Getting into dairy

RedPaddy1990

Ok I don't want to get too detailed but basically after a few years of beef farming i've decide i wanna give dairy a go. I've have a good setup at the moment with a good 60-70 acres of land not renting or likes i've inherited it. I hope to have 50 dairy cows (too much per acre??) but my only problem is is the milking parlor. It is a 12 unit parlor and is a good 10 years old and is not in good working order. I'm looking at two options, fix it up and bring it to working standard (which at a guess would cost about a quarter-half of a new one)or getting a new modern 12 unit parlor. Would it be viable to get the new parlor based on aherd of 50 dairy cows?

Timmaay

Trust me that 10yrs ain't old for a parlour, mine is a 20yrs old 6unit which milks 70 cows comfortably enough now. All the rubbers get changed regularly though, and thats the biggest thing that will effect milk quality. 50cows on 70acres isn't too far off the mark, depending on how productive the land is, and if you plan on raring replacements off that block also. I'd suggest attempting to milk 70 cows on the land in the the future (assuming its good quality land, and after its all reseeded etc), and then either have your heifers contact reared, or rent another bit of land 30acres or so, and rear the heifers on that and use it for silage also. 70cows is very little work extra over 50, and potentially brings you in a good bit extra income. Having said all that, start out slow, it definitely shouldn't be a race to milk 70 ha, starting with 30 is fine and build up numbers as the cash comes in and you learn to manage and grow grass better!

Mulumpy

RedPaddy1990 wrote: »

Ok I don't want to get too detailed but basically after a few years of beef farming i've decide i wanna give dairy a go. I've have a good setup at the moment with a good 60-70 acres of land not renting or likes i've inherited it. I hope to have 50 dairy cows (too much per acre??) but my only problem is is the milking parlor. It is a 12 unit parlor and is a good 10 years old and is not in good working order. I'm looking at two options, fix it up and bring it to working standard (which at a guess would cost about a quarter-half of a new one)or getting a new modern 12 unit parlor. Would it be viable to get the new parlor based on aherd of 50 dairy cows?

Hi Red Paddy. The first thing I would do is get a service technician out to have a look. Is it just the milking machine that is the problem? Id be slow spending too much on a new parlour until cows grazing set up are in place.

RedPaddy1990

Mulumpy wrote: »

Hi Red Paddy. The first thing I would do is get a service technician out to have a look. Is it just the milking machine that is the problem? Id be slow spending too much on a new parlour until cows grazing set up are in place.

Cheers for the replies

My mate and I were looking at it just to get a measure of things the machine itself is completely ****ed, a new tank would also be needed by the looks of things. i'm no expert but my mate knows more about it and he just gave a rough idea of the damage and suggested like you did to get a lad in to check it out. Thats why I came on here to ask should i just go for a new one when nearly most of it is ****ed

RedPaddy1990

Timmaay wrote: »

Trust me that 10yrs ain't old for a parlour, mine is a 20yrs old 6unit which milks 70 cows comfortably enough now. All the rubbers get changed regularly though, and thats the biggest thing that will effect milk quality. 50cows on 70acres isn't too far off the mark, depending on how productive the land is, and if you plan on raring replacements off that block also. I'd suggest attempting to milk 70 cows on the land in the the future (assuming its good quality land, and after its all reseeded etc), and then either have your heifers contact reared, or rent another bit of land 30acres or so, and rear the heifers on that and use it for silage also. 70cows is very little work extra over 50, and potentially brings you in a good bit extra income. Having said all that, start out slow, it definitely shouldn't be a race to milk 70 ha, starting with 30 is fine and build up numbers as the cash comes in and you learn to manage and grow grass better!

Thanks for the info

The land itself is good quality so i'm not too worried on that. My brother and I are both getting into this and we are actually thinking of getting another farm for rearing. I agree it is a good idea to start off small to get a hand of things and know my way around

RedPaddy1990

Just came across this, seems to me a new parlor looks good now

http://www.farmersjournal.ie/site/farming-Dairy-Equipment-Scheme-still-undersubscribed-16857.html

KCTK

RedPaddy1990 wrote: »

Just came across this, seems to me a new parlor looks good now

http://www.farmersjournal.ie/site/farming-Dairy-Equipment-Scheme-still-undersubscribed-16857.html

Hi RedPaddy, do you currently have milk quota? You need at least 50k ltrs before you can apply under the dairy equipment scheme, if you don't have any maybe you can purchase some in the next trading scheme and apply before December closing date (might be new scheme after this date).

Timmaay

There was a very good thread here last week about parlour costs, look back afew pages and you'll fine it, I can't link it on the phone!

