Irish drivers VS The Yellow Box

H3llR4iser

Seriously, how hard can it be to understand how to use them?

It looks like nobody know that you can actually enter the yellow box and wait for a gap in traffic while turning right. There must be some serious flaw in the theory and practical test teachings when it comes to this.

mickdw

To be fair most people know this.

ba_barabus

What's a yellow box?

Mycroft H

ba_barabus wrote: »

What's a yellow box?

This

ba_barabus

ZING!

bidiots

mickdw wrote: »

To be fair most people know this.

You would be surprised, really

The_Nipper_One

H3llR4iser wrote: »

There must be some serious flaw in the theory and practical test teachings when it comes to this.

Nope. It's taught alright.

CiniO

H3llR4iser wrote: »

Seriously, how hard can it be to understand how to use them?

It looks like nobody know that you can actually enter the yellow box and wait for a gap in traffic while turning right. There must be some serious flaw in the theory and practical test teachings when it comes to this.

What practical and theory test teaching?


AFAIR up to 2 years ago, there was no need to take any driving lessons whatsoever.

Up to around year 2000, there was no theory tests.

And in 70's and 80's lots of people actually got licence without even passing a driving test.

So vast majority of Irish drivers, got their licence in hand without even hearing about yellow boxes...

Also there are plenty of foreign drivers in here, who either exchanged their EU licence for Irish one or just drive on EU or other licence, and they also never heard about yellow boxes.

Voodoomelon

^^ We should sticky that post and use it as a reply to every question that gets asked about Irish driving.

corktina

yellow box? pah..on sunday I came across a car PARKED in the yellow box in Patrick St Cork ACROSS Academy st with another the other side of the junction partially blocking Academy St leaving just enough room for two lanes of trafic to sqeeze by single file. Irish drivers don't CARE what a yellow box is for, the attitude is always "me first"

bmstuff

When safe to do so, I systematically overtake the driver in front of me that waits to turn right but stops at the green light too afraid of enterring the yellow box. They always take off when the light goes orange.
That pissed off a few of them, but I don't care, the yellow box does not bite.

ABajaninCork

corktina wrote: »

yellow box? pah..on sunday I came across a car PARKED in the yellow box in Patrick St Cork ACROSS Academy st with another the other side of the junction partially blocking Academy St leaving just enough room for two lanes of trafic to sqeeze by single file. Irish drivers don't CARE what a yellow box is for, the attitude is always "me first"

Ha ha - I saw that too! . I think it was a taxi, they always do crap like that. Pity the car wasn't booked...

A2LUE42

CiniO wrote: »

What practical and theory test teaching?


AFAIR up to 2 years ago, there was no need to take any driving lessons whatsoever.

Up to around year 2000, there was no theory tests.

And in 70's and 80's lots of people actually got licence without even passing a driving test.

So vast majority of Irish drivers, got their licence in hand without even hearing about yellow boxes...

Also there are plenty of foreign drivers in here, who either exchanged their EU licence for Irish one or just drive on EU or other licence, and they also never heard about yellow boxes.

Tests.. who needs them.

In the 80's there was an add on the telly of the man painting the yellow box. Job Done.

djimi

I think a lot of people seem to be of the mindset that you never stop in a yellow box, period. Like its some kind of mystical vortex that will swallow you car into the twilight zone if you dare enter it...

ABajaninCork

CiniO wrote: »

So vast majority of Irish drivers, got their licence in hand without even hearing about yellow boxes...

Also there are plenty of foreign drivers in here, who either exchanged their EU licence for Irish one or just drive on EU or other licence, and they also never heard about yellow boxes.

Shouldn't foreign drivers MAKE it their business to understand the ROTR if they intend to drive here? I would've thought that made sense. I drive on a UK licence and most certainly understand the principle of box junctions as we have them at home. The law is strictly enforced, especially in London. It'll be £60 and three points if you're caught, as there are cameras situated at the box junctions.

djimi

CiniO wrote: »

So vast majority of Irish drivers, got their licence in hand without even hearing about yellow boxes...

Lets not get carried away here. There was a very small number of amnesty licenses handed out in the late 70s (which account for maybe 0.5% of the licenses on the road today if they all still driving), and Id say it a very small minority of drivers who would be able to pass the test without ever having taken a lesson or reading the rules of the road. I got my license before theory test came in, and you still had to have a decent knowledge of the rules of the road as there was a theory part of the test.

furtzy

CiniO wrote: »

What practical and theory test teaching?


