Avensis 2004 Diesel not starting

Squatman

Folks,
the brothers i think D4d avensis is not starting for him. the problem started a few weeks back where the car was low on power an spluttering along, until eventually it stopped and wouldnt start again. no fault codes were showing up.
the following work was carried out,

~Diesel injector replaced - old one tested and shown to be fine
- injectors replaced - no change
-fuel pump working
-some dirt was removed from fuel lines
-ECU changed -no impact
- fuel filter changed x2
-no visible leaks
dont know if compression was tested - its with a toyota mech. so i would assume it has been done!

Dont really no what else to try?

If any of you could give any help it would be much appreciated.
Thanks a million

aaakev

So the mechanic decided to change everything you mentioned without diagnosimg the problem first??

Squatman

correct to a certain extent. we changed the ecu out of my other brothers car. but he suggested the fuel pump at €400. which didnt work.
But anyway back on topic, helpful comments only please!;)

bear1

You haven't mentioned the MAF. If fecked enough it will stop the car from starting. Does it even try to start? Alternator? Do any lights come on at all?
I'd find it highly unlikely that if there was a fault then the ECU wouldnt throw it up. More details are needed I'm afraid. Was there smoke pouring out of the car? Was it low on oil? could it rev freely?

Squatman

unfortunately i am a bit vague on the details alright.

Not not smokey, didnt run out of oil. Dont know about the maf but if gone, the car would start to run rich and idle high- an also trigger the engine warning light. i would imagine it was swapped with the other avensis to check but i will have that confirmed.

The car is attempting to start - it is turning over, but not starting.
Not alternator related - all lights come on as they should with no error codes or engine warning lights.

Dont really know about revving freely - i would have to say no, as it was low on power, and very spluttery - hope that helps.

Squatman

bear1 wrote: »

I'd find it highly unlikely that if there was a fault then the ECU wouldnt throw it up.

i would have thought so too - unless bad diesel, but the problem was persisting for a few tanks of diesel before it eventually died!

bear1

How is the fuel pressure from the injection pump? The high pressure one?
The MAF if damaged enough COULD affect the engine starting. Other things could be the EGR valve but I doubt this would stop the engine from starting.
This sounds like a fuel issue to me. Dirty fuel maybe?
Another long shot could be the crank sensor, but this would only affect the car when it is hot and would start again when the engine has cooled down.
One other thing could be the immobiliser isnt disengaging. Does the key light go off while trying to start?

Squatman

bear1 wrote: »

How is the fuel pressure from the injection pump? The high pressure one?
The MAF if damaged enough COULD affect the engine starting. Other things could be the EGR valve but I doubt this would stop the engine from starting.
This sounds like a fuel issue to me. Dirty fuel maybe?
Another long shot could be the crank sensor, but this would only affect the car when it is hot and would start again when the engine has cooled down.
One other thing could be the immobiliser isnt disengaging. Does the key light go off while trying to start?

The maf was swapped with another cars maf, and no difference.
EGR valve was cleaned when he got the car.
The problem persisted for a few tanks of diesel before it stopped, so we dont think it is that. althought he does claim to have cleaned out dirt from fuel lines.
dont know much about the crank sensor, but id assume that it would trigger a warning light?

dont know about the pressure from the injector pump. id be guessing really, but i think he said it was inconsistent, and perhaps a wiring issue? idk?

derry

I had similar problem with my 1993 2l Toyota Carina diesel. If i Parked the car and came back next day the car would not start .
I figured the fuel was flowing back to tank and the pump could not suck the fuel up to the engine .
I got small 1.5 liter bottle 30% filled it with fuel removed the fuel tubing from the diesel filter to the tank and attached the bottle ..Now the fuel was higher than the engine and would flow into the engine Turned the car over for while until fuel got to diesel pump injector and engine started .After 30 second engine running quickly swopped out the bottle feed and connected the tank while engine was running and it could suck the fuel up from the tank .
At night now I open the bonnet and clamp the fuel line so the fuel cant go back into tank overnight .Then the next day or next week whatever start engine and then quickly remove the clamp basically vise grip squashing the fuel tubing .
Sometimes i forget and have to repeat the bottle feed trick . Sometimes for weeks the problem doesn't occur and I dont have to do anything .
My best theory is there is one way valve in the system near or in the fuel pump injector and it gets sticky and stops to be one way
Also it seems to be effected buy the fuel types . Fuel in France and Switzerland didn't seem to give me this problem .However the problem first started in Spain and then when i came back to Spain it showed up again .
I suspect the cheapo diesel I bought from cheapo place in North side Dublin a few years ago had crappy fuel maybe washed and the acid attacked the interior of the diesel pump injectors .
Alternatively some types of diesel fuel especially fuel from Asia tends to very waxy so that might be gumming stuff up .
I know from trade sources that Irish petrol is probably the most crappiest in EU so it wouldn't surprise me if the Irish Diesel was also very crappy
In Spain they sell two types of diesel fuels called gasoil A the cheapo stuff I use and gasoil 10 which they claim gives better MPG .I cant say never used the more expensive diesel I am cheap skate . So there does exist different types of Diesel out there don't ask me whats the difference.
I suspect the main difference is the Paraffin content in better diesel fuel is less . I know one guy in Dublin ran his Toyota Carina on Kerosene for 200,000 miles and it didn't harm the diesel engine .Kerosene is basically 7 parts paraffin 1 part petrol.The MPG will be down compared to diesel but kerosene is dirt cheap but stinks awful .kerosene will burn much hotter so could effect turbo diesl very badly but primitive diesel engines can suck it up . Best I can figure Diesel fuel is some sort of mix of diesel fuel and paraffin and the better diesel fuels are more diesel content in the fuel than the more crappy fuels with higher Paraffin contents . Paraffin fuels tend to very waxxy compared to Diesel fuels