Sam Kade

How could a parlour 10 years old be useless

Farmer Pudsey

Sam Kade wrote: »

How could a parlour 10 years old be useless

More than likly it is ten years since cows were milked in it the parlour. Maybe the parlour is way older. Red slow and easy if you can squeeze a grant maybe update however you may be able to fix up what you have. Slow and easy is the way. Get a service technician out to look at it or a dairy farmer that has recently reentered milking. It a good idea to contact such a farmer contact teagasc and they may put you in cintact with one or two new start up's.

Like everything in farming low cost, low cost, low cost.

Sam Kade

RedPaddy1990 wrote: »

Ok I don't want to get too detailed but basically after a few years of beef farming i've decide i wanna give dairy a go. I've have a good setup at the moment with a good 60-70 acres of land not renting or likes i've inherited it. I hope to have 50 dairy cows (too much per acre??) but my only problem is is the milking parlor. It is a 12 unit parlor and is a good 10 years old and is not in good working order. I'm looking at two options, fix it up and bring it to working standard (which at a guess would cost about a quarter-half of a new one)or getting a new modern 12 unit parlor. Would it be viable to get the new parlor based on aherd of 50 dairy cows?

When were cows last milked in the parlour?

grazeaway

RedPaddy1990 wrote: »

Ok I don't want to get too detailed but basically after a few years of beef farming i've decide i wanna give dairy a go. I've have a good setup at the moment with a good 60-70 acres of land not renting or likes i've inherited it. I hope to have 50 dairy cows (too much per acre??) but my only problem is is the milking parlor. It is a 12 unit parlor and is a good 10 years old and is not in good working order. I'm looking at two options, fix it up and bring it to working standard (which at a guess would cost about a quarter-half of a new one)or getting a new modern 12 unit parlor. Would it be viable to get the new parlor based on aherd of 50 dairy cows?

10 years old would still be condisered a modern milking parlour. is it 10 years since it was milked in maybe? how long has it been idle?

if the structure is only 10 years old then it should be in good knic. the rubbers and flexiable pipe can be replaced. if the pump is shagged then a new or Sh one can be got in. Similar with the tank.

Assuming the building is 10 years old then it should be ok from a hygine point just a case just a case of cleaning it up and carryign out any repairs to bring it up to standard.

the 12 unit milker is it 12 at a time or 6 at a time? is it a 6+6 or 12+12. If its 12+12 with 12 milking that plenty big enough for what your planning.

unless the parlour is falling down around your ears and too small and old to work efficently in then there is no need to build a new new one. How are you for housing, slurry storage, soiled water and collecting yards? Getting a friend that is milking at the mo to give it a once over will give you an idea of how much work is required to get it up to scratch for milking in.

i am also assuming the grassland, fencing/paddocks, roadways and water supply are all ok for changing to dairy

RedPaddy1990

grazeaway wrote: »

10 years old would still be condisered a modern milking parlour. is it 10 years since it was milked in maybe? how long has it been idle?

if the structure is only 10 years old then it should be in good knic. the rubbers and flexiable pipe can be replaced. if the pump is shagged then a new or Sh one can be got in. Similar with the tank.

Assuming the building is 10 years old then it should be ok from a hygine point just a case just a case of cleaning it up and carryign out any repairs to bring it up to standard.

the 12 unit milker is it 12 at a time or 6 at a time? is it a 6+6 or 12+12. If its 12+12 with 12 milking that plenty big enough for what your planning.

unless the parlour is falling down around your ears and too small and old to work efficently in then there is no need to build a new new one. How are you for housing, slurry storage, soiled water and collecting yards? Getting a friend that is milking at the mo to give it a once over will give you an idea of how much work is required to get it up to scratch for milking in.

i am also assuming the grassland, fencing/paddocks, roadways and water supply are all ok for changing to dairy

sorry i wasn't too detailed it is 6units to each side the parlor hasn't been used in 10 years i'm not sure but i would i say it is 15-20years old i'll have to have a look into it it isn't in the best shape

regards housing etc. a shed was built 7 yrs ago and can house up to 50 cows it also has a slurry pit

the fencing/paddocks etc. were all recently done up so i'm not worried at that

as for the grant i'm looking into that to see if it can help

Farmer Pudsey

A 12 unit parlour would mean if you expanded longterm to 70 cows you would have to do 6 runs. However for a 48 cow herd it would be 4 runs not sure in the scheme of thing how long a run of cows take is it around 15 minutes if so an hour + gathering for 50 cows and 1.5 hours for 70 cows. Is the parlour in a place that it can be expanded to a 14 or 16 unit longterm. I be inclined to se if it is possible to get it working for reasonable money

Timmaay

Fire up a photo of the parlour and we'll be able to give some idea if its salvageable.

