Puppy not pooping & other issues

Lord TSC

So last weekend, I posted my new pup was vomiting at night. Two days later, she had diarrea so brought her to the vet. Said she prob had a stomach bug. Gave me antibiotics and told me to start feeding her rice and chicken.

Since then (Monday), she has only pooped twice, and it's now 27 hours since her last one. She has gotten bloated, and is getting quite aggressive, not in a playful puppy way but in a "I am going to snap and growl at you every time you don't do what I want". She also isn't sleeping right either; she was hyper half the night and barely rests, whereas before she was sick, she would be puppy hyper for 2 hours then sleep for two hours' and sleep most of the night. She is also peeing quite a bit; she went five times in an hour yesterday, and wet her bed(s) a few times, as well as a toy once. It's the opposite of her poop in that I feel she is peeing too often, especially based on how much she is drinking which is very little. I get the aggression and hyperactivity is the fact she doesn't feel well. But it's worrying me how aggressive she is getting.

But I am worried about how bloated she looks now and the lack of pooping. When she did pooped 30 hours ago, it was a rotten wet greeny poop. Do I take her back to the vet in case it's more serious than a little bug? I worry I am letting my inexperience lead here, but as I said, the lack of pooping worries me. Am I ok feeding more when she isn't going either? She is obviously looking for food but I worry bout the lack of pooping

Thanks in advance.

kylith

Yes, take her back to the vet as soon as you can.

andreac

Vet asap.

tk123

It's normal enough for them to be a bit consitpated after they've had the runs and have been on rice and chicken etc. BUT the fact that she's uncomfortable, bloated and grumpy means you need to take her to the vets. A change in character often means something is wrong - which you've realised so you're doing a good job as a new owner!

BRAIN FEEDs

Teamshadowclan wrote: »

So last weekend, I posted my new pup was vomiting at night. Two days later, she had diarrea so brought her to the vet. Said she prob had a stomach bug. Gave me antibiotics and told me to start feeding her rice and chicken.

Since then (Monday), she has only pooped twice, and it's now 27 hours since her last one. She has gotten bloated, and is getting quite aggressive, not in a playful puppy way but in a "I am going to snap and growl at you every time you don't do what I want". She also isn't sleeping right either; she was hyper half the night and barely rests, whereas before she was sick, she would be puppy hyper for 2 hours then sleep for two hours' and sleep most of the night. She is also peeing quite a bit; she went five times in an hour yesterday, and wet her bed(s) a few times, as well as a toy once. It's the opposite of her poop in that I feel she is peeing too often, especially based on how much she is drinking which is very little. I get the aggression and hyperactivity is the fact she doesn't feel well. But it's worrying me how aggressive she is getting.

But I am worried about how bloated she looks now and the lack of pooping. When she did pooped 30 hours ago, it was a rotten wet greeny poop. Do I take her back to the vet in case it's more serious than a little bug? I worry I am letting my inexperience lead here, but as I said, the lack of pooping worries me. Am I ok feeding more when she isn't going either? She is obviously looking for food but I worry bout the lack of pooping

Thanks in advance.

liquid paraffin,try it before going to the vet,€2 from a decent chemist.

Lord TSC

As a quick update, and I mean quick cause I'm feeling really down about how this is going, brought her to the vet. He said he can't see anything wrong with her, and worries that the aggression isn't a medical problem but a neurological one. Over the last week, her character just seems to be getting more and more vicious and aggressive.

I know some people will go "it's a puppy, she's meant to bite and be boisterous", and its hard to put into words. But there's a franticness about her sometimes, and she has been getting more and more aggressive. We've also had a problem where after being on the go for an hour and a half of pure energy and excitement, she flips and starts running laps of the house uncontrollably, attacking everything and anything but with no interest in anything for more than a second, and snaps wildly at everyone who goes near her. It's not a normal puppy energetic flip; it's an uncontrollable rage. She has moments where she's a normal pup, nipping and chewing, but responding to commands and so forth, and she's adorable at that stage. She's have a little nibble of your finger but knows not to go too hard, and when she does and we say "Ow", she stops and resumes normal play. Like a proper pup. But then she goes crazy an hour later.

