Software development sector in Ireland.

alxkls

I was advised to ask here about this and it seems reasonable.

The situation: I am a software developer - technical lead for Europe for one of the large projects in a more or less large company(4-5000 employees). And even though I am happy with what I do, I have reached a point in my life where I need a fresh start - new people, new environment, new home - new everything. Everyone has been in this position at some point of their life I believe. The bonus in my case is that I am single, no children and I am good to go at any point. Needless to say at this point that I am not Irish.

I've been on a holiday in Ireland twice and I can put my hand on my chest right now and say that I've never felt so at home anywhere else. However the company I work for does not have an office in Ireland so swapping my desk and computer is not an option. In other words - completely start over. Which is actually fine by me.

I've been looking at job offers these days and the more than half of them come from recruitment agencies. My experience with those is beyond bad:
"So you are fluent in C and Python. That is great, but I am afraid the advertised position is not available at the moment. How are your visual basic skills? We do have a very interesting position with VB."
At which point I'm asking myself why did I not bring a gun so I could shoot whoever is in front of me - I had just stated that I haven't had anything other than Linux on my personal computer for over 10 years. So chances of me using mono develop or something similar are close to 0.

The question is - what is the actual situation in Ireland? Where should I look, what is valued and what isn't? Should I even look at the offers by recruitment agencies or completely skip them?

Thank you very much for all your time.

AlmightyCushion

From what I've seen recruitment agencies are useless and I'm being kind to them by saying that.

Wrexis

A lot of multinationals are looking for python developers or support engineers, VMWare and Amazon come to mind.

A lot of consultancy companies are looking for Java or .NET developers and reward recruiters well for finding people, hence the push for you to look at a role that involves VB (ew).

Honestly it depends on what type of job you want.

There's a lot of Enterprise type work in Ireland - ERP development, system integration, etc. Stable and good pay but stuff I personally find boring. There's a heavy push for Munster IT jobs at the moment, but the reality of it is that most jobs are in Dublin.

There seem to be a lot of jobs on LinkedIn that require python, I'd say get started there and apply to companies directly.

Mort5000

First up, you're not Irish, but are you European? Otherwise you may face a struggle getting a work permit or convincing an employer to hire you in place of someone either local or European.
Secondly, nothing wrong with employment agencies (or VB). If the role they offer isn't to your liking, keep looking. Link up with a range of agencies and review what comes in.

Ludo

Company I work for are looking like mad for people for the last year and can't get enough. Based in Cork so maybe that is why we can't get people :-)
Lots of people have joined both Europeans and from further afield. Visas can easily be arranged.
It is all Java dev work on an eclipse RCP project....is this is of any interest to you...drop me a pm and I'll send you on the company careers page so you can take a look for yourself.

Mort5000

Easy visas:
First, the employer must look on the local market, and prove that they've done that.
Then they need to advertise on FAS, and prove they've done that.
Then the visa can only be applied for if the salary is in the correct range.
Then they need to ensure that the number of EU to Non-EU employees isn't over a certain ratio.
Then they need to pay a couple of hundred a year for the visa, or whatever it costs now.
Yeah, visas, very easy.

Ludo

By easy I mean that about 8 people out of the 12 who have joined in the last year here have required visas...they have all been granted so it is not a big deal really. I don't know about the whole ins and outs of it. That is someone elses job :-) I just know it hasn't prevented us from hiring anyone that got through the interview process.

alxkls

Yes I am an Eu citizen - that is not a problem. I wouldn't want to leave Europe for anything.

Development is what I would be after. The whole "support engineering" would be a bad idea(if someone has come across most my feedbacks on patches in the linux kernel mailing lust, they'd know what I'm on about).

ERP's may not be such a bad thing: that was my old job and it was inserting thanks to the sheer size of it. 2 programmers and a system working with 61 servers and around 1TB worth of databases.

I spent a week in Cork last year and it was awesome. Big enough to have everything in it, small enough to walk from one end till the other in a few hours. Plus Kinsale is close and I also fell in love with it.

Back to the point: what you are saying is that LinkedIn is the job seekers' social network in Ireland, correct?

Graham

LinkedIn is definitely growing in relevance over the last few years but don't right off the agency/job-site route either.

srsly78

Being a "linux only" guy is just as bad as being a "microsoft only" guy, you are gimping your career prospects.

Ok maybe I was a little harsh, microsoft-only guys are worse!!! But still...

alxkls

srsly78 wrote: »

Being a "linux only" guy is just as bad as being a "microsoft only" guy, you are gimping your career prospects.

Ok maybe I was a little harsh, microsoft-only guys are worse!!! But still...

I currently have to use Microsoft products on my computer at work, even though the servers where the magic happens run Linux(and thank god - nothing else would be able to handle 10000+ requests a second). The fact that I don't like something doesn't mean I won't use it. No question it's a huge disadvantage though.

amen

10000+ requests a second

really nothing else but Linuix ?

Jim2007

amen wrote: »

really nothing else but Linuix ?

Hold on let me get the pop corn.....

One of the best comments I heard was "The reason Linux guys can never get Windows working properly is because they keep trying to make it work like Linux"

fergalr

alxkls wrote: »

my feedbacks on patches in the linux kernel mailing lust

alxkls wrote: »

my old job [...] 2 programmers and a system working with 61 servers and around 1TB worth of databases.

alxkls wrote: »

handle 10000+ requests a second

alxkls wrote: »

The fact that I don't like something doesn't mean I won't use it.

...

srsly78 wrote: »

Being a "linux only" guy is just as bad as being a "microsoft only" guy, you are gimping your career prospects.

You know, I actually think OP is going to be ok here, in terms of career prospects.

