Basics of grass management/measurment

shy_boy

I know there is a thread on it but it is a bit complicated, Could any1 just explain the basics to me please:D

satstheway

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delaval

shy_boy wrote: »

I know there is a thread on it but it is a bit complicated, Could any1 just explain the basics to me please:D

Would be delighted.
Is it an explanation of the terms you require in order to understand other thread?

Grass measuring is like any other measurment except we are measuring the dry matter(dm) in kg available on a given day or what each paddock or farm is growing.
Growth (gr) is the rate per day that this dm is increasing.
Stocking rate (sr) is the amount of animals (formed into adults) you need to feed.
Average farm cover (afc) is the average of all your paaddocks grazed and ungrazed.

You know how many animals/hectare (sr) you need to feed let's say 3/ha.
You want them to graze 17kgs dm/head/day.
That's 3x17=51kg/ha/day and the term for this is Demand.

HOPE you're still with me:):)

You know your demand now you need to know what's available, so you measure. This however is only a snapshot as it only tells you what's availble on that day you still have no idea wheather enough is being grown.

You now need to measure again, usually one week later, this gives you your growth rate (gr).

Now you have a lot of info as to what's happening but it's useless unless you use this info.

Demand is 51/day (to fully feed your animal you need a Gr of 51)
You measured day one and again a week later now you have your GR it's the difference between the two measurements divided by 7 for the days since the last measurement.

If this figure is more than 51 you are in surplus and may decide to take silage, if however it's lower your animaals are short and you need to supplement. This may be with silage or meal.

I hope this is of some help. There are a few sharp cookies here who will probably be able to simplify further.
Word of warning Bob will be here in a flash to tell you that it's all rubbish, pay no attention it's pure jealousy;););)

mahoney_j

delaval wrote: »

Would be delighted.
Is it an explanation of the terms you require in order to understand other thread?

Grass measuring is like any other measurment except we are measuring the dry matter(dm) in kg available on a given day or what each paddock or farm is growing.
Growth (gr) is the rate per day that this dm is increasing.
Stocking rate (sr) is the amount of animals (formed into adults) you need to feed.
Average farm cover (afc) is the average of all your paaddocks grazed and ungrazed.

You know how many animals/hectare (sr) you need to feed let's say 3/ha.
You want them to graze 17kgs dm/head/day.
That's 3x17=51kg/ha/day and the term for this is Demand.

HOPE you're still with me:):)

You know your demand now you need to know what's available, so you measure. This however is only a snapshot as it only tells you what's availble on that day you still have no idea wheather enough is being grown.

You now need to measure again, usually one week later, this gives you your growth rate (gr).

Now you have a lot of info as to what's happening but it's useless unless you use this info.

Demand is 51/day (to fully feed your animal you need a Gr of 51)
You measured day one and again a week later now you have your GR it's the difference between the two measurements divided by 7 for the days since the last measurement.

If this figure is more than 51 you are in surplus and may decide to take silage, if however it's lower your animaals are short and you need to supplement. This may be with silage or meal.

I hope this is of some help. There are a few sharp cookies here who will probably be able to simplify further.
Word of warning Bob will be here in a flash to tell you that it's all rubbish, pay no attention it's pure jealousy;););)

Wad going to throw in my few penny's worth but de laval has it covered pretty well.its the single most important job on a dairy farm IMO if you want to produce cheap milk,want good grass and a bank of good silage for early spring ,back end and times of feed deficit

Timmaay

Agreed fully with delaval, that basic bit of maths is the most important part of it all. The physical measuring of grass does take a little time 1st few fimes you do it, and you probably will doubt yourself and think its alot of work, but very quickly you get to the stage of getting accurate enough figures on grass covers by just eyeballing them.

Dampintheattic

mahoney_j wrote: »

Wad going to throw in my few penny's worth but de laval has it covered pretty well.its the single most important job on a dairy farm IMO if you want to produce cheap milk,want good grass and a bank of good silage for early spring ,back end and times of feed deficit

Let me throw a question at you, if you don't mind.

I never do second cut. Most silage ground is old ley. Always graze in spring, before fertilizer for silage. Partly because I'm usually tightish on feed, and mostly because I believe spring grazing improves silage quality.

This year I NEED to do a second cut.

1. Fertilizer is spread six weeks on 5th June. Nitrogen should be used up according to the 2 units per day, rule of thumb. I think crop will be mediocre at best in terms of volume.

I'm thinking of giving it one extra week, to get some more bulk. Then slurry and fertilise for second crop.
Would the gains in terms of volume, be lost in terms of volume / quality of the second crop?
Would it matter one damn either way?

Thanks.

D

delaval

Dampintheattic wrote: »

Let me throw a question at you, if you don't mind.

I never do second cut. Most silage ground is old ley. Always graze in spring, before fertilizer for silage. Partly because I'm usually tightish on feed, and mostly because I believe spring grazing improves silage quality.