I had a decent discussion with the vet and he basically said that it could be a case of having a bully-girl personality, in which case we can train it out of her. But he also said he fears it's something worse. He pulled her off the medicine, and gave us a different worming tablet in case there's something wrong with the first one. He said just keep an eye on her and she's due back for second vaccinations in two weeks. But I'm really worried about her now.

EDIT: Oh right, on the original topic, she's pooped 3 times since Tuesday. She's going sometimes but there tends to be 30 hours between poops. On the other hand, she's peeing every 20 minutes when she's awake, and we've caught her three times peeing without her usual squatting, as if she doesn't even realize she's doing it.

andreac

Has she gone to the toilet yet? Did the vet address that issue at all? I would get a second opinion from a diff vets if you aren't happy.

Toulouse

If it were me I'd be getting a second opinion. If you want to post your general location then perhaps someone can recommend a good vet. Do not post up details of your original vet.

When did this illness start, after her vaccination and wormer? Was she fully checked over beforehand?

Get her right physically and then you can worry about any other stuff.

Have you been in contact with the breeder about any of this? Are any of the rest of the litter behaving like her?

borderlinemeath

Teamshadowclan wrote: »

As a quick update, and I mean quick cause I'm feeling really down about how this is going, brought her to the vet. He said he can't see anything wrong with her, and worries that the aggression isn't a medical problem but a neurological one. Over the last week, her character just seems to be getting more and more vicious and aggressive.

I know some people will go "it's a puppy, she's meant to bite and be boisterous", and its hard to put into words. But there's a franticness about her sometimes, and she has been getting more and more aggressive. We've also had a problem where after being on the go for an hour and a half of pure energy and excitement, she flips and starts running laps of the house uncontrollably, attacking everything and anything but with no interest in anything for more than a second, and snaps wildly at everyone who goes near her. It's not a normal puppy energetic flip; it's an uncontrollable rage. She has moments where she's a normal pup, nipping and chewing, but responding to commands and so forth, and she's adorable at that stage. She's have a little nibble of your finger but knows not to go too hard, and when she does and we say "Ow", she stops and resumes normal play. Like a proper pup. But then she goes crazy an hour later.

Does her crazy aggressiveness perhaps come a short time after being fed? If she is then there may be a link to her food. She may be reacting to an ingredient or additive in it. Think child with a bag of skittles and a bottle of coke bouncing off the walls when the suger and E numbers hit.

I had a decent discussion with the vet and he basically said that it could be a case of having a bully-girl personality, in which case we can train it out of her. But he also said he fears it's something worse. He pulled her off the medicine, and gave us a different worming tablet in case there's something wrong with the first one. He said just keep an eye on her and she's due back for second vaccinations in two weeks. But I'm really worried about her now.

Have you spoken to the breeder? Was she one of the more dominant puppies in the litter?
While the vet seems to be giving you lots of different hypothises, how much has he observed of her? I would get her health back on track and perhaps get a qualified behaviourist in to give you a second opinion. Seeing her in action in your home would tell a lot more than a quick visit in a vets surgery where she's out of her environment. Even though she's only been with you for a short time she would have settled to a degree.

EDIT: Oh right, on the original topic, she's pooped 3 times since Tuesday. She's going sometimes but there tends to be 30 hours between poops. On the other hand, she's peeing every 20 minutes when she's awake, and we've caught her three times peeing without her usual squatting, as if she doesn't even realize she's doing it.

At least she's pooing something. And drinking water. She's probably drinking more water because of the heat.

Lord TSC

Borderlinemeath, I have to apologise. I completly forgot to reply to the PMs you sent, and I greatly appreciated them. I just didn't get a chance to reply back, so thanks for them

Its worth noting that the vet I'm using is one that comes highly recommended from multiple sources. And in all due fairness, they've been really friendly and helpful. I'm in Drogheda though. I find that location gets me two recommendations and I'm using one of them.

She just pooped again there and it is looking a bit more normal in terms of shape and colour. So that's something.

We got her vacinated on Monday. She got sick on Sunday. She got a worming table on Monday. Pooping problem started Tuesday and we took her to the vet. Got her the antibiotics and moved her to the chicken and rice diet.

