Withdrawal of Drinks sponsorship

Royal Legend

The IRFU have come out today stating that Minister Varadkers proposal of removing sponsorship of major sporting events by drinks companies would have detrimental effects on sports in general. This is set to happen within 2 years. Also, it is stated it will not affect cultural or arts events.

What do you think?

Also could it be argued that say a major Hurling game, Munster final, AI final, is a major cultural as well as sporting occasion?

klairondavis

Nanny state at work. Will this have any impact on all the small rural GAA clubs who are sponsored by the local pub?

Clareman

I don't think this will have a massive impact on the GAA, I think Horse Racing will be very badly affected though

Mal-Adjusted

This will hurt rugby most of all. The real issue though is the arts and culture stuff being exempt. Why? From a sponsor's point of view they're the same thing, an event where you'll get your banner all over the place. Either ban them from sponsoring all events or let them get on with it. Cherry-picking stuff just reeks of hypocrisy.

Atlantic Dawn

The problem is unless there's an EU wide ban on sponsorship it will just mean the sponsorship moving outside Ireland but still targeting the Irish market, like the way the Champions League targets the French alcohol market.

Clareman

Remember when the ban on tobacco sponsorship was going to destroy F1 and Snooker? I don't think the GAA has much to worry about, clubs could struggle if the local pub isn't allowed sponsor them, but I think that's being allowed.

Realt Dearg Sec

How would this work for, say, the Heineken cup? Can they not play matches here, or will they just pretend the competition isn't called what it is called? Regarding the fact that it only affects sport, but not cultural events, I would love to hear the explanation. I can't think of any reason that wouldnt be hypocritical.

Hammer Archer

Mal-Adjusted wrote: »

The real issue though is the arts and culture stuff being exempt. Why? From a sponsor's point of view they're the same thing, an event where you'll get your banner all over the place. Either ban them from sponsoring all events or let them get on with it. Cherry-picking stuff just reeks of hypocrisy.

I'd be very interested in what will constitute an "arts and culture" event. Oxegen's main sponsor is Heineken yet I wouldn't exactly regard tens of thousands of people getting pissed and/or high in a racecourse in Kildare as a "cultural event".

kksaints

Realt Dearg Sec wrote: »

How would this work for, say, the Heineken cup? Can they not play matches here, or will they just pretend the competition isn't called what it is called? Regarding the fact that it only affects sport, but not cultural events, I would love to hear the explanation. I can't think of any reason that wouldnt be hypocritical.

I would say they can play matches. The French play matches at home in the Heineken Cup so that wont be an issue. As far as I know its only pitchside advertise and jersey sponsors that are covered up like in the Champions League.

Clareman

Realt Dearg Sec wrote: »

How would this work for, say, the Heineken cup? Can they not play matches here, or will they just pretend the competition isn't called what it is called? Regarding the fact that it only affects sport, but not cultural events, I would love to hear the explanation. I can't think of any reason that wouldnt be hypocritical.

The Heineken Cup us known as the H-Cup in Franch

Realt Dearg Sec

Clareman wrote: »

The Heineken Cup us known as the H-Cup in Franch

A plan fiendishly clever in its intricacy. So in practice, then, rugby (along with whatever upper middle class pretentious ****e they are trying to protect with the cultural event loophole) will still benefit from drink sponsorship but gaa won't?

theoneeyedman

Malachy Clerkin had an interesting article in the Irish Times recently comparing the moral tut-tutting over Guinness sponsoring of the Hurling championship, and the lack of concern over HSBC sponsership of the Lions tour. HSBC were recently fined over 2 billion after being found guilty of money laundering for a number of Mexican drug gangs, and going out of their way to facilitate them.

The targets of this PC brigade are strange IMO..if u look at the harm casino banks and developers have done in recent years, why are we not banning the likes of the AIB League, or builders from sponsoring GAA teams too. It makes little sense to me to be honest....

walrusgumble

Royal Legend wrote: »

The IRFU have come out today stating that Minister Varadkers proposal of removing sponsorship of major sporting events by drinks companies would have detrimental effects on sports in general. This is set to happen within 2 years. Also, it is stated it will not affect cultural or arts events.

What do you think?

Also could it be argued that say a major Hurling game, Munster final, AI final, is a major cultural as well as sporting occasion?

Yes they are major cultural occasions Sport can be very much part of a Nation's Culture. Australia is famous for taking their sports seriously. In Ireland, we have the GAA (and rugby and soccer) , our national sports. The Munster Championship is steep in history

The GAA gathers thousands to any town that holds a Championship game. People religiously go to matches every year, even if their team are crap.


Sport is just as much a cultural matter as say the Cork Jazz Festival or Galway Festivals


I laugh at the notion that some morons, were paid to do research and come out with a conclusion that somehow Guinness etc sponsoring Sports will entice kids to drink more.

