not all fortunate enough to have a post driver, given the option of belting down 40 odd posts with a sledge hammer or getting the hymac driver to do it , which would you pick, ours worked out well

Front loader bucket? few taps for a stake and few extra for strainers.Not pretty but have done it myself.

49801

I got some PDM posts lately from a fencing contractor and got a lad we casually use who had access to a knocker.

5ft stakes 3.50-3.60 each
7ft strainer ~15euro each

Posts certaily look the part. Just wish the 5ft's were not so skinny but was not prepared to pay the extra for the thicker 5ft's

John_F

anyone give light on the best wood out there, used tannolised posts here a few years back and rotten already, most of them now cracked and replaced, then there are posts here 25 years and should be replaced.... but :rolleyes: they are doing the job. spec of timber and preservative varies a large amount

loveta

John_F wrote: »

anyone give light on the best wood out there, used tannolised posts here a few years back and rotten already, most of them now cracked and replaced, then there are posts here 25 years and should be replaced.... but :rolleyes: they are doing the job. spec of timber and preservative varies a large amount

Could not agree more native timber well the stuff they use in posts grows to fast and is not dried well enough to soak the tannolise and it is usually the scrap they use to which only adds to the problem. I hear guys on about larch being good but have never used it there was oak posts on a bog i am fencing at the moment they were up easy 50 years but id say you could not probaly get them now:(

gazahayes

There was a crowd at the forestry show back a few months ago selling stuff to paint on the bottom of the stakes to stop them rotting and breaking called tuffdip I think cost about 70 cent per stake as far as I can remember. Think its a liquid bitumin? That dries hard.
http://tuffdip.ie/prices.php
Found it. Think you'd need to have the stakes dry enough before to stop them splitting and letting in moisture.

loveta

paddysdream wrote: »

Thats spot on.Quiet difficult to drive strainers or stakes PROPERLY with a track machine.Only use it if impossible to get near with a post driver and even at that it aint easy to get them straight. One press and they could end up crooked.

Maybe I am too fussy but why go to all the bother of getting good materials and ending up erecting a fence that looks like it was thrown up in the dark.

Lashing down here so have lots of time to reply!!!

ps missed the bit where you said two strainers from an 11 ft. pole.This bit I can assure you is plain wrong.Anyone straining 2 barbed plus sheepwire from a 5 and a half ft. strainer either aint telling the truth or has never fenced in their life.In good ground with a properly propped 8ft. strainer ,have seen them pull with the top strand of barbed.Also can twist if not propped in line with pull.All the above is assuming its strained right.Was in a field Monday where I put up a fence about 5 years ago and you could still play a tune on the wire it was still nice and tight.

No you misread my post 2 strain ers from some poles leaving them 11 foot EACH. . . because 7 foot like you said won't take the strain and esp in the bog ground even with props and or tie backs

tabby aspreme

If there is a small sawmill nearby they may have oak or larch stakes, if not Graiguecullen sawmills sell them and have oak strainer posts also

49801

John_F wrote: »

anyone give light on the best wood out there, used tannolised posts here a few years back and rotten already, most of them now cracked and replaced, then there are posts here 25 years and should be replaced.... but :rolleyes: they are doing the job. spec of timber and preservative varies a large amount

It is not an easy one really. I was delighted when i discovered there was a local contractor with access to the 'pdm' posts. They are made with proper creosote and when I was hammering in staples you could see the creosote was full depth. They are the same crowd who treat the esb poles up in kildare.

I used a pair of those gripy gardening gloves to handle them. Unfortunately they got wet and I used them again. My hands were 'sun burnt' from the chemicals on the back of my hands. So be careful!

A cheap option would be to buy the cheap tantilised posts. leave them dry out and then treat them yourself in barrells of burnt oil. mixing the burnt oil with creostoe 50:50 not a bad idea. Fierce messy and long lead time (mths). Those tough tips dont sound that expensive now!!!

delaval

John_F wrote: »

anyone give light on the best wood out there, used tannolised posts here a few years back and rotten already, most of them now cracked and replaced, then there are posts here 25 years and should be replaced.... but :rolleyes: they are doing the job. spec of timber and preservative varies a large amount

Oak or Larch.
I'd go for pdm, failing that Griffith Timber Paulstown KK do really good tanilised stakes. Their dipped are not good crack when dry

Birtles

got treated posts for crowd in Cork. think we paid €5 a post for 5 ft. properly treated and imported from Germany. (Think Timber is Larch) I have them in the same line as Treated posts sourced from local Co-op and there is a big difference. Co-op posts are looking weathered and faded and others are black and fresh looking. cut a few to check depth of treatment and Ger posts were well impregnated compared to Co-Op posts.

