Need a woman's opinion

LegacyUser

There has been flirtation between myself and this girl for a bit now and I know things will progress as they should but the problem is any time we meet up she drinks a bit too much and I have a rule about drunk people: if you're not sober enough to hold a conversation I've no interest. It doesn't matter if you're some guy looking for a fight or some girl looking for the ride. I won't entertain anyone off their tree.

When asked by her friends why I haven't made my move I explained myself. The problem is that got back to her and now she's pretty mad. It's somewhat understandable, I guess she sees it as me judging her (I'm not, it's a rule I've had for years and stand by) and is on the defensive. I don't drink myself but I understand some people do need a bit of social lubrication, that's fair enough, but this she goes OTT in my opinion.

I'm going to raise the issue with her I just need a woman's opinion on how to address it. Assuming she feels like I'm being a patronising asshole or feels like I've embarrassed her in front of her friends how do you think I should go about talking to her?

I will have an opportunity to sort it out in the coming days so any and all ideas are welcome.

(Also, please no "if she needs to get wasted to get confident she's not worth it" stuff. I want this and it will happen. I just need to make sure it happens on my terms.)

blatantrereg

I'm male but I think you should acknowledge male perspectives on this too.. She probably doesn't like you discussing your relationship with other people, fledgling though it may be.
A acknowledgement that it was something you shouldn't have done, and simple apology would be best. I would avoid taking an apologetic position or looking for ways of making things up to her. You can establish undesirable dynamics in a relationship with things like that early on. She shouldn't be getting stociously drunk every time you go on a date anyway.

Czarcasm

soberflirt wrote: »

(Also, please no "if she needs to get wasted to get confident she's not worth it" stuff. I want this and it will happen. I just need to make sure it happens on my terms.)

You ARE judging her though OP. You want her to change to suit you, and after her hearing how you judge her already, I'd say you have a snowballs chance in hell of making it happen, much less on "your terms".

If you don't like her drinking, then don't waste your time and her time and move on.

Lorna123

Maybe she is nervous/excited when she is with you and takes the drink as an excuse to let herself go. This could be a temporary thing until she gets to know you better. You could tell her when she is sober that she is so much nicer. Also, tell her that you do not like having sex with a woman who has taken too much drink as you would feel that she might think you are taking advantage and that she needs to be reasonably sober for this to happen. You can also tell her that in your opinion it is much more romantic to know that a woman is fully aware of what is happening when you both indulge in sex and not have one person not fully aware because of too much drink. Tell her you don't find intoxicated women attractive and it puts you off.

I don't see anything wrong with you being put off her when she is drunk. It is quite understandable. She has to see that, but tell her when she is sober.

CommanderC

You say you have no interest in someone who drinks like that......but you clearly do otherwise you would not be pursuing her in this manner.

I think if you don't like the way she is then leave her alone.

You already said that she has heard about your reasons for not making a move, so she knows the score.

If you are out again and she drinks as she wishes, then she obviously has no interest in changing herself for the sake of a relationship with you.

If she is doesn't drink as much, she may be willing to compromise.

I don't think there is a need for a chat.

And the comment you made about things being 'on your terms'.....that's not how relationships work. Things can't be on your terms when there are two people involved.

oh and you are absolutely 100% judging her based on how much she drinks. I'm not saying she should care, but, be honest with yourself at least in this regard.

Colonel Panic

You know, you don't have to broadcast your principles to everyone. You could've just said you wanted to ask her out on a proper date rather than just let things happen at some group outing in the pub.

So you can still fix it by calling her, backtracking a bit and ask her out.

StillWaters

I think it was rude and out of order to discuss her drinking with her friends. I'd be furious if I were her to be made gossip fodder of.
I wouldn't be so sure you can sort this out with her.

Legs.Eleven

Do you think she's going to stop drinking like that just because you want her to?


It's her choice as an adult, so it's up to you if you want to see someone like that or not.

