People who live abroad and claim sickness and disability.

volauvent

I have a few non national workmates who tell tales of their fellow countrymen and countrywomen living back home and claiming disability from ireland. The word from these guys is that their illnesses are not so bad as their medical reports have stated. Apparently they are paid straight to the bank account and a bit of cooperation from pals back here means they get the dough sent to them. They earn often more than the average wage in their country and live very well. Is the country doing anything to check if these people are even living here? From what I hear its easy peasy to defraud in this area.

Peppa Pig

It's also very easy to report them and get the DSP to follow up.:cool:

We had to confirm our kids were registered in school here to keep getting child benefit so it can be done.

Cody Pomeray

volauvent wrote: »

I have a few non national workmates.

Stateless citizens. So sad:(

volauvent

Peppa Pig wrote: »

It's also very easy to report them and get the DSP to follow up.:cool:

We had to confirm our kids were registered in school here to keep getting child benefit so it can be done.

And do they continue to check annually if they are registered or you just have to prove it once and then they leave it to good faith?

woodoo

Cody Pomeray wrote: »

Stateless citizens. So sad:(

ah now come on

zenno

volauvent wrote: »

I have a few non national workmates who tell tales of their fellow countrymen and countrywomen living back home and claiming disability from ireland. The word from these guys is that their illnesses are not so bad as their medical reports have stated. Apparently they are paid straight to the bank account and a bit of cooperation from pals back here means they get the dough sent to them. They earn often more than the average wage in their country and live very well. Is the country doing anything to check if these people are even living here? From what I hear its easy peasy to defraud in this area.

I can't see this still happening because most citizens in Ireland can't get disability when they have a legitimate disability and if they do a lot of them are forwarded to the community employment schemes, where they have to work or lose their payments.

I seriously can't imagine the social welfare still sending monies over to these people because how can the social welfare monitor whether they are working as well or abusing this.

Cody Pomeray

woodoo wrote: »

ah now come on

I could say the same to you.

I'm sure there is disability benefit fraud ongoing.

What it has to do with "non nationals" as above anyone else is what baffles me.

Is it acceptable if committed by Irish people?

Is it acceptable if committed by foreign nationals resident in Ireland?

Strange OP.

volauvent

So anyhow, ignoring the troll on the forum wondering if anyone has anything interesting to say?

Peppa Pig

volauvent wrote: »

And do they continue to check annually if they are registered or you just have to prove it once and then they leave it to good faith?

It only happened last year, presume it happened to all kids. If they couldn't prove the kids were in Ireland they were cut off.

Are you going to report these people seeing as they are ripping off the taxpayer (if it's true)

volauvent

I mentioned that to these people but was laughed at. Gave me the impression blood is thicker than water sorta thing. They weren't prepared to rat their fellow countrymen up.

Cody Pomeray

volauvent wrote: »

So anyhow, ignoring the troll on the forum wondering if anyone has anything interesting to say?

Interesting, as in "he-or me mate told me about loads a dese non nationals claiming the doal"?

That's not very interesting.

Play To Kill

It's not just a small percentage of foreign nationals that are involved in this type of fraud, it's also a small percentage of Irish people, http://www.independent.ie/irish-news/exaddict-in-17000-malaysia-benefits-fraud-avoids-prison-29177699.html

volauvent

Play To Kill wrote: »

It's not just a small percentage of foreign nationals that are involved in this type of fraud, it's also a small percentage of Irish people, http://www.independent.ie/irish-news/exaddict-in-17000-malaysia-benefits-fraud-avoids-prison-29177699.html

Yes I'm aware of that and that's a good point also. That's also fraudulent of course. Are the benefits paid into the bank account with no need to "sign on"?

Play To Kill

I doubt payments for disability etc would require the person to sign on, probably more likely that you would have to go for a yearly medical assessment or something like that but I don't know.

volauvent

Yeh that was my impression. I would have thought having at least 6 monthly checks with the gp or with a social welfare officer would be manageable. Unless they are profoundly disabled ( terminal sickness, mental handicap etc). I think they are getting tighter with jobseekers so I don't see why they wouldn't do something to manage the sickness schemes too. Just to be fair to the tax payer. But that said I don't know. Maybe they have something like this in place.

zenno

You don't sign on when you are on disability.

Treehousetim

You can't blame people for trying. The state is to blame for being so unprotective of itself. As a nation we tend to err on the side of being too trusting and naive. Of course some people from poor economies (and irish also- in case I get battered by "the righteous" here) will exploit a weakness if its there. It's up to the gatekeepers in welfare to make the system less exploitable.

chris445

Cody Pomeray wrote: »

I could say the same to you.

I'm sure there is disability benefit fraud ongoing.

What it has to do with "non nationals" as above anyone else is what baffles me.

Is it acceptable if committed by Irish people?

Is it acceptable if committed by foreign nationals resident in Ireland?

Strange OP.