Re: Wire loosening or pulling posts, IMO you can over tighten wire when there is no need. We use a gauge to show tension on the wire fitted to the Hayes tightener.

49801

Birtles wrote: »

Re: Wire loosening or pulling posts, IMO you can over tighten wire when there is no need. We use a gauge to show tension on the wire fitted to the Hayes tightener.

I agree with you there.
Plenty fellas go out on a nice hot day in the summer and tighten their wires as hard as they can possibly muster.... Then come winter in the frosts the wire will naturally contract. Come next summer the lad is out tightening his wires again. Does not take long to start snapping wires.

paddysdream

49801 wrote: »

I agree with you there.
Plenty fellas go out on a nice hot day in the summer and tighten their wires as hard as they can possibly muster.... Then come winter in the frosts the wire will naturally contract. Come next summer the lad is out tightening his wires again. Does not take long to start snapping wires.

Everything naturally contracts in the cold weather !!

On a more serious note,tight wire is the only way to ensure a fence is properly stockproof.Havent got a tension meter but after a few years you get the hang of how tight it should be.Have on occasion had to stop tensioning barbed cause any more was just gonna loosen something else.

If you use proper strainers and ,very importantly,prop them in line with the pull plus use strainers on ALL the bends ,then you should have no probs. with a fence loosening under normal circumstances.

Hard to explain properly but basically you should try to keep all pulls as straight as possible.Pulling wire around bends doesnt work that well plus it can grip on the post and either do one of 3 things;
Pull the post in or out of line
Twist it in the ground
stretch the wire(esp. using chainlink.)

Also tying off the wire correctly after double stapling the ends will ensure that even if it does slip thru. the staples it can only loosen (evenly) very very little.
By the way assuming ye are all using ht. wire and not that mild steel sh**e.
Never used mild steel sheepwire on a fence,only to block a gap in the ditch at home but have seen the difference with barbed wire.For example sometimes a farmer will say ;Arra have a roll of barbed in the shed ,why not use it for one strand to get it outa the way (and hope to save a few quid!).Go back 6 months later and the ht. is still singing whilst the mild steel is starting to sag a wee bit.Much more difficult to strain it plus will give back over time.
Despite what many people think,ht. wire is not any more difficult to use.Once you have a jenny its a doddle with plain.Barbed;no difference in handling whilst sheepwire is a pig no matter what you use.Will admit tying off insulators or sheepwire aint that easy with ht. but doesnt take that long to get the hang of it once you see how its done(good gloves essential;seen lots of "hardy" lads trying it barehanded and are soon looking for the handwarwers


Obv. no need to strut posts for ht. electric and a sometimes you will get away without props for barbed wire only.
Two strands of barbed over sheepwire will test the best of strainers.

iverjohnston

If I can, I try and strain the top row first, to try and prevent slackening the lower rows, at the top one has more leverage.

Also a pair of 18inch bolt cutters are great for cutting high tensile wire, you can cut Staples to release a row of wire also.

Bodacious

paddysdream wrote: »

Everything naturally contracts in the cold weather !!

On a more serious note,tight wire is the only way to ensure a fence is properly stockproof.Havent got a tension meter but after a few years you get the hang of how tight it should be.Have on occasion had to stop tensioning barbed cause any more was just gonna loosen something else.

If you use proper strainers and ,very importantly,prop them in line with the pull plus use strainers on ALL the bends ,then you should have no probs. with a fence loosening under normal circumstances.

Hard to explain properly but basically you should try to keep all pulls as straight as possible.Pulling wire around bends doesnt work that well plus it can grip on the post and either do one of 3 things;
Pull the post in or out of line
Twist it in the ground
stretch the wire(esp. using chainlink.)

Also tying off the wire correctly after double stapling the ends will ensure that even if it does slip thru. the staples it can only loosen (evenly) very very little.
By the way assuming ye are all using ht. wire and not that mild steel sh**e.
Never used mild steel sheepwire on a fence,only to block a gap in the ditch at home but have seen the difference with barbed wire.For example sometimes a farmer will say ;Arra have a roll of barbed in the shed ,why not use it for one strand to get it outa the way (and hope to save a few quid!).Go back 6 months later and the ht. is still singing whilst the mild steel is starting to sag a wee bit.Much more difficult to strain it plus will give back over time.
Despite what many people think,ht. wire is not any more difficult to use.Once you have a jenny its a doddle with plain.Barbed;no difference in handling whilst sheepwire is a pig no matter what you use.Will admit tying off insulators or sheepwire aint that easy with ht. but doesnt take that long to get the hang of it once you see how its done(good gloves essential;seen lots of "hardy" lads trying it barehanded and are soon looking for the handwarwers


Obv. no need to strut posts for ht. electric and a sometimes you will get away without props for barbed wire only.
Two strands of barbed over sheepwire will test the best of strainers.