This year I NEED to do a second cut.

1. Fertilizer is spread six weeks on 5th June. Nitrogen should be used up according to the 2 units per day, rule of thumb. I think crop will be mediocre at best in terms of volume.

I'm thinking of giving it one extra week, to get some more bulk. Then slurry and fertilise for second crop.
Would the gains in terms of volume, be lost in terms of volume / quality of the second crop?
Would it matter one damn either way?

Thanks.

D

Cut 5 June fert N 70 units +p&k cut again Aug wend graze Sept

Dampintheattic

delaval wrote: »

Cut 5 June fert N 70 units +p&k cut again Aug wend graze Sept

Thanks.

Belongamick

DeLavel,

Question..

'Cut 5 June fert N 70 units +p&k cut again Aug wend graze Sept'

70 Units of N - is that per hectare or acre?
Assume acre for a minute - 3.5 bags 18-6-12 per acre?

Thanks..

delaval

Belongamick wrote: »

DeLavel,

Question..

'Cut 5 June fert N 70 units +p&k cut again Aug wend graze Sept'

70 Units of N - is that per hectare or acre?
Assume acre for a minute - 3.5 bags 18-6-12 per acre?

Thanks..

I'm old school, per acre is what I quoted.
3x18=63units close enough. Work on rule of thumb that in good growth 2 units per day will be used so all N will be gone.

delaval

delaval wrote: »

Cut 5 June fert N 70 units +p&k cut again Aug wend graze Sept

Damp,
This comes with the warning that you will have to listen to some Jackass telling you how light your crop is, I got it all night in the pub yesterday from 2 guys that bought silage from me.
I have never cut a heavy crop of silage/wire but I have also never run short save once in 25 years.
Lets say you are short. You have top quality gear and a few bales will stretch it a long way. If you have **** in the pit and are short it'll take a lot more than straw to get you out of jail.

delaval

Hey Mahoney, I think we'll do more harm than Teagasc!!!!!!!

freedominacup

delaval wrote: »

Damp,
This comes with the warning that you will have to listen to some Jackass telling you how light your crop is, I got it all night in the pub yesterday from 2 guys that bought silage from me.
I have never cut a heavy crop of silage/wire but I have also never run short save once in 25 years.
Lets say you are short. You have top quality gear and a few bales will stretch it a long way. If you have **** in the pit and are short it'll take a lot more than straw to get you out of jail.

Nearly had a knock down drag out at the last discussion group meeting about this. At the end of the day there is a finite amount of energy in a silage crop and it is at it's max the day it starts to head. No amount of bulk is going to give you a single extra MJ of energy but every days delay lowers the quality of the product you are saving.

I know guy that in general does a very good job but has a bit of a blind spot about silage and is definitely in the "never mind the quality feel the width" school of silage making. This guy calves to turn out directly to grass, grows as much as his farm allows, takes out meal as soon as growth equals demand but is quite happy to supplement dry cows with 4-5kgs of meal to supplement mid-fifties DMD silage every winter. He'd hardly give them this much meal after calving. In fairness he never runs out but supplementing poor quality is an expensive business.

Timmaay

We seem to have been pulling back the 1st cut date the last few yrs (obviously the teagasc lad was having some influence on my dad ha!), but this year it was a point blank refusal to budge before the June bank holiday ha, despite what I would call fairly good bulk in the feild now,even with the poor spring. Next yr I'll just have to get all the silage ground grazed off earlier again, and the fertiliser out and give him no choice but to cut earlier ha (with the big assumption of no repeat of this springs late start!)

mahoney_j

delaval wrote: »

Hey Mahoney, I think we'll do more harm than Teagasc!!!!!!!

At least our advice (ahemmm)is free!!!

delaval

freedominacup wrote: »

Nearly had a knock down drag out at the last discussion group meeting about this. At the end of the day there is a finite amount of energy in a silage crop and it is at it's max the day it starts to head. No amount of bulk is going to give you a single extra MJ of energy but every days delay lowers the quality of the product you are saving.

I know guy that in general does a very good job but has a bit of a blind spot about silage and is definitely in the "never mind the quality feel the width" school of silage making. This guy calves to turn out directly to grass, grows as much as his farm allows, takes out meal as soon as growth equals demand but is quite happy to supplement dry cows with 4-5kgs of meal to supplement mid-fifties DMD silage every winter. He'd hardly give them this much meal after calving. In fairness he never runs out but supplementing poor quality is an expensive business.

That's what I meant to say!!!!!
Good perspective for a TILLAGE guy!!!

freedominacup

delaval wrote: »

That's what I meant to say!!!!!
Good perspective for a TILLAGE guy!!!

You're just not gonna let that go are you?

delaval

Anyone interested check out Just do it's & Username John on Grassmeasuring very interesting