Etihad International Cadet Programme

Lustrum

For anyone who's interested, Etihad have opened up an international cadet programme. Follow the link

http://careers.etihadairways.com/ehire/english/JobSearch.aspx

Closing date is 7th May, you need to have a BSc "or equivalent" to apply, and you must be under 30.

Best of luck to anyone who applies!

BrakePad

Lustrum wrote: »

For anyone who's interested, Etihad have opened up an international cadet programme. Follow the link

http://careers.etihadairways.com/ehire/english/JobSearch.aspx

Closing date is 7th May, you need to have a BSc "or equivalent" to apply, and you must be under 30.

Best of luck to anyone who applies!

That blows

Xpro

Lustrum wrote: »

For anyone who's interested, Etihad have opened up an international cadet programme. Follow the link

http://careers.etihadairways.com/ehire/english/JobSearch.aspx

Closing date is 7th May, you need to have a BSc "or equivalent" to apply, and you must be under 30.

Best of luck to anyone who applies!

x2

Im 30 and no good:(:D

happy_head

gutted! It is annoying that you need a Science degree, why is this a criteria for a cadet programme?!? I'm sure there are shop assistants, brick layers, people from all walks of life that could be top class pilots...what makes a guy with a science degree more suitable? The guy might not have hands to bless himself! :mad: What I am trying to say is what the hell does having a science degree prove?

artanevilla

Would have thought a Beng would be more apt.

BrakePad

happy_head wrote: »

gutted! It is annoying that you need a Science degree, why is this a criteria for a cadet programme?!? I'm sure there are shop assistants, brick layers, people from all walks of life that could be top class pilots...what makes a guy with a science degree more suitable? The guy might not have hands to bless himself! :mad: What I am trying to say is what the hell does having a science degree prove?

College "matures" you. You can drink every night funded by tax payers money and hide from the hard realities of life in college!

Given that large numbers of people "go to college" in most Western countries now the whole graduate concept in a little bit of a mute point. Most people do a degree and then seek a job in any other area but the area of that degree. If someone came to me with a Science degree and wanted to be a pilot I'd be inclined to ask them what happened to Science? They say it shows you have the "staying power" to do a degree...but of course not the staying power to go into that area when you get it.....in other words you're prone to waste large amounts of your own and other people's time!

At that FLYER exhibition one exhibitor told me that a degree shows a DE candidate has the "grit and determination" to get through a degree and that means they know the candidate has those parts to their persona.
Of course self sponsored pilot training does not require any Grit or Determination to start/continue/complete... :rolleyes:

RainyDay

Lustrum wrote: »

and you must be under 30.

BrakePad wrote: »

That blows

It's not just that it blows, it is probably in breach of equality legislation to discriminate based on age in that way. If you feel strongly, get on to the Equality Authority or take a case to the Equality Tribunual.

Xpro wrote: »

x2

Im 30 and no good:(:D

Are you sure? Is it 'under 30' or 'up to 30'?

brandon_flowers

RainyDay wrote: »

It's not just that it blows, it is probably in breach of equality legislation to discriminate based on age in that way. If you feel strongly, get on to the Equality Authority or take a case to the Equality Tribunual.



Are you sure? Is it 'under 30' or 'up to 30'?

If you find an Equality Authority in Abu Dhabi you will be doing ever so well. It is not a democracy therefore if you want the job you play by their rules.

Nonoperational

happy_head wrote: »

gutted! It is annoying that you need a Science degree, why is this a criteria for a cadet programme?!? I'm sure there are shop assistants, brick layers, people from all walks of life that could be top class pilots...what makes a guy with a science degree more suitable? The guy might not have hands to bless himself! :mad: What I am trying to say is what the hell does having a science degree prove?

Because that's what the airline wants, and their free to put whatever conditions they wish on it. I'm sure there are plenty people that would be great pilots, but they won't be getting the chance with Ethiad unless they have a science degree.
From the airlines point of view, it gives them a candidate that they at least know has a decent level of academic ability. They're investing money in the training and obviously want someone who at least has the ability to complete a basic degree. Don't blame them really.

BrakePad wrote: »

College "matures" you. You can drink every night funded by tax payers money and hide from the hard realities of life in college!

Given that large numbers of people "go to college" in most Western countries now the whole graduate concept in a little bit of a mute point. Most people do a degree and then seek a job in any other area but the area of that degree. If someone came to me with a Science degree and wanted to be a pilot I'd be inclined to ask them what happened to Science? They say it shows you have the "staying power" to do a degree...but of course not the staying power to go into that area when you get it.....in other words you're prone to waste large amounts of your own and other people's time!

At that FLYER exhibition one exhibitor told me that a degree shows a DE candidate has the "grit and determination" to get through a degree and that means they know the candidate has those parts to their persona.
Of course self sponsored pilot training does not require any Grit or Determination to start/continue/complete... :rolleyes:

Ha, that's pretty funny. I presume it's a joke.