Breeder says there's been no other problems with the other pups. Worried they'd say that regardless though...

Does her crazy aggressiveness perhaps come a short time after being fed? If she is then there may be a link to her food. She may be reacting to an ingredient or additive in it. Think child with a bag of skittles and a bottle of coke bouncing off the walls when the suger and E numbers hit.

No, the craziness starts when she wakes up, not after feeding. She tends to wake up gradually and as more time passes, the "excitement" builds up and up to breaking point. And would that apply when she's been on chicken and rice for the last 4 days?

I should also add...I worry she's peeing more than she's drinking. She'll have a few laps of water and then pee 4 times in an hour.

borderlinemeath

Teamshadowclan wrote: »

Borderlinemeath, I have to apologise. I completly forgot to reply to the PMs you sent, and I greatly appreciated them. I just didn't get a chance to reply back, so thanks for them

No need to apologise at all, you've enough to be dealing with.

Its worth noting that the vet I'm using is one that comes highly recommended from multiple sources. And in all due fairness, they've been really friendly and helpful. I'm in Drogheda though. I find that location gets me two recommendations and I'm using one of them.

She just pooped again there and it is looking a bit more normal in terms of shape and colour. So that's something.

Once it's not watery diarrhea, or bloody then it's on the right track.

We got her vacinated on Monday. She got sick on Sunday. She got a worming table on Monday. Pooping problem started Tuesday and we took her to the vet. Got her the antibiotics and moved her to the chicken and rice diet.

That's an awful lot at the same time. Vaccinations can be tough on a pup, so can worming and while the two can be done together, if she was feeling sickly beforehand then it's not surprising that she had a tough week poo wise.

Breeder says there's been no other problems with the other pups. Worried they'd say that regardless though...

They could be telling the truth, if they haven't heard from any of the other owners, but there's always the worry that they may just be trying to distance themselves.

No, the craziness starts when she wakes up, not after feeding. She tends to wake up gradually and as more time passes, the "excitement" builds up and up to breaking point. And would that apply when she's been on chicken and rice for the last 4 days?

No, chicken and rice is the plainest food, to settle their little stomachs. Any chance you could catch it on a video, so somebody here might shed a bit of light on it?

I should also add...I worry she's peeing more than she's drinking. She'll have a few laps of water and then pee 4 times in an hour.

Did you tell the vet about the excessive peeing? Is there much volume or is it just tiny amounts? Is she in pain, or straining with peeing? She'll have a tiny bladder so hopefully it's just because she's drinking more with the hot weather but worth mentioning to the vet.

Lord TSC

Well, that was a morning

She settled down to bed at midnight after having another aggressive fit. Went to bed, came down at 3 to bring her to the toilet. No problems. Went out, peed, back in, asleep. Perfect.

4 o clock, she starts roaring the house down. I know that basic training is to try and ignore the cries so as not to teach her you will come running, but I can tell the difference between "I wanna play" and "oh ****, oh ****, oh ****!". Went down and found she had peed in her bed. Que 4 and a half hours of franticness. And as I said, it's not a normal puppy franticness. The only way I can describe it is as if she's done cocaine cause it's that craziness. It's scary. It's not a case of not playing with her at night and she'll go back asleep; it's a case of her getting aggressive and destructive with everything. Her heart and breathing is racing, her head can't focus on anything for more than 10 seconds. Even when she "rests", she's got her eyes open and her head darting round.

I tried to keep track of how often she was peeing, but eventually gave up, partly because we were trying to clean it up, partly because it was so often. I think she went 10 times in the space of three hours. And it's not little and often either; it's full puddles, way beyond what she's drinking.

The biggest part, going back to what I said originally, is just how different her character has grown in the last two weeks. For the first week, she was so adorable and playful. She'd mess round with you and then cuddle up to you, letting you stroke her. She was hard work but there was down time and there was the chance to relax. Granted, we couldn't exactly go out for personal days but it wasn't the same level of exhaustion. Now....