AFAIR up to 2 years ago, there was no need to take any driving lessons whatsoever.

Up to around year 2000, there was no theory tests.

And in 70's and 80's lots of people actually got licence without even passing a driving test.

So vast majority of Irish drivers, got their licence in hand without even hearing about yellow boxes...

Also there are plenty of foreign drivers in here, who either exchanged their EU licence for Irish one or just drive on EU or other licence, and they also never heard about yellow boxes.

You still had to learn the rules of the road and were quizzed on them as a part of the test so the vast majority do know about them....they just choose to ignore them

GreeBo

bmstuff wrote: »

When safe to do so, I systematically overtake the driver in front of me that waits to turn right but stops at the green light too afraid of enterring the yellow box. They always take off when the light goes orange.
That pissed off a few of them, but I don't care, the yellow box does not bite.

Yeah. Erm its not that people are "afraid" of the Yellow Box, its that some people understand how traffic flow works and blocking it like a numpty just fecks up the traffic for everyone, including the numpty themselves...but you go right ahead and keep gaining that extra 10 feet of your important journey there Frodo Baggins :rolleyes:

corktina

GreeBo wrote: »

Yeah. Erm its not that people are "afraid" of the Yellow Box, its that some people understand how traffic flow works and blocking it like a numpty just fecks up the traffic for everyone, including the numpty themselves...but you go right ahead and keep gaining that extra 10 feet of your important journey there Frodo Baggins :rolleyes:

the point of the yellow box is you do not enter it unless your exit is clear. In the case of turning right, you can enter if your exit is clear but you cannot exit currently due to opposing traffic. When that clears, you can proceed, thus you are not blocking traffic flow and maybe one or two others can follow you before the light goes red. If you sit on the stop line, you are denying those cars (and yourself) the chance to clear the lights,should they change. I'm afraid it's you who doesn't understand how traffic works!

dj1980

GreeBo wrote: »

Yeah. Erm its not that people are "afraid" of the Yellow Box, its that some people understand how traffic flow works and blocking it like a numpty just fecks up the traffic for everyone, including the numpty themselves...but you go right ahead and keep gaining that extra 10 feet of your important journey there Frodo Baggins :rolleyes:

Not necessarily.
There's a nightmare junction in Galway that requires cars turning right to move forward about 1/3 into the yellow box and wait for a break in oncoming traffic.
I was told this by an RSA instructor and was told if I didn't pull forward in my test to allow a gap for cars behind me that I would be penalised.

He also said that even if the light goes red you have to make the right turn because if you're in there when the light is red and traffic from your left/right is moving, then you fail.


So it's situational really.

corktina

dj1980 wrote: »

Not necessarily.
There's a nightmare junction in Galway that requires cars turning right to move forward about 1/3 into the yellow box and wait for a break in oncoming traffic.
I was told this by an RSA instructor and was told if I didn't pull forward in my test to allow a gap for cars behind me that I would be penalised.

He also said that even if the light goes red you have to make the right turn because if you're in there when the light is red and traffic from your left/right is moving, then you fail.


So it's situational really.

once you cross the line, the red light doesn't apply to you anymore and you should proceed once the way is clear, that's the point of being allowed to enter the yellow box on a right turn.

H3llR4iser

CiniO wrote: »

...Also there are plenty of foreign drivers in here, who either exchanged their EU licence for Irish one or just drive on EU or other licence, and they also never heard about yellow boxes...

Yeah, I'm one of them. Have an Italian license, and there's no such thing as a "Yellow Box" in Italy. However, the very first time I saw one I immediately went "what the heck is that?" and proceeded to educate myself. I didn't even have a car at the time

dj1980 wrote: »

Not necessarily.
There's a nightmare junction in Galway that requires cars turning right to move forward about 1/3 into the yellow box and wait for a break in oncoming traffic.
I was told this by an RSA instructor and was told if I didn't pull forward in my test to allow a gap for cars behind me that I would be penalised.

He also said that even if the light goes red you have to make the right turn because if you're in there when the light is red and traffic from your left/right is moving, then you fail.

So it's situational really.

Not situational at all really, if you are the first car at a red light and intend to turn right, you have to proceed into the yellow box, wait for a suitable gap in traffic and complete the maneuver - even if the light went red in the process. The whole yellow box concept is designed exactly for this purpose - not block cars coming from another direction if one is suffering a tailback, and make it so that at least a few cars intending to turn right actually make it on each green light cycle.

