Employer Requesting Driving Documents

Walnutsink

Just got an email from work from the Health and Safety crew looking for the following information as part of the Safe Driving as Work Policy:

A copy of your current driver’s license
A copy of your insurance certificate( covered for business use)
A copy of your current NCT where appropriate
A copy of your motor tax
A copy of your vehicle service

I can understand license and insurance as I sometimes drive to places for work but I only have a social, domestic and leisure policy and they are asking for business use.

Am I completely out of order thinking they have no right to ask for vehicle service/tax/NCT?

Doom

I suppose they may have been told they have a "duty of care" if they need you to drive for work purposes. Be upfront about insurance, if they want you to drive, get them to pay the difference in the insurance, to cover you.

seamus

There has been a little bit of a push on this of late from Revenue and others. Basically it's been well known for a long time that employees have been driving their cars for business use with insurance policies which really only cover social, domestic & pleasure.

The business therefore has a duty of care to ensure that employees who use their vehicle for any kind of business purpose have an insurance policy which covers business use.

If you crash while using your vehicle for business purposes, your insurer can choose to wash their hands of you. Then it's world of pain for you, possible huge fines and disqualifications. Extending your policy to cover business use is usually cheap, €50/year or less.

The last place I was in made it a condition of claiming mileage expenses that you were covered. No cover, no mileage claim. If your company don't pay you a mileage allowance but you still have to drive places, then I agree with the above, they should pay the insurance difference.

I wouldn't say it's "out of order" asking to make sure the vehicle is taxed and NCTed. They're just trying to cover their own asses so that employees can't turn around and say their employer forced them to drive and untaxed, unNCTed vehicle for work. Whether the vehicle is tax/NCTed isn't sensitive personal information, it's a reasonable request IMO.

You can always say you don't have these documents. Then it's their move.

Walnutsink

Thanks Seamus, have made enquiries about them having a business insurance policy.

My plan for insurance/tax/NCT was to just submit a picture of the discs in my window as that is publicly on view. They can have service reports if they pay for the service. It just seems like health and safety gone mad.

eirator

OP How much driving for work do you actually do and do you carry any of the companies goods with you?

Walnutsink

It depends, could be once a month or a couple of times a month and yes, sometimes I do have to carry goods with me. Probably average bout 2000km/year.

eirator

Walnutsink wrote: »

It depends, could be once a month or a couple of times a month and yes, sometimes I do have to carry goods with me.

Well there's one reason they want business insurance, assuming there is some value in the goods they want to be able to claim for them. At least that is the reason one company I worked for insisted on insurance that covered business use.

Godge

If you carry goods with you, you definitely need business insurance.

There is a grey area around travelling for work purposes as social, domestic and pleasure covers travelling to work so if you temporarily have to go to Sligo for a meeting, are you covered? The grey area disappears if you are carrying goods as that means you definitely need business insurance - you don't carry goods to and from work.

If you are carrying goods on their behalf, it is reasonable for your employer to look for those documents, especially if they are paying mileage, a car allowance or it is in your contract.

Walnutsink

Godge wrote: »

If you carry goods with you, you definitely need business insurance.

There is a grey area around travelling for work purposes as social, domestic and pleasure covers travelling to work so if you temporarily have to go to Sligo for a meeting, are you covered? The grey area disappears if you are carrying goods as that means you definitely need business insurance - you don't carry goods to and from work.

If you are carrying goods on their behalf, it is reasonable for your employer to look for those documents, especially if they are paying mileage, a car allowance or it is in your contract.

Will need to see how much extra it is to get this built into my policy, then go to my employer with the quote and go from there.

seamus

Godge wrote: »

There is a grey area around travelling for work purposes as social, domestic and pleasure covers travelling to work so if you temporarily have to go to Sligo for a meeting, are you covered? The grey area disappears if you are carrying goods as that means you definitely need business insurance - you don't carry goods to and from work.

Go by Revenue guidelines on this;
If you're travelling from home to anywhere to do work. Then that's a commute.

If you're travelling from your workplace to anywhere to do work, then that's a business trip.

So if you occasionally have to drive from home to a meeting in Sligo, then that doesn't require business insurance. Unless you're carrying goods.

Mrs OBumble

seamus wrote: »

So if you occasionally have to drive from home to a meeting in Sligo, then that doesn't require business insurance. Unless you're carrying goods.

That's according to Revenue.

However if you have crash on your way from home to somewhere that's not your usual workplace, and you are making that trip during work hours, then your insurance company may refuse to pay unless you're covered for work use.

I say "may" 'cos I'm not totally familiar with car insurance here. But it's certainly the case in an overseas country that I'm very familiar with. And it is in line with the "full disclosure" requrirements of insurance in general.

mm_surf

The Health & Safety Authority recently published guidelines for driving at/for work:
http://www.hsa.ie/eng/Publications_and_Forms/Publications/Work_Related_Vehicles/Safe_Driving_for_Work_Handbook.html

Pages 9, 22&23 are the relevant bits here.

Although it's called "guidance", under the Health, Safety & Welfare at Work Act 2005 if you fail to follow official "guidance" then you must prove that what you are doing is safer.
Max 2 years in prison for an offence by the way.

M.

Walnutsink

mm_surf wrote: »

The Health & Safety Authority recently published guidelines for driving at/for work:
http://www.hsa.ie/eng/Publications_and_Forms/Publications/Work_Related_Vehicles/Safe_Driving_for_Work_Handbook.html

Pages 9, 22&23 are the relevant bits here.

Although it's called "guidance", under the Health, Safety & Welfare at Work Act 2005 if you fail to follow official "guidance" then you must prove that what you are doing is safer.
Max 2 years in prison for an offence by the way.

M.

Just going to surrender all my details, not worth the hassle of questioning it, and reading that handbook, their request is legit.

As for the business insurance thing, my employer seems to think that you only need to have this if you are carrying heavy goods that could have an effect on the loading of your car which is bs!

mm_surf

I'd be more concerned with what your insurance company thinks is covered, not what your employer does - unless they'd like to pay your costs in the case of an accident!

Their request isn't anything unusual, nor anything to worry about, to be honest.

You can't be "contractually oblidged" to change your circumstances to deal with changes in the law unreasonably, i.e. you shouldn't have to change your insurance without reasonable compensation from the company, just because now they want you to.

Assuming, of course, that you're with them over 12 months.

Less than that, and you're on shaky ground.

I used to rack up about 1,000 miles a month for business, travelling between sites. My insurance co. was fine with that under the SDP category.

The only other thing I'd mention is that the company could argue that your mileage rate is to cover maintenance etc, not just fuel.

M.

gerryo

mm_surf wrote: »

...You can't be "contractually oblidged" to change your circumstances to deal with changes in the law unreasonably, i.e. you shouldn't have to change your insurance without reasonable compensation from the company, just because now they want you to.

Agree
If a company requires you to have business insurance for a private vehicle, it sounds like it's a necessary work related expense & either the company pays the extra cost or you claim it back from Revenue.

It all sounds a bit strange, as it might be cheaper for a company to get insurance themselves for employees, but I guess this way saves costs.