We've got two little kids next door and they've asked a few times if they can play with her and mind her for a few hours. As kids do with cute puppies. But I am actually afraid to let her near them. She bites us and gets aggressive with us, but I'd be afraid she'd outright attack the kids. At best, she'd ignore them and attack something in the room.

I worry I come across as a naive first time puppy owner who wasn't expecting the hard work. I worry people read this, roll their eyes and go "What did you expect?". I expected hard work. I expected intensity. But there's no fun right now. There's no play time. There's no relaxing cuddles or bonding of any sort. When she's awake, she is outright scary. And when she's asleep, we're nearly at the stage where we're afraid to wake her up, cause we need the hour's rest ourselves.

kylith

What breed is she? What is she like after these episodes? Is she dazed or confused at all? I ask because I once knew a lady who had a BC with a neurological condition causing her to have bouts of rage, but she seemed to have no idea what she'd done afterward.

I would recommend getting a good behaviourist in.

Lord TSC

She's a Shih Tzu. 10 weeks old. She tends to just go asleep after them, as if she's tired herself out and needs to rest.

tk123

Maybe take a video when she's going mad and post it for opinions? You'll need one anyways if you're going to a behaviourist.

SillyMangoX

I've heard of some breeds that can have something called rage syndrome but have only ever heard of it in badly bred labs and male golden cocker spaniels. The peeing doesnt sound normal though so even before going to a behaviourist I would go to another vet for a second opinion.

ABajaninCork

What's her normal dog food, OP? Apart from the chicken and rice, that is...

Lord TSC

ABajaninCork wrote: »

What's her normal dog food, OP? Apart from the chicken and rice, that is...

She was on pedigree puppy food when we got her. Kept her on that for her first few days with us. The evening before she started to shift her behavior, we started to move her to Burns. But she had maybe two half meals of that, so the vet ruled that one out pretty quickly.

tk123 wrote: »

Maybe take a video when she's going mad and post it for opinions? You'll need one anyways if you're going to a behaviourist.

Yeah, I've got two videos, but I'm trying to make sure they convey the problems. My worry is that a 2 hour aggression fit doesn't work well when reduced to a 60 second clip of her growing and "playing" with toys...

I'll try and get one up later though.

Since this morning, she's had one more energetic bout that lasted two hours. I managed to keep her fairly occupied for the whole time, cycling through toys and games. Near the end though, she always just loses attention completely. She snapped at my hand a few times but there wasn't any circling the rooms and nearly killing herself. On the other hand, she's barely touched her food today and a worming tablet the vet asked me to give her (in case she had a bad dose that was affecting her) is being completely ignored, even when I put it in a nice hidden package with her food.

ABajaninCork

I'd say the Pedigree Puppy isn't helping! It's not the best quality food, and I'd look to get her off that PDQ...

I feed my Shih Tzu Burns. It seems expensive to begin with, but cheap in the long run as you're feeding less of it. Another good small dog food would be James Wellbeloved. Royal Canin was what I used to feed my dog, but found it didn't agree with him. It might for your little girl though. Eukanuba, and Hills are other premium foods, but I've never used them, so have no opinion.

But PLEASE stop feeding her the Pedigree puppy!! It's not good for her...

EDIT: Just read what the vet said about Burns. Which version of the Burns did you give her - Did you give her the puppy version?? I know my fella will only eat the Pork & potato version which is mild on the tums, and he'll eat the chicken and rice and the duck one. He won't touch the lamb! (Although he loves fresh lamb). I think it'll be a case of trial and error to find what suits. But don't give her any more Pedigree!!

username123

Just went back and had a look at your other posts on this pup and I noticed that from the very first night you had her you talk about her getting very "bite-y". So clearly this was something she was doing from the time you got her (and most likely before).

Where did you get the pup from, was it a reputable breeder? It seems suspicious to me that the breeder is claiming all is well when the dog has been doing this from the very first night you took her home.

Lord TSC

ABajaninCork wrote: »

I'd say the Pedigree Puppy isn't helping! It's not the best quality food, and I'd look to get her off that PDQ...