Last time I checked, AIB and Barclays (in England) are considered as main players in the economic destruction in Ireland and England

Poor_old_gill

I just don't believe that there is a causal link- I couldn't even tell you who sponsors the GAA football championship but I'll have a few pints of Heineken with my mates when attending a match.

Who the sponsors are doesn't influence my choice

Fr Tod Umptious

walrusgumble wrote: »

I laugh at the notion that some morons, were paid to do research and come out with a conclusion that somehow Guinness etc sponsoring Sports will entice kids to drink more.

Poor_old_gill wrote: »

I just don't believe that there is a causal link- I couldn't even tell you who sponsors the GAA football championship but I'll have a few pints of Heineken with my mates when attending a match.

Who the sponsors are doesn't influence my choice

But it's not about whether you or I prefer to drink Heineken over Carlsberg during a match, it's about getting the brands out, and out to the next generation.

If you remove the brand from the event then that is one less place for the brand to be seen.

Take cigarettes for example.
As a teenage in the '80s I had plenty of knowledge of what brands were available if I decided to give the ciggs a try.

There was sports sponsorship (Carroll's Irish open Golf)
Ads in print media (Big Silk Cut ad is the RTE Guide)
Shop fronts adorned with Benson and Hedges illuminated signs
And inside the shop you had packets is shiny wrapping behind the counter for all to see

But bit by bit all that has gone away.
No more sports advertising
No more print media ads
No more shop fronts with cigg name on them
And in the shop itself the ciggs are now behind a blank case.
And in some places (Aus) generic packets

So a teenager in 2013 is not exposed in anyway to cigarettes brands like a teenager was 30 years ago, which is a great thing.
If I was a smoking visitor to Ireland I would be wondering where I could buy them, they are completely hidden from view.

The same can happen if you remove alcohol brands from the public eye.

ProudDUB

Poor_old_gill wrote: »

Who the sponsors are doesn't influence my choice

Maybe not. But the sponsor being the sponsor, sometimes means that you don't actually HAVE a choice. If you are at a Heineken Cup game, Heineken have the beer rights at the venue. You can't get a pint of Carlsberg or Budweiser at the RDS during a Heineken Cup game. All you can get is a Heineken.

So not only are you drinking their beer while you are at the event, you could also be (subconsciously) developing a taste for it, and a brand loyalty to it too. Then when you leave the venue and you walk into a pub where you DO have other beers to choose from, you don't, you stick with what you've been drinking all day long. It's a win win for Heineken all around.

That may sound overly simplistic, but I don't think that it is a million miles away from the truth. People don't want to admit that their choices are being influenced by advertising or brand sponsorship. We all want to believe that we are far too smart and discerning to ever be swayed by something so overt or calculated as brand marketing. But if truth be told, we are. All the time. Alcohol companies wouldn't be ploughing as much money into the business model that they are, if they weren't seeing results from it imo.

Coillte_Bhoy

Poor_old_gill wrote: »

I just don't believe that there is a causal link- I couldn't even tell you who sponsors the GAA football championship but I'll have a few pints of Heineken with my mates when attending a match.

Who the sponsors are doesn't influence my choice

if only. So you drink pints of heineken at gaa matches then? :rolleyes:

Poor_old_gill

ProudDUB wrote: »

Maybe not. But the sponsor being the sponsor, sometimes means that you don't actually HAVE a choice. If you are at a Heineken Cup game, Heineken have the beer rights at the venue. You can't get a pint of Carlsberg or Budweiser at the RDS during a Heineken Cup game. All you can get is a Heineken.

So not only are you drinking their beer while you are at the event, you could also be (subconsciously) developing a taste for it, and a brand loyalty to it too. Then when you leave the venue and you walk into a pub where you DO have other beers to choose from, you don't, you stick with what you've been drinking all day long. It's a win win for Heineken all around.

That may sound overly simplistic, but I don't think that it is a million miles away from the truth. People don't want to admit that their choices are being influenced by advertising or brand sponsorship. We all want to believe that we are far too smart and discerning to ever be swayed by something so overt or calculated as brand marketing. But if truth be told, we are. All the time. Alcohol companies wouldn't be ploughing as much money into the business model that they are, if they weren't seeing results from it imo.

So what you're saying is that advertising doesn't influence whether people drink or not- just the brand?
How will stopping drinks advertising impact on overall consumption then?

I just really don't think that banning drinks advertising will have an effect as people will be allowed to drink in other locations (ie pubs) and thus become used to it- they will then want to drink at sporting events even if they are sponsored by a taxi firm.

The smoking ban has worked because you're practically disqualified from smoking in public.
This restriction has made it virtually impossible to do so as it is too much of an inconvenience to keep heading off for a smoke.