I'll post a picture if I can but I put in new fencing this year.. 6ft rounds and 3ft tinsley green sheep wire with same green barbed overhead and one row for strength in middle of sheep wire.

proper stays and 8ft corner strainers and ive used the gripples on the sheep wire.. great job

also attached small bit of bull wire to connect barbed to reel ratchet system to tighten barbed with a spanner if necessary

steely

Lads,I just was wondering what is the best way exactly to fence about 500m.It is going to be a boundry fence between my land and the neighbours.At the moment I have cattle,however I may get some sheep in time to come so would like to future proof it.What length of posts would I require.Would anybody know an approximate cost for a fencing contractor as I don't want to be taken for a ride.
Thanks in advance

KatyMac

I had an awkward 400/450m fence to do with barbed and sheep wire. Contractor has to use a chainsaw to clear alot of places. He was charging €2 per meter for the actual putting up of the fence and I was to provide wire, posts etc. It hasn't been done yet (had to wait until we could cut down a couple of trees in season), but I think the whole lot will cost approx €1,500 depending on where I get the materials

paddysdream

steely wrote: »

Lads,I just was wondering what is the best way exactly to fence about 500m.It is going to be a boundry fence between my land and the neighbours.At the moment I have cattle,however I may get some sheep in time to come so would like to future proof it.What length of posts would I require.Would anybody know an approximate cost for a fencing contractor as I don't want to be taken for a ride.
Thanks in advance

What lenght is a piece of string?

As regards a stockproof fence for both cattle and sheep then its hard to beat two strands of barbed wire over sheepwire or replace one of the barbed strands with a strand of electric.Otherwise you could leave the 2 barbed strands and put the electric on one side.
5 strands of electrified plain will work for cattle and sheep and would be cheaper but;
(a) more maintaince ie keeping the grass burned around the bottom
(b)not as good for small lambs
(c)on a bounds ditch who would supply the leccy?

5 strands of barbed would also work fine.Personal preference is for the sheepwire.
On a bounds ditch use 6ft 4" to 5" stakes every 4m with strainers every 50m.(assuming its a straight run)
Strain the barbed a max of 50m if you can.

Otherwise you could use concrete posts and wire.Bit more expensive and time consuming to erect but a good job.With cattle be sure to electrify it so they dont rub against the posts(only concrete in the strainers not the regular fencing posts or every time they get a belt or push they are liable to crack or snap)

Cost wise?Hmm are you far from the sunny south east?
Seriously though sheepwire and barbed should be costing you (just priced 900m tonight) about 2.60m materials and the same for labour ie 5.20 plus vat per m.
Concrete posts are ,off the top of my head and could be a mile out ,about 11 euro each
If you look at the tams figures on the dept. website they aint too far out(ok for nice straight standard fences )but even so they are not a bad guide
For eg.
sheepwire and 2 barbed 5.94 per m
sheepwire plus 1 elec. 5.34 per m
Sheepwire plus 1 barbed and 1 elec. 6.15 per m
5 strands elec. 3.80 per m

SuperTeeJay

Hi,does anyone have any expierience of loughwood Octo posts?Have a 1km new pass to fence on one side and want a good fence put up.Have no expierience of fencing.Father only used the cheap posts before.Never last long.I've heard standish posts arn't great so was wondring about the Octo posts.Thanks.

lakill Farm

SuperTeeJay wrote: »

Hi,does anyone have any expierience of loughwood Octo posts?Have a 1km new pass to fence on one side and want a good fence put up.Have no expierience of fencing.Father only used the cheap posts before.Never last long.I've heard standish posts arn't great so was wondring about the Octo posts.Thanks.

I use pdm here. 6 years down. Lots taken up and drove again. 2 replaced but were broken with machinery

SuperTeeJay

6years seems a very short time for posts to be taken up again?

lakill Farm

SuperTeeJay wrote: »

6years seems a very short time for posts to be taken up again?

Changing layouts is all. Nothing to do with the posts or lad who fenced.

Just been changing things

SuperTeeJay

lakill Farm wrote: »

Changing layouts is all. Nothing to do with the posts or lad who fenced.

Just been changing things

Ok sorry, it sounds like they are a good post then.Might check them out so,Thanks.

noelroe

Hi lads, I wanting to do a good bit of fencing here over the next two years or so, about 2500m in total. I qualify for 60% grant for sheep fencing but does this have to be done all in one go or can I apply in stages as that's the way I plan to fence it.
Thanks