Yeah, it was something I wanted to do quick enough, but at the same time, I didn't want to change it as quick as I could when she arrived. I figured there was already a tone of changes happening that keeping her on the food temporarily at least retained some normality. After the first week though, the plan was to move her to Burns which I started, right before we started developing problems.

username123 wrote: »

Just went back and had a look at your other posts on this pup and I noticed that from the very first night you had her you talk about her getting very "bite-y". So clearly this was something she was doing from the time you got her (and most likely before).

See, this is the problem I worry about. It was a different mentality of biting. In the first week, the biting was a playful puppy biting. It was a "lick lick, nibble nibble, bite bite OW lick lick", you know? It was just seeing her boundries and being playful. She'd be happy and want our attention. Now, the biting is a "Get away from me" biting. There's a real difference between the two styles of biting.

ABajaninCork

Was the breeder IKC registered? Is there any way you could find out if some of her litter mates have the same problem??

Whispered

Did your vet run any further tests to find out what could be going on or were you just told it could be something worse than her being a "bully-girl"? Sorry if I missed it in your posts.

It sounds so stressful!

DBB

Teamshadowclan wrote: »

The evening before she started to shift her behavior, we started to move her to Burns. But she had maybe two half meals of that, so the vet ruled that one out pretty quickly.

As you know, I know your vet and I really like him. But this is bizarre. One major thing was changed, a strange behaviour emerged within hours, and the vet has discounted it?
Is she still on Burns? If she is, and I never thought I'd see the day where I said this, but I'd get her back on the Pedigree. At least it might answer this particular question.

Edited to add: Apologies if you said it already, I can't find it, but how did the dose of diarrhoea correspond to changing her onto Burns?
How did the worming correspond to when this new behaviour started? And the vaccinations?

Lord TSC

I'll do a quick timetable up from memory.

Sunday: Got the puppy.
Monday: Brought to vet for first check up. Was given vaccinations (Had some already but vet (the one you know and like) opted to give her a dose that he said covered more and some that wasn't covered by what she already had). Also given a worming tablet and told to give half that day and half two weeks later.
Saturday night/Sunday Morning: Vomiting in the middle of the night.
Tuesday - Saturday: No problems. Perfect puppy behaviour. The golden days.
Sunday Evening: Was fine all day as if the vomiting didn't happen, though this is when the aggression started to build up and the boundless negative energy started to emerge. Asked on here about it and was told to just observe for the day (though didn't mention the aggression as I didn't really notice the change as a proper change at that stage). Moved her to Burns that evening.
Monday morning: Diarrhea starts and she loses all energy, spending hours sitting there farting away. Bring her to the vet. Given antibiotics.

Worth pointing out that this second vet visit was with a different guy than visits 1 and 3. The reason the food change was ruled out was the vomiting the night before. Vet said it was likely a case of whatever was causing her to vomit on Saturday night was after working its way through the system and had moved from one end to the other The vomiting occurring before the food change was why the food change wasn't given much credence.

Monday evening: The aggression is starting to build. Energetic fits can last two hours with only a half hour sleep here and there. Moved her onto Rice and chicken at vet's request.
Tuesday - Saturday: The bouts get slightly longer as each day passes. By Thursday, the bouts also start to include a lot of weeing, completely out of tune with how much she is drinking. Also stops pooping regularly, often going 24-30 hours without pooping.
Saturday: Vet visit again. Taken off antibiotics. Some physical tests done. Vet says that there's no obvious signs of anything wrong. No signs of constipation to explain pooping, no sign of any problems in her eyes. Says he doesn't see anything wrong but could be neurological problems or internal problems that can't be easily observed without scans and so forth. Says to keep a good eye on her till she's due back for second vacs in two weeks.

(In a rush right now DBB but will respond to the PM soon. After having an incident where, in one of her fits, she caught her head in the door and took a bit of a whack on the head which seems to have really shaken her, so all hands are on taken in a guilty way as we make sure she's ok. Was afraid she'd hurt herself in a fit, and now worried she has.)