Iwannahurl

GreeBo wrote: »

Yeah. Erm its not that people are "afraid" of the Yellow Box, its that some people understand how traffic flow works and blocking it like a numpty just fecks up the traffic for everyone, including the numpty themselves...but you go right ahead and keep gaining that extra 10 feet of your important journey there Frodo Baggins

I will take the box, though I do not know the way...

dj1980 wrote: »

Not necessarily.
There's a nightmare junction in Galway that requires cars turning right to move forward about 1/3 into the yellow box and wait for a break in oncoming traffic.

I was told this by an RSA instructor and was told if I didn't pull forward in my test to allow a gap for cars behind me that I would be penalised.

He also said that even if the light goes red you have to make the right turn because if you're in there when the light is red and traffic from your left/right is moving, then you fail.

So it's situational really.

That's my understanding of how yellow boxes work generally, so nothing new there? Which junction in Galway is it, by the way?

From the RoTR:

You must not enter the yellow box junction unless you can clear it without stopping.

An exception is when you want to turn right. In this case, you may enter the yellow box junction while waiting for a gap in traffic coming from the opposite direction. However, don't enter the box if to do so would block other traffic that has the right of way.

GreeBo

Iwannahurl wrote: »

I will take the box, though I do not know the way...






That's my understanding of how yellow boxes work generally, so nothing new there? Which junction in Galway is it, by the way?

From the RoTR:

You must not enter the yellow box junction unless you can clear it without stopping.

An exception is when you want to turn right. In this case, you may enter the yellow box junction while waiting for a gap in traffic coming from the opposite direction. However, don't enter the box if to do so would block other traffic that has the right of way.

The second image there blocks the traffic coming from the left and imo is wrong.

You often see that the lights change and then no traffic can move because the red car is preventing it.

corktina

GreeBo wrote: »

The second image there blocks the traffic coming from the left and imo is wrong.

You often see that the lights change and then no traffic can move because the red car is preventing it.

thats what it's saying...and why the car is red isn't it? Your exit MUST be clear...

The_Nipper_One

H3llR4iser wrote: »

Not situational at all really, if you are the first car at a red light and intend to turn right, you have to proceed into the yellow box, wait for a suitable gap in traffic and complete the maneuver - even if the light went red in the process. The whole yellow box concept is designed exactly for this purpose - not block cars coming from another direction if one is suffering a tailback, and make it so that at least a few cars intending to turn right actually make it on each green light cycle.

You only proceed into the junction when your light turns green.
There are no instances when a light is red that you would cross a stop marking.

corktina

The_Nipper_One wrote: »

You only proceed into the junction when your light turns green.
There are no instances when a light is red that you would cross a stop marking.

yeah that's obviously not what he meant!

GreeBo

corktina wrote: »

thats what it's saying...and why the car is red isn't it? Your exit MUST be clear...

to me its saying that its ok as it shows the green car is not blocked...but I think it ignores the fact that the priority will change when the lights (not shown in this example) change.

The_Nipper_One

corktina wrote: »

yeah that's obviously not what he meant!

Regardless, it's what he said. Suppose a new driver was reading the forum and saw that remark without anyone correcting him, what then?

Better safe than sorry.

For Paws

Is it beyond the RSA to provide a 'moving' illustration of the 'Yellow Box' situation ?

The image above explains nothing definitively.

As previously posted, the second image shows a situation where usage of the box when turning right could block traffic, not enable it.

Eg; All carriageways shown in the illustration are dual - this is usually not the case. If all these carriageways were single, and the 'green' car wanted to turn right, it could not do so as the 'red' car is blocking his exit. Thus traffic in both directions is blocked.

corktina

GreeBo wrote: »

to me its saying that its ok as it shows the green car is not blocked...but I think it ignores the fact that the priority will change when the lights (not shown in this example) change.

it's quite clear..."you don't enter the box unless your exit is clear" if you can't exit to the right due to queued traffic beyond the box on your route, you don't enter..

Iwannahurl

Right turns excepted...

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=EWQ7WoB6BCc

corktina

if only it were real...

dgt

For Paws wrote: »

Is it beyond the RSA to provide a 'moving' illustration of the 'Yellow Box' situation ?