You don't really have any right to dictate to her how much she should drink, so either you learn to live with it or not.

blatantrereg

Sleeping with someone who is too drunk to have a conversation would be pretty much date rape territory, since they wouldn't be able to give informed consent. Ignore the bizarre responses accusing you of being judgemental for demonstrating basic decency.

Esoteric_

I'd tear somebody apart if they discussed my drinking habits in a derogatory manner behind my back, to be blunt, OP.

It's perfectly fine to not want to sleep with a drunk person, and that's an admirable quality. They way you're going about it is completely wrong, though.

You can't have it on YOUR terms. It has to be on BOTH of your terms. If you can't deal with her when she's drunk, as her to go for coffee some day, rather than go to a pub at night. If you want to talk to her about her drinking, go ahead by all means, but don't expect her to hang around long after.

You could always just say that you like her, but don't want to be sexually involved when the person is drunk, you prefer when both people are relatively sober, so can ye arrange to go for dinner or something some night instead of the pub.

Tbh though, sounds like you may have blown it by talking behind her back like that. The 'I want this and it will happen, I just want to make sure it's on my terms' line is kind of scary, OP. It comes across as extremely controlling. 'It will happen?' What if she's decided now that actually, it won't? Why your terms? Why can't it be on an equal footing?

kiffer

OP.
I know where you are coming from...
As a guy I've always been told not to take advantage of drunk women, and as a nondrinker till I was about 30 I had no understanding of levels of non-sobriety (from an internal point of view)... so once a girl was tipsy I wasn't going to touch her lest I be taking advantage of her drunken state...
This even applied within longterm relationships.
...
I have three questions for you.
1. Is/was she actually interested in you?
2. Is she fall down drunk or just too drunk according to an arbitrary limit you've set?
3. Why have you not made a move earlier in the evening before she passes the "now she's too drunk" limit?

3DataModem

1. "I have a rule..."
2. "...on my terms"
3. Making it her issue, not your hangup

You sound like quite a catch. I imagine she'll steer well clear.

Meauldsegosha

What are "your terms" OP? Do you want her to stop drinking when on a night out? Are you aware she may not accept your terms?

Czarcasm

blatantrereg wrote: »

Sleeping with someone who is too drunk to have a conversation would be pretty much date rape territory, since they wouldn't be able to give informed consent. Ignore the bizarre responses accusing you of being judgemental for demonstrating basic decency.

Nobody suggested the OP sleep with this girl while she's drunk. The OP was talking about having a relationship with her, but before that's even got off the ground, the OP has expressed a dislike of her behaviour and suggested that a relationship will only happen on his terms.

Going behind the girls back and talking about her behaviour to her friends doesn't sound like basic human decency to me at least. The decent thing to have done would've been to talk to the girl herself, that at least would've been giving her a choice.

If the OP was already IN a relationship with this girl and she was drinking to excess, THEN he may have had a point to be concerned, as it would've been his business because her behaviour would be affecting him directly, but as it stands- they're not even off the starting blocks, so it's not any of his business, and while nobody can stop him judging her for it, by that same token, he can't expect that she should pay any heed to his wishes when he goes about expressing them in such a roundabout and cowardly fashion.

Does "It will happen, I just need to make sure it happens on my terms" sound decent to you?

This stage OP best advice I could give you is just leave this girl alone, for her own sake, she's clearly not for you, and given the stunt you just pulled, I have my doubts she'll ever come round to seeing things your way, let alone ever want to go out with you.

coolbeans

Every time you're out she drinks too much?!? Attractive, she sounds quite the catch. I know I'll be slated for this given the tendency for Irish people's frankly bizarre attitudes toward alcohol but she sounds like a bit of an alco to me. If she likes you and can't go out without leaning on the sauce I would consider that a huge problem. Stay away.

coolbeans

And for what's it's worth I don't think you made a big error by telling others what your problem was. Reverse the genders in this case see how attitudes change. Fact is people talk to each other about potential relationships and it'll always come to a head with mates why you didn't make a move. Explaining yourself isn't a sin at all. If you were the one drinking questionably you can be sure as hell that this would hate gotten back to her girlfriends. Instead of taking umbrage this girl should be taking a long hard look at herself and her drinking habits

MagicMarker

I'm curious as to what is "too drunk" when it's coming from the perspective of a non drinker.