COYW

Recently, I told all the recruitment agencies that have me on file to delete all my details. I have had my fill of their constant nonsense in relation to positions. They are getting worse to deal with by the day.

OP, if I was you, I would focus on the job sites and apply for positions that are posted by the companies themselves. Also, as someone who is not Irish and not used to the market here, make sure you know the correct salary for your level of experience in your area of work. Recently, I came across a Portuguese developer (C#) on daily rates (6 month contract), with 8 years commercial experience, who was getting paid the equivalent of €28K per annum. I am unsure whether the company, well established Irish company but a dreadful place to work, was screwing him or whether it was the agency but he was livid when he found out the correct market rates.

matrim

There are good and bad recruitment agents, the one thing to remember when dealing with them is that they are not there to look out for you. Be aware that you are using them as much as they are using you.

Just search the job sites and you should have not problem finding something. You may have to deal with agents at times but this can also work to you advantage sometimes (e.g. sometimes it's easier to push for feedback from an agent).

If you're skills are c and python you shouldn't have a problem. Do you know c++? There are a number of telecoms companies around that use c / c++ and python in linux environments that have all been recruiting in the last while.

ChRoMe

COYW wrote: »

Recently, I told all the recruitment agencies that have me on file to delete all my details. I have had my fill of their constant nonsense in relation to positions. They are getting worse to deal with by the day.

OP, if I was you, I would focus on the job sites and apply for positions that are posted by the companies themselves. Also, as someone who is not Irish and not used to the market here, make sure you know the correct salary for your level of experience in your area of work. Recently, I came across a Portuguese developer (C#) on daily rates (6 month contract), with 8 years commercial experience, who was getting paid the equivalent of €28K per annum. I am unsure whether the company, well established Irish company but a dreadful place to work, was screwing him or whether it was the agency but he was livid when he found out the correct market rates.

28k pro rata on a contract :eek:

In a way more the fool him for not know what he is worth, he would probably bill 500 pounds a day here in London without breaking a sweat.

COYW

ChRoMe wrote: »

28k pro rata on a contract :eek:

In a way more the fool him for not know what he is worth, he would probably bill 500 pounds a day here in London without breaking a sweat.

Should easily be getting €350-400 per day here. He was recruited from Portugal directly and was duped into thinking that was the going rate. He won't make that mistake again. Lovely chap, felt so sorry for him.

Tar.Aldarion

How could somebody be duped into that? Just turned up at one interview, got an offer, accepted it, worked there, all the while not even looking into it mildly and realising he gets a grad wage? Shows no effort/research/intelligence on his part. Very strange.

COYW

Tar.Aldarion wrote: »

How could somebody be duped into that? Just turned up at one interview, got an offer, accepted it, worked there, all the while not even looking into it mildly and realising he gets a grad wage? Shows no effort/research/intelligence on his part. Very strange.

I got the feeling that he was delighted to just get a job here and move away from Portugal. He interviewed for that job over the phone.

The company was only interested in keeping it cheap. The product was released 7 years and they never had a permanent member of staff, developer I mean. They just took in contractors and let them go whenever it suited them. Needless to say that code was atrocious since there was no technical structure or vision in place. It was like a design pattern lottery and this application had become very large, needlessly of course. Thousands of lines of duplicate code.

a fat guy

That's a grad wage? Hmm, I just graduated and have not yet realised the value of money...

*Rubs hands together greedily*

Tar.Aldarion

a fat guy wrote: »

That's a grad wage? Hmm, I just graduated and have not yet realised the value of money...

*Rubs hands together greedily*

Well I've seen them from 20k-34k, mostly being somewhere in the middle.

jgh_

Mort5000 wrote: »

Easy visas:
First, the employer must look on the local market, and prove that they've done that.
Then they need to advertise on FAS, and prove they've done that.
Then the visa can only be applied for if the salary is in the correct range.
Then they need to ensure that the number of EU to Non-EU employees isn't over a certain ratio.
Then they need to pay a couple of hundred a year for the visa, or whatever it costs now.
Yeah, visas, very easy.

According to the Green Card Scheme posted in 2011, Software Development is a "high level strategic shortage" category meaning it appears that you can get a green card fairly easily if the offer is over €30k. This document makes no mention of work authorization/labor certification, other than to say it's been discontinued, though I believe an employer can't have more than 50% non-EU employees (which, realistically, is probably not really a problem in most cases). Looks like it's a one-time €1,000 fee.

The Employment Permits Acts 2003 and 2006 allow for the establishment, for the first time in Ireland, of a Green Card Scheme for occupations where high level strategic skills shortages exist. This new Green Card Scheme replaces the Work Visa/Work Authorisation Scheme, which has been discontinued.

ViperMAN

Check out http://makeitinireland.com/ - this has a wealth of information for IT workers moving to Ireland.
It includes a tech-map of all the IT companies hiring (from startups up to multi-nationals), info on how to move here (visa, etc), and a forum for all your questions.

You mentioned you like Cork - there is a Cork version at http://makeitincork.com/

jgh_

ViperMAN wrote: »

Check out http://makeitinireland.com/ - this has a wealth of information for IT workers moving to Ireland.
It includes a tech-map of all the IT companies hiring (from startups up to multi-nationals), info on how to move here (visa, etc), and a forum for all your questions.

You mentioned you like Cork - there is a Cork version at http://makeitincork.com/

Fantastic links! This will be useful for me and my wife

Gatica

OP, Intel is always looking for Linux developers with C experience. There's always a dozen vacancies unfilled because there aren't enough qualified candidates. Granted it's in Shannon and in the middle of nowhere but if you can put up with Limerick or Ennis, then you can give them a shout.