grazeaway

RedPaddy1990 wrote: »

sorry i wasn't too detailed it is 6units to each side the parlor hasn't been used in 10 years i'm not sure but i would i say it is 15-20years old i'll have to have a look into it it isn't in the best shape

regards housing etc. a shed was built 7 yrs ago and can house up to 50 cows it also has a slurry pit

the fencing/paddocks etc. were all recently done up so i'm not worried at that

as for the grant i'm looking into that to see if it can help

that changes things a bit alright. we have an old parlour my dad built new in 1980 stopped milking in it abou 10 years ago but the basic structure is perfectly usable. if i wanted to get backinto milkign it wouldnt take much to get it back into working order but i would to re-wire it, and do a bit of work in briinging the tank room up to standard for hygine but nothing major either. milking frame is 8X8 but would need to repaired in places where the galv has been eaten away.

the big thing for me in getting it up and running would be putting in a new/SH milking machine, pipes, hoses, jars, clusters and pump plus a tank aswell. Also the collection yard is not covered and the waste used to flow into a open slurry tank that was demolished a few years ago so all that would need to be done aswell. I have an ajioning shed with a tank but that would proably be too small. This the major thing that would stop me getting back into cows as the extra capital i would need to provide extra slurry/washings storage as well as roofing the collection yard would probably cost too much as i would need to employ a relief milker as well.

like the lads say can you make the parlour longer to put in more cows?

mf240

Farmer Pudsey wrote: »

A 12 unit parlour would mean if you expanded longterm to 70 cows you would have to do 6 runs. However for a 48 cow herd it would be 4 runs not sure in the scheme of thing how long a run of cows take is it around 15 minutes if so an hour + gathering for 50 cows and 1.5 hours for 70 cows. Is the parlour in a place that it can be expanded to a 14 or 16 unit longterm. I be inclined to se if it is possible to get it working for reasonable money

7 rows an hour , brining in and washing up taking out after that.

Farmer Pudsey

mf240 wrote: »

7 rows an hour , brining in and washing up taking out after that.

is that 7 rows by 6 or is it 7 runs through the parlour of 12 cowsa a time.

Sam Kade

Farmer Pudsey wrote: »

is that 7 rows by 6 or is it 7 runs through the parlour of 12 cowsa a time.

About 7-10 minutes for every row, a row is one side 42 cows with a 7 unit parlour is 6 rows.

Timmaay

Got the cows milked in just over an hour this evening, 12 rows in total, so just over 5mins each row. Not that I'm happy with how quick that was ha, they were all back on milk today, have been budgeting grass too tight, had to bump up the meal to 4kg, and feeding them bales from now on also

farmers101

Interesting post,, I'm a sheep/ beef farmer with an interest in dairying!! What is the approx profit cow/week/ annually?

Timmaay

10cent/litre is a reasonable profit margin, assume the cow milks on average 5000L a year (quite a conservative figure!), but anyways thats about 500quid a year. Milk price volatility, and how efficient you will result in huge swings in that 10cent/litre figure, can ranged from a loss to up to 15cent/litre, maybe more!

Sam Kade

farmers101 wrote: »

Interesting post,, I'm a sheep/ beef farmer with an interest in dairying!! What is the approx profit cow/week/ annually?

With spring calving it could be April May before you would see a milk cheque and the cheque will stop around Nov Dec. That's 5-6 months without a cheque :eek:

Timmaay

Sam Kade wrote: »

With spring calving it could be April May before you would see a milk cheque and the cheque will stop around Nov Dec. That's 5-6 months without a cheque :eek:

Cows dont milk for long up your way sam, if you are going 6months without a milk cheque We are about 80:20 spring:autumn, so fairly seasonal, but I always fine that cashflow tightens up the most this time of the year, big bills like silage etc swallow up money quick, the back end of the year is usually ok.

Sam Kade

Timmaay wrote: »

Cows dont milk for long up your way sam, if you are going 6months without a milk cheque We are about 80:20 spring:autumn, so fairly seasonal, but I always fine that cashflow tightens up the most this time of the year, big bills like silage etc swallow up money quick, the back end of the year is usually ok.

I have yet to see a cow that will go into hibernation during the winter and milk on fresh air It's a long time since I was milking.

F.D

Timmaay wrote: »

10cent/litre is a reasonable profit margin, assume the cow milks on average 5000L a year (quite a conservative figure!), but anyways thats about 500quid a year. Milk price volatility, and how efficient you will result in huge swings in that 10cent/litre figure, can ranged from a loss to up to 15cent/litre, maybe more!

I'd say most non dairy farmers would be happy with even 250 profit a head and a calf to sell, compared to beef cattle or sucklers and having to have an off farm job to support it !!