Any very slight leak in the system will stop the pump to pump the fuel from tank.Alternative methods are If you have a way to pressure the tank with high pressure air that will also force fuel up to engine and in some cars filling the tank to full will supply enough head pressure also

good luck

Derry

bear1

Fuel pressure is inconsistent? I think I would head off to a diesel specialist at this point (tow it there) and have the experts in this take a look.
Inconsistent fuel pressure would more than likely be some sort of fuel problem. Quite hard to diagnose a car through the net.
Unfortunately though this is your best bet (specialist)

Squatman

derry wrote: »

I had similar problem with my 1993 2l Toyota Carina diesel. If i Parked the car and came back next day the car would not start .
I figured the fuel was flowing back to tank and the pump could not suck the fuel up to the engine .
I got small 1.5 liter bottle 30% filled it with fuel removed the fuel tubing from the diesel filter to the tank and attached the bottle ..Now the fuel was higher than the engine and would flow into the engine Turned the car over for while until fuel got to diesel pump injector and engine started .After 30 second engine running quickly swopped out the bottle feed and connected the tank while engine was running and it could suck the fuel up from the tank .
At night now I open the bonnet and clamp the fuel line so the fuel cant go back into tank overnight .Then the next day or next week whatever start engine and then quickly remove the clamp basically vise grip squashing the fuel tubing .
Sometimes i forget and have to repeat the bottle feed trick . Sometimes for weeks the problem doesn't occur and I dont have to do anything .
My best theory is there is one way valve in the system near or in the fuel pump injector and it gets sticky and stops to be one way
Also it seems to be effected buy the fuel types . Fuel in France and Switzerland didn't seem to give me this problem .However the problem first started in Spain and then when i came back to Spain it showed up again .
I suspect the cheapo diesel I bought from cheapo place in North side Dublin a few years ago had crappy fuel maybe washed and the acid attacked the interior of the diesel pump injectors .
Alternatively some types of diesel fuel especially fuel from Asia tends to very waxy so that might be gumming stuff up .
I know from trade sources that Irish petrol is probably the most crappiest in EU so it wouldn't surprise me if the Irish Diesel was also very crappy
In Spain they sell two types of diesel fuels called gasoil A the cheapo stuff I use and gasoil 10 which they claim gives better MPG .I cant say never used the more expensive diesel I am cheap skate . So there does exist different types of Diesel out there don't ask me whats the difference.
I suspect the main difference is the Paraffin content in better diesel fuel is less . I know one guy in Dublin ran his Toyota Carina on Kerosene for 200,000 miles and it didn't harm the diesel engine .Kerosene is basically 7 parts paraffin 1 part petrol.The MPG will be down compared to diesel but kerosene is dirt cheap but stinks awful .kerosene will burn much hotter so could effect turbo diesl very badly but primitive diesel engines can suck it up . Best I can figure Diesel fuel is some sort of mix of diesel fuel and paraffin and the better diesel fuels are more diesel content in the fuel than the more crappy fuels with higher Paraffin contents . Paraffin fuels tend to very waxxy compared to Diesel fuels

Any very slight leak in the system will stop the pump to pump the fuel from tank.Alternative methods are If you have a way to pressure the tank with high pressure air that will also force fuel up to engine and in some cars filling the tank to full will supply enough head pressure also

good luck

Derry

Yes, it had been on my mind to try this alright! will do this evening or tomorrow!:cool:

Squatman

Turns out it was just a bad connection to the ECU. - he cleaned off all the contact points and is running perfectly now- with close to 100 miles on the clock to test.:eek: Thanks for all the help

Mods Can close thread.:D