I must admit that in this thread it is this post I find strange. I don't see where in the OP it says it's 'to do with "non-nationals" above anyone else.' OP clearly states "PEOPLE" who live abroad, and the example they have heard is from non-national workmates. If it is going on, theres is a strong possibility that Irish "PEOPLE" who have moved and now live abroad are defrauding the system too and are, therefore, also a target of this thread. The last question is completely irrelevant as the post is clearly about people living abroad.

Gatling

zenno wrote: »

You don't sign on when you are on disability.

Play To Kill wrote: »

I doubt payments for disability etc would require the person to sign on, probably more likely that you would have to go for a yearly medical assessment or something like that but I don't know.

You've to sign for your weekly payment with photo id its not paid into bank accounts to reduce cases of fraudulent claimant's

volauvent

Gatling wrote: »

You've to sign for your weekly payment with photo id its not paid into bank accounts to reduce cases of fraudulent claimant's

Thanks Gatling. Why does it say this about disability on welfare website?
Did they change it recently?

Disability Allowance is paid weekly in advance on a Wednesday. The date of the first payment is the Wednesday following the effective date of claim.

"There are two methods of payment:

Directly into the Post Office via Electronic Information Transfer. This allows for Household Budget facility.
Direct payment weekly by Electronic Fund Transfer (EFT) into a Bank Account or Building Society Account (NOT a mortgage account) or Credit Union (not all Credit Unions have this facility)"

Do they decide on a case to case basis ?

Cushie Butterfield

volauvent wrote: »

Do they decide on a case to case basis ?

No, the claimant has the choice of payment method.

Cushie Butterfield

Gatling wrote: »

You've to sign for your weekly payment with photo id its not paid into bank accounts to reduce cases of fraudulent claimant's

No, disability, invalidity & carer payments can be paid into bank accounts. Jobseekers payments have to be collected in Post Office.

goat2

say if it is put in a bank account, it can be traced as to where this money is withdrawn,
if one is sick enough not to work, then they must be too sick to travel,
only times i ever took off sick, i was not able to leave my home,
are those who are drawing sick benefit supposed to give a doctors report each week,
i dont know how the sick benefit work, have never been on sick benefit, so therefore i would not know anything about this,

Gatling

Cushie Butterfield wrote: »

No, disability, invalidity & carer payments can be paid into bank accounts. Jobseekers payments have to be collected in Post Office.

I'm on disability and have been repeatedly told by the department that they don't pay it into bank accounts the payment must be signed for on a Wednesday every week

Peppa Pig

goat2 wrote: »

i dont know how the sick benefit work, have never been on sick benefit, so therefore i would not know anything about this,

Illness benefit = I am ill and cannot go into work for the short term
Disability allowance - I have a disability that means I cannot work and it is expected to last for a year
Invalidity pension - I have a disability and can never work again.

The short term ones need a doctors cert sent to the DSP each week. If it is longer term, they may ask for a monthly one, eg someone recovering from an operation that needs six months off will not need to supply weekly certs.

Disability allowance is means tested. invalidity pension is not means tested but it essentially means you will never work again. This requires a lot of doctor sign off and assessment by the DSP doctors as well.

Cody Pomeray

chris445 wrote: »

I must admit that in this thread it is this post I find strange. I don't see where in the OP it says it's 'to do with "non-nationals" above anyone else.' OP clearly states "PEOPLE" who live abroad, and the example they have heard is from non-national workmates.

Perhaps you missed this

volauvent wrote: »

I have a few non national workmates who tell tales of their fellow countrymen and countrywomen living back home and claiming disability from ireland.

Hmm?

Cushie Butterfield

Gatling wrote: »

I'm on disability and have been repeatedly told by the department that they don't pay it into bank accounts the payment must be signed for on a Wednesday every week

You've been given incorrect information. Even the Disability Allowance Application Form itself (pdf doc) Part 4, Page 11 states:
Your payment details: You can get your payment at your local post office or direct to your current,
deposit or savings account in a financial institution. This account must be in your
name or jointly held by you. Please complete one option below. The option for payment to a financial institution is the second option, where applicants fill in their bank details.

Also
SW29 Info on Disability Allowance (pdf doc) .

Section 6 on page 13 states:

6. How do I get my payment?
Disability Allowance can be paid weekly:
• at your local post office by Social Services Card. This
allows you to avail of the Household Budget Scheme.
or
• by direct payment into your account in a financial
institution. This account must be a current, deposit or
savings account, nota mortgage account.

Also, from welfare.ie Payment Related Issues Operational Guidlines :

PAYMENT METHODS.
Electronic Fund Transfer (EFT). EFT is also available to persons in receipt of State Pension (Non-Contributory), Disability Allowance, Long-duration Illness Benefit, Maternity Benefit, Carer's Benefit, Farm Assist and Back-to-Work Allowance - while living in the State.


You should ring DSP Disability Allowance Section & ask them to post you out a direct payment to bank account form. It's a standard form, so I don't understand how they've never heard of it, or why they've repeatedly given you false information.

Fighting Irish

Play To Kill wrote: »

I doubt payments for disability etc would require the person to sign on, probably more likely that you would have to go for a yearly medical assessment or something like that but I don't know.

on the long term illness benefit, there are no checks once you start getting it