Pilotdude5

BrakePad wrote: »

If someone came to me with a Science degree and wanted to be a pilot I'd be inclined to ask them what happened to Science? They say it shows you have the "staying power" to do a degree...but of course not the staying power to go into that area when you get it.....in other words you're prone to waste large amounts of your own and other people's time!

You're definitely right here. I would have much more respect for someone who realized their mistake(too far below to glideslope) and dropped out(went around!), over someone who will ignore it and end up busting minima is not a good virtue.
I often assume when someone says a degree in something is worthwhile, they themselves have a degree they never used and are trying to justify wasting 4-5 years of their life. Having a science degree might help you through certain parts of ground school but thats it.
Flying is a different profession. An ATPL is something not to be looked down on.
Just to clarify I have absolutely no problem with someone coming to flying 5-10 years down the line having had a career from their degree and realising they want a career change, its coming straight out of college with a degree in "being third level educated" I have a problem with.

There are plenty of pilots out there who would love to fly with Etihad, why ignore them and reward people who made the wrong career choice?

Dr.Rieux

On the other side of the coin some responses make it seem like people here wouldn't hire someone because they have a degree.

brandon_flowers

I think people are getting completely mixed up between a BSc titled degree and having a degree in Science. You can have a BSc in Construction Management which is hardly a science nor is having a BSc in Aviation Business Management. But they are all third level qualifications which is what Etihad are looking for.

I'm sure if you apply without a BSc and your resume is strong enough you will make it through initial screening at least.

Pilotdude5

brandon_flowers wrote: »

I'm sure if you apply without a BSc and your resume is strong enough you will make it through initial screening at least.

That may be the case and I hope it is. But instead of a BSc in Marketing being a positive on a resume, shouldn't it be a red-flag? This candidate changed their career once, what's to stop them wandering off to Zoology or Anthropology 5 years down the line?

I may be being a bit harsh here but its making a mockery of the profession IMO.

Its been a tough few years but come on lads and lassies! Show a bit a pride in flying!

Dr.Rieux

Pilotdude5 wrote: »

That may be the case and I hope it is. But instead of a BSc in Marketing being a positive on a resume, shouldn't it be a red-flag? This candidate changed their career once, what's to stop them wandering off to Zoology or Anthropology 5 years down the line?

I may be being a bit harsh here but its making a mockery of the profession IMO.

Its been a tough few years but come on lads and lassies! Show a bit a pride in flying!

You could argue the very same for someone who worked elsewhere without a degree. They've already left one career, what's to stop them leaving to do something else 5 years down the line?

Dr.Rieux

I'd like to point out that personally I can see no reason why they'd only accept applicants with bsc or similar. But to suggest that someone with a degree changing to flying shows they have no staying power I think is ridiculous.

Should be open to all but they make the rules unfortunately

brandon_flowers

I think you are being extremely harsh actually. There are many reasons why someone has to change not least the fact that there are **** all jobs in Ireland (and lots of other developed countries) for graduates of any description.

Edit: And more on topic if someone does get called for an interview they can ask you whatever they want. When I came for my first interview here in Monaco I was asked what age my girlfriend was, do we plan on having kids? Have you traveled for extended periods/planning on taking a year out etc? Turns out Monaco doesn't have to follow any of these EU equality/fairness policies. It is the same in the UAE especially bigger companies like Etihad, they love having this freedom in interviews.

Pilotdude5

Look fair enough I was being harsh. People are entitled to career changes, always have been and always will.
I hope however that in the Aviation & Aircraft forum with thousand of our own colleagues out of work, nobody is going to support other professions getting work over pilots. We can't exactly decide the hiring criteria of a private company but surely we can point out how illogical it is.

A point on the fact they can ask whatever they want. I for one can never work in the mid-east as it is today due to personal circumstances. I'm not to type to live in a western bubble compound and turn a blind eye. I would last a month before being arrested and deported for being the same fully functional person I am in Ireland.

That of course is a matter for other forums.

brandon_flowers

Pilotdude5 wrote: »

I hope however that in the Aviation & Aircraft forum with thousand of our own colleagues out of work, nobody is going to support other professions getting work over pilots. We can't exactly decide the hiring criteria of a private company but surely we can point out how illogical it is.

I wouldn't say its illogical at all. It is what they are looking for that matters to them. And again, if I decided to apply with my B.Eng and 0 flying hours versus someone with no degree and 100 hours or even 20 hours of flying time I'm sure we know who gets picked.

No.username

The age old question guys... Do you think having a PPL will have an advantage or disadvantage?

Dingle_berry

BSc is a degree in science. To get a degree in science you should have studied all four core sciences (maths, physics, chemistry and biology). The language of science is English so to get a BSc you must have some English if it isn't your first language.
I assume parts of pilot training touch on biological aspects (circadian rhythms, oxygen requirements and deprivation), chemistry (air compisition, density, etc), physics (force, motion, etc) and maths (x miles, y fuel, z weight =?). And the language of aviation is English.
There are the links that I see. On top of that someone with a BSc has completed an academic an practical course and probably has an alternative career to fall back on and repay the massive loan if they fail as a cadet.