DBB

I have to admit to being a little confused with the timings of things, but that's possibly nothing new
She vomited, then after that you changed her onto Burns?
But before you changed her onto Burns, you had noticed the change in behaviour, but didn't recognise it as you do now (understandably enough)?
If you're absolutely sure about this, but I don't know really if you can be 100% sure (other than whether the vomiting preceded the food change), then food could be ruled out of the equation.
Unless you're 100% sure the behaviour change preceded the diet change, then you can't discount food as the culprit for the behaviour change.
However, I have my suspicions, as discussed by PM, that there is something more deep-rooted going on here. The food may be playing a part, but I feel there's as issue related to this immense peeing which is causing a behavioural by-product. In other words, some problem with perhaps the kidneys, maybe liver, is producing neurological/behavioural symptoms in addition to other more obvious symptoms (e.g. seemingly excessive peeing).
And this needs to be definitively ruled in or out by a vet, via urinalysis,and blood tests. So, I'd start getting a tad more pushy with your vet (do you really want to have to live with this for the next fortnight? :eek:), or consider a 2nd opinion. Much as I like your vet (he's great!), perhaps a fresh set of eyes is needed?

Dodd

Surely she can't wee more than the fluid she takes in over any length of time.
She would die.
What exact food is it,is it wet food.I'm not sure if Burns do tinned food.

Lord TSC

****

She just bit me, and hard enough to break skin. Have two holes bleeding on my hand and even apart from how upset I am, I'm scared....should I be getting to a hospital or something for a shot? Its panic, I know, but if its biological, I'm worried it's bad to get a cut from a bite?

DBB

It's highly unlikely that you're in any danger OP, but to be on the safe side, it might do no harm to get an anti-tetanus shot from your doc.
Okay OP, it's time to poop or get off the pot with this pup. Vet tomorrow.. whether that's the vet you've been seeing, or a 2nd opinion vet is up to you. But if you're staying with the first vet, he needs to know how difficult this all is, and needs to do the necessary tests to find out whether this is a pathological problem.
Either that, or you need to have "the chat" with the breeder. Can I ask, again maybe you said it already,how did you get the contact details for the breeder? Were you happy with their set-up?
Puppies are bloody hard work, but they're not meant to be so unpleasant to make the owner wary of handling them! Whilst it's hard work, it's also meant to be fun. You're not having fun. Something's got to give.

Lord TSC

I know I said I'd reply more later, but I'm so tired right now. Shame too, cause we didn't have a bad day and thought things were getting better. The call to the vet, as DBB will attest to cause I've let her in on some of it, didn't calm me much either. DBB, I'll send you a pretty detailed reply to that question you asked via PM in the morning, but right now, I need to get some sleep in before my pup's late night toilet break. And, honestly, some sleep before I break down.

My bro recorded this video just after she bit me. I'm not sure how well it translates into video, and it's not her at her most frantic, but this is what I started to try and stop when she got me. I worry it comes across as just a bold pup, but it's an hour of that franticness sometime.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=joDe3Du0aG4

Kukey

Teamshadowclan I hope your hand is ok.Looking at the video of the pup,it definitely isn't right.It seems to be in a world of its own! Frantic is the right word to use for her.Did she want to get out through the patio door or was that just manic scratching??
I have had hyper pups here but they would be interacting with us,while doing mad hyper things.She just seems to be in a zone.You are right to be worried about the behaviour.I hope the Vet has some answers for you.
On another note I was asked to foster a lab pup from the Pound,when I went to pick her up one of the workers told me she was a bit vicious with her dogs and to watch her with my dog.
I thought nothing of it as the pup was only 8 weeks old.I had to go to my Sisters on the way home,so I brought the pup in with me.
Her pup was about 5 mths old and we thought they would have a great time playing together.
They started off great until the little 8 week old pup had my Sisters pup by the throat!! I picked her up to separate them,then let her down again and she went for the other pup again!
This wasn't normal puppy play as she was very aggressive with the older pup.
When I brought her home ,she was snapping and snarling at my dog but he kept away from her.
The next morning I wormed her and what came out of her was sick.The worms were full length in a big ball.How they even fitted inside this tiny pup I don't know.I had never seen worms like this before!
Anyway the whole reason of that story is that after being dewormed,the pups personality changed and she became a normal happy little pup.No more aggression.
I would try to get that worm tablet into her and see if she has any,as it could be part of the problem.
Best of luck.

DBB

Closing thread at OP's request