Who will pick up the tab for the loss in revenue to sporting organisations?
Its not like we have top facilities and well funded sporting bodies

ProudDUB

Poor_old_gill wrote: »

So what you're saying is that advertising doesn't influence whether people drink or not- just the brand?

I have no idea where you are getting that from. I just said that advertising and brand marketing DOES influence peoples choices, whether they are aware of it or not.

Poor_old_gill

ProudDUB wrote: »

I have no idea where you are getting that from. I just said that advertising and brand marketing DOES influence peoples choices, whether they are aware of it or not.

In your example- the people were going to drink anyway and the only thing up for debate was what brand they drank and to be honest I agree that to be the scenario.

It does impact on your brand choices but to some degree but people will drink regardless

ProudDUB

My point was about a brand buying the naming rights to an event, that also gives them the right to be the sole provider of their service at that event. You can only get Heineken at a Heineken Cup game. So even if your usual beer of choice is Budweiser, at a HC game, your choice is taken away from you. You can only drink the beer that Heineken say that you can drink. Over time, that can come to influence the decisions that you make when you do have an actual choice, whether you are aware of it or not.

I don't neccessarily agree that people will drink regardless. Yes, they may drink, but not the brands and not in the quantities that they would do if they aren't given a push in the right direction to do so. If you wave enough of a product in front of people, you can make them want it to a degree that they did not before. I don't normally drink whiskey. It wouldn't ever occur to me to order it when I am out somewhere. But if I am in a freezing cold Croke Park or RDS in the middle of February & I see a big poster showing someone with their hands wrapped around a steaming hot whiskey, guess what I'll start to think about wanting? I'll give you a clue. It ain't a cold beer !

Poor_old_gill

ProudDUB wrote: »

My point was about a brand buying the naming rights to an event, that also gives them the right to be the sole provider of their service at that event. You can only get Heineken at a Heineken Cup game. So even if your usual beer of choice is Budweiser, at a HC game, your choice is taken away from you. You can only drink the beer that Heineken say that you can drink. Over time, that can come to influence the decisions that you make when you do have an actual choice, whether you are aware of it or not.

I don't neccessarily agree that people will drink regardless. Yes, they may drink, but not the brands and not in the quantities that they would do if they aren't given a push in the right direction to do so. If you wave enough of a product in front of people, you can make them want it to a degree that they did not before. I don't normally drink whiskey. It wouldn't ever occur to me to order it when I am out somewhere. But if I am in a freezing cold Croke Park or RDS in the middle of February & I see a big poster showing someone with their hands wrapped around a steaming hot whiskey, guess what I'll start to think about wanting? I'll give you a clue. It ain't a cold beer !

No I agree to an extent that it may influence your choice of brands but I think alcohol consumption goes hand in hand with sporting events/concerts/etc as people go to enjoy themselves and alcohol helps them to do so.

I just don't think ending drinks sponsorship will stop people from drinkin- our level of drinking is on the wane is it not?

theoneeyedman

Doesn't Guinness have exclusive rights in Croke pk at present, I.e only Guinness Carlsberg Bud etc available

Fr Tod Umptious

Do any drinks companies sponors national GAA competitios at this stage by the way , I can't think of any

Realt Dearg Sec

Fr Tod Umptious wrote: »

Do any drinks companies sponors national GAA competitios at this stage by the way , I can't think of any

Guinness, sponsor hurling all ireland

Hammer Archer

Realt Dearg Sec wrote: »

Guinness, sponsor hurling all ireland

They don't anymore as far as I know. Liberty, Etihad and Centra are the three sponsors now.

Fr Tod Umptious

Hammer Archer wrote: »

They don't anymore as far as I know. Liberty, Etihad and Centra are the three sponsors now.

That's correct, it has been a few years since Guinness have been a co sponsor and even longer since they were exclusive sponsors

Clareman

It has been a long time since Guinness sponsored the Hurling, but because of their brilliant marketing machine (Hell for Leather, Not Men But Giants, hurler on the top of the pint) they are still linked with it. The only other alcohol links that I can think of, outside of local pubs of course, would be Bushmill's sponsoring Antrim.

Realt Dearg Sec

Clareman wrote: »

It has been a long time since Guinness sponsored the Hurling, but because of their brilliant marketing machine (Hell for Leather, Not Men But Giants, hurler on the top of the pint) they are still linked with it. The only other alcohol links that I can think of, outside of local pubs of course, would be Bushmill's sponsoring Antrim.

My apologies, they have been replaced by liberty, but it wasn't a long time ago, its only this year. They didn't run many high profile campaigns off it since losing sole sponsorship, and used it to leverage drinkaware.ie, but they were sponsoring it til last year.