A person working on the shop floor may have an excellent work ethic, be fanatical about aviation and speak fluent English but how do you measure and prove that on paper? How do you compare that to the next person? HR will receive a massive amount of applications. They can't interview them all or scrutinise each one individually so they set a general, minimum standard. It's common practise.

Lustrum

It could also be something as simple as an awareness that as it is open internationally, there is a potential for 100,000+ applicants (the last figure I heard for Cathay was 74,000 applicants) so perhaps it's their way of narrowing down the hr work in any way possible. Not that I agree or disagree with it, but I can understand why etihad have a minimum qualification

Dr.Rieux

Pilotdude5 wrote: »

I hope however that in the Aviation & Aircraft forum with thousand of our own colleagues out of work, nobody is going to support other professions getting work over pilots. We can't exactly decide the hiring criteria of a private company but surely we can point out how illogical it is.

I was also under the impression that the cadet ship wasn't about hiring pilots, but about making their own as it were?

A Primal Nut

As far as I know there is a lot of science involved in studying to be a pilot. They don't want to put a lot of time and money into someone who can't pass the theoretical parts. So as they will get a high volume of applicants, narrowing it down to people with a BSc is easier for them.

That said, there are plenty of Bsc graduates who won't be good at the practical part, but maybe they have some way of measuring the practical aspect also. Ideally they want both I guess.

LeftBase

A Primal Nut wrote: »

As far as I know there is a lot of science involved in studying to be a pilot. They don't want to put a lot of time and money into someone who can't pass the theoretical parts. So as they will get a high volume of applicants, narrowing it down to people with a BSc is easier for them.

That said, there are plenty of Bsc graduates who won't be good at the practical part, but maybe they have some way of measuring the practical aspect also. Ideally they want both I guess.

There isnt actually an awful lot of advanced science involved. Certainly not enough to need a degree to understand. The ATPL knowledge exams are somewhat like a pseudo degree in themselves. Certainly when I was studying for them I was putting in more hours and effort than some friends in their final year of college!

What gets me is the fact that people may get degrees in Accounting or Commerce or Psychology etc and then apply for a cadetship. They meet the Bsc requirement but have no real relevant knowledge from those degrees that lends itself hugely to the job of a pilot.

University is not what it once was. In the past going to college was seen as a big thing and a real testament to your level of education. These days it is more the exception for a kid to not go and do some sort of degree or further level of education. Kids look at their school results and guess that they may get 400 CAO points. They then search the colleges for courses in and around 400 points and say they'll do them just so that they can go to college. They then go on the batter for 75% of the term and sober up to skate through their exams.:cool:

In a fully sponsored cadetship an airline wants "stickability". They want you to stay with them for a long time and repay their investment in you. If somebody comes along 3 months after graduation with a Law degree you have to ask why he is not chasing a career in law. If he says "oh I decided it was not for me" then that is fair enough, do what makes you happy....however how do the airline know that he will not be saying the same in 2 year's time at an interview to be a Bank Worker?
The above being said if a lawyer came to you after 10 years of law and said he fancied a different challenge then that is another matter. He has shown an ability to do a job and wants something new.

If I was to start Leftbase Airways tomorrow and had enough money to fully fund a cadetship for 20 people I would set the bar at a University Degree and/or a JAA PPL. That way you keep the age profile up a bit but do not discount those who had the drive, determination and interest in aviation to pursue a pilot's license.

Nonoperational

Having the PPL as an either/or is a great idea to be honest.

Jocry

RainyDay wrote: »

Are you sure? Is it 'under 30' or 'up to 30'?

Just checked, "Are you aged between 21 and 30" - I'd assume up to and including 30!! Im 30, interesting

dannye92

doing a B.Eng in aviation technology...you'd think they'd prefer something like that rather than a Science degree..

Contrails

dannye92 wrote: »

doing a B.Eng in aviation technology...you'd think they'd prefer something like that rather than a Science degree..

Would that not come under the heading of "... or equivalent"? I'd certainly imagine that is more than acceptable.

I on the other hand have 2 years of college left. My PPL is also useless to me unfortunately... I'd stick your name in the hat pal.

dannye92

whats the main difference between a B.Eng and a BSc? would they be the same? Suppose you're right its worth a go at the least

phonypony

Contrails wrote: »

Would that not come under the heading of "... or equivalent"? I'd certainly imagine that is more than acceptable.

Although there are many that will look down on a 3 year level 7 degree...

Contrails

phonypony wrote: »

Although there are many that will look down on a 3 year level 7 degree...

True. But there is no "(hons)" specified. It is possible to get an ordinary BSc as well as an ordinary B.Eng.Tech so i'd still chance my arm. Nothing to lose really.

phonypony

Contrails wrote: »

True. But there is no "(hons)" specified. It is possible to get an ordinary BSc as well as an ordinary B.Eng.Tech so i'd still chance my arm. Nothing to lose really.

Absolutely!

cson

LeftBase wrote: »

There isnt actually an awful lot of advanced science involved. Certainly not enough to need a degree to understand. The ATPL knowledge exams are somewhat like a pseudo degree