Czarcasm

MagicMarker wrote: »

I'm curious as to what is "too drunk" when it's coming from the perspective of a non drinker.

It's an interesting conundrum that presents itself, because in the OP's own words, they only meet up when they're out, and that's when she gets drunk, and that's when she flirts with the OP. I wonder is the OP perhaps reading into something that isn't there at all?

I just don't get how the OP can say he is turned off by her drinking, yet wants to start a relationship with her, but will only start a relationship with her when she stops drinking.

It's as if the OP has already taken it for granted that this girl wants a relationship with him just because she flirts with him when she's drunk.

Lorna123

So you only discussed your reasons for not making a move when you were asked, so in my book that's fair enough. If she has an issue with this all you have to say is that you were asked a question and you answered it. Why wouldn't she be mad at her friends for asking the question in the first place. It is none of their business. I think that the answer you gave is pretty much a decent answer and nothing to regret. If she thinks that you were out of order discussing her with her friends, all you have to say is that they brought up the subject first and you were just being honest. After that if she wants to drink too much then don't bother with her. You did nothing wrong.

Aseth

MagicMarker wrote: »

I'm curious as to what is "too drunk" when it's coming from the perspective of a non drinker.

I would also ad that different ppl have different alcohol tolerance. Is she really drinking that much or maybe the alcohol affects her much faster? For example I can get tipsy after drinking a small glass of wine.

Also after learning someone discussed my drinking habits with my friends I'd be mortified! And definitely would not go out with someone who wants to decide what I can or cannot do even before we went on a date!!
However we are only guessing here OP, you can always try asking her friends if she was talking about you and what was her opinion of you.

CommanderC

blatantrereg wrote: »

Sleeping with someone who is too drunk to have a conversation would be pretty much date rape territory, since they wouldn't be able to give informed consent. Ignore the bizarre responses accusing you of being judgemental for demonstrating basic decency.

Who suggested he sleep with her while she's drunk ?

CommanderC

coolbeans wrote: »

And for what's it's worth I don't think you made a big error by telling others what your problem was. Reverse the genders in this case see how attitudes change. Fact is people talk to each other about potential relationships and it'll always come to a head with mates why you didn't make a move. Explaining yourself isn't a sin at all. If you were the one drinking questionably you can be sure as hell that this would hate gotten back to her girlfriends. Instead of taking umbrage this girl should be taking a long hard look at herself and her drinking habits

Or she could just get on with her life, unaffected by the personal opinion of the OP

ash23

If you like her then why on earth didn't you ask her out on a date rather than waiting for some night where she isn't drinking to make a move?

You've handled this all wrong OP. If you'd asked her to meet you for lunch....if you'd said "I'm going to make a move because i do like her but I'm waiting for the right time" when her friends asked you the question.....so many opportunities to have handled this far better.
I'm not sure you have a chance to fix this now. She is most likely feeling embarrassed, angry and rejected. I would imagine that hearing that you discussed her in this way with other people will have put her right off you to be honest.
If I were you I'd apologise to her and try to put it in context. But I wouldn't be overly optimistic about it.

As an aside, you come across as quite arrogant in your post. It may be just a badly worded post but you might need to tone it down when talking to her. Saying "it will happen"....well, it might not. She may have liked you but you made an absolute mess of this opportunity so i wouldn't be quite so confident about her feelings now if I were you.
All you can do is talk to her and apologise and see if she is willing to go on a date.

blatantrereg

Yes ask her on a date. I'd misread the original post, and had assumed you were describing dates in the first place.