Firebird vs Grant -HELP!!!

fergiesfolly

We're replacing our old internal boiler with a boilerhouse condensing boiler.
Its a 3bed semi with a new extension. Theres seven existing rads and new underfloor heating in the extension(approx 150 sq ft) to be serviced by the new boiler.
Thing is, we're stuck on which brand of boiler to go with. We've had various sources( builder, plumber, supplier) advocating one over the other and my heads wrecked.
Anyone in here have any experience of either, or both.
Which would you reccommend and why.
Are there features that would be an advantage over the other.
Thanks

Robbie.G

fergiesfolly wrote: »

We're replacing our old internal boiler with a boilerhouse condensing boiler.
Its a 3bed semi with a new extension. Theres seven existing rads and new underfloor heating in the extension(approx 150 sq ft) to be serviced by the new boiler.
Thing is, we're stuck on which brand of boiler to go with. We've had various sources( builder, plumber, supplier) advocating one over the other and my heads wrecked.
Anyone in here have any experience of either, or both.
Which would you reccommend and why.
Are there features that would be an advantage over the other.
Thanks

The simple answer is grant.The reason is they are the best oil boilers money can buy

shane0007

Grant Vortex all day everyday.
Firstly it's more efficient, see SEDBUK.
Secondly the gauge of steel is thicker & the welds are continuous rather than spot welded. They are also laser welded for consistency.
It has a better combustion process rather than a forced upside down combustion chamber to flue route.

Mixing UFH with rads in conjunction with a condensing boiler has its issues. The lower return temps can condense the boiler in the wrong location in the boiler, i.e. the steel section.
A blending valve to ensure the required delta T is required between the flow & return or I prefer to use a low loss header in this instance.

corkplumber

shane0007 wrote: »

Grant Vortex all day everyday.
Firstly it's more efficient, see SEDBUK.
Secondly the gauge of steel is thicker & the welds are continuous rather than spot welded. They are also laser welded for consistency.
It has a better combustion process rather than a forced upside down combustion chamber to flue route.

Mixing UFH with rads in conjunction with a condensing boiler has its issues. The lower return temps can condense the boiler in the wrong location in the boiler, i.e. the steel section.
A blending valve to ensure the required delta T is required between the flow & return or I prefer to use a low loss header in this instance.

+1

Having read a lot of your posts. I am amazed with your knowledge shane007. I done the oftec a couple of years ago. However some info i still need to go back to the books.

however I agree with the above.

shane0007

corkplumber wrote: »

+1

Having read a lot of your posts. I am amazed with your knowledge shane007. I done the oftec a couple of years ago. However some info i still need to go back to the books.

however I agree with the above.

Apparently I get it all from books!

corkplumber

shane0007 wrote: »

Apparently I get it all from books!

well jesus shane Im at this game a long time. The practicle end I have no problems with. but the theory sometimes I have to look up the 4 books from oftec or manufacturers instructions ect.

It would be imposible to pull that amount of tech info that fast from books. especially if your file a fax system is like mine. some lads are just great for retaining tech info.

fergiesfolly

Thanks Shane. TBH, thats all Greek to me. I'll be passing it on to the builder and his plumber for their feedback.
When you say that the lower temps can condense the boiler in the wrong location in the boiler, i.e. the steel section, does this affect the boilers effiencies, safety or both

BobLeeSwagger

Noob question.

Are the internals in the Grant ,Firebird and Warmflow not made by Riello? Just the build quality comes into it?

shane0007

fergiesfolly wrote: »

When you say that the lower temps can condense the boiler in the wrong location in the boiler, i.e. the steel section, does this affect the boilers effiencies, safety or both

It can actually assist the boiler in keeping it in condensing mode to a point but returning temps at below 40C will condense the boiler in the steel part of the boiler as well as the stainless steel part. This can lead to boiler corrosion internally, destroy the interns of the primary heat exchanger & can affect the warranty.
A simple inexpensive blending valve or better still, a low loss header will resolve any issues. The latter will allow for two separate temperature differentials between flow & return for UFH & flow & return for rads.

Also on no account over-size the boiler. Always best for oil boilers to slightly under-size them and/or over-size the rads with temperature control interlocked to the boiler. Your plumber should know what is required.

shane0007

BobLeeSwagger wrote: »

Noob question.

Are the internals in the Grant ,Firebird and Warmflow not made by Riello? Just the build quality comes into it?

No, only the burner is made by Riello. The boilers are manufactured by the respective manufacturers.

corkplumber

just to add to the above . your new boiler will carry a warantee but only if the passport is returned to the manufacturer. make sure the builders plumber can do this for you.

jimf

BobLeeSwagger wrote: »

Noob question.

Are the internals in the Grant ,Firebird and Warmflow not made by Riello? Just the build quality comes into it?

another grant fan here take shanes and others advice you will find that riello are the burners of choice for the above mentioned boilers

shane0007

corkplumber wrote: »

just to add to the above . your new boiler will carry a warantee but only if the passport is returned to the manufacturer. make sure the builders plumber can do this for you.

Very true. It must be installed to current regulations & be commissioned by a registered OFTEC technician to instigate the warranty.

fergiesfolly

Thanks lads for all the feedback. Lot of work going on in the house at the moment, but the boiler is the one thing giving me the most concern. Seems that if you don't get right at the start, you're letting yourself in for a lot of problems.Hopefully, will be talking to the plumber early next week and will run your info by him.Might use ye as a soundboard again though when I've spoken to him. It's like having my own helpline

corkgsxr

Grant is far better

corkplumber

corkgsxr wrote: »

Grant is far better

+1. misread that post mins ago.

kscobie

Grant Vortex