The image above explains nothing definitively.

Left image: charge round in front of oncoming traffic to make up valuable seconds and get out of the box as quick as possible

Right image: bully out onto the box and repeatedly sound the horn to get traffic ahead to move. Should this fail, just sit there and text Mary, other drivers will understand....

An animation would definitely be more effective

CiniO

ABajaninCork wrote: »

Shouldn't foreign drivers MAKE it their business to understand the ROTR if they intend to drive here?

Of course they should. But in reality most of them don't.
In general most people don't care about driving, and understanding and knowing the rules. They just want to get from A to B.
People like us here on this forum which would follow every update to traffic law are exceptions.

I would've thought that made sense. I drive on a UK licence and most certainly understand the principle of box junctions as we have them at home. The law is strictly enforced, especially in London. It'll be £60 and three points if you're caught, as there are cameras situated at the box junctions.

Confess honestly - if you plan to drive in foreign country f.e. as a tourist, do you go exactly through their rules of the road?

CiniO

H3llR4iser wrote: »

Yeah, I'm one of them. Have an Italian license, and there's no such thing as a "Yellow Box" in Italy. However, the very first time I saw one I immediately went "what the heck is that?" and proceeded to educate myself. I didn't even have a car at the time

Same as me, but we are in minority.

ABajaninCork

CiniO wrote: »

Confess honestly - if you plan to drive in foreign country f.e. as a tourist, do you go exactly through their rules of the road?

I've driven in France. Yes, just enough that I could drive on the right without crashing. I've also driven in Barbados and Jamaica. Although both drive on the left like the UK and here, and therefore similar, I did have my relatives give me a crash course on the Highway Code. So, although not through, I knew enough to keep me sane(!!!) on the roads.

GreeBo

corktina wrote: »

it's quite clear..."you don't enter the box unless your exit is clear" if you can't exit to the right due to queued traffic beyond the box on your route, you don't enter..

The image is not clear.
It should have a great big X in the second example.
Its not obvious (to me anyway) that the second image is not allowed.
A picture says a thousand words, perhaps thats why people think its ok to do what the second picture indicates (despite the wording above it saying its not) and thus junctions are fubar'd?

What's wrong with the second example, you wait on the yellow box behind that traffic, the green car can still go straight on cos the red one is out of his way... and the blue car couldn't have been blocked because it couldn't have come through the box anyway, the traffic is stopped

The wording on the website doesn't say not to do picture 2

bluewolf

bluewolf wrote: »

What's wrong with the second example, you wait on the yellow box behind that traffic, the green car can still go straight on cos the red one is out of his way... and the blue car couldn't have been blocked because it couldn't have come through the box anyway, the traffic is stopped

The wording on the website doesn't say not to do picture 2

Maybe my head's a bit mush at the moment (I am knackered) but when I seen both images I thought the first one (left one) was the wrong one, no? As you're blocking traffic coming from the right (which is a no-no as far as the wording seems to go?).

Or are they both wrong? Jesus my head is all over the place today.

belcampprisoner

http://www.rulesoftheroad.ie/rules-for-driving/junctions-roundabouts/yellow-box-junctions.html

Deleted User

Deleted User wrote: »

Maybe my head's a bit mush at the moment (I am knackered) but when I seen both images I thought the first one (left one) was the wrong one, no? As you're blocking traffic coming from the right (which is a no-no as far as the wording seems to go?).

Or are they both wrong? Jesus my head is all over the place today.

Neither is wrong as far as I can see
First paragraph on link: Don't enter without stopping

Second paragraph with these two pictures: the exception to that rule is when you are turning right.
Then we see two examples of people using it (correctly) to turn right

GreeBo

In the second example if the lights change then traffic going left to right is blocked as the red car is in the middle of the junction.

mb1725

http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-21023615

:eek:

Supergurrier

Shurrre i've right of way anyway

ABajaninCork

mb1725 wrote: »

http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-21023615

:eek:

What did I tell you?

ABajaninCork wrote: »

Shouldn't foreign drivers MAKE it their business to understand the ROTR if they intend to drive here? I would've thought that made sense. I drive on a UK licence and most certainly understand the principle of box junctions as we have them at home. The law is strictly enforced, especially in London. It'll be £60 and three points if you're caught, as there are cameras situated at the box junctions.

Lucky it wasn't Euston Road by Madame Tussaud's. It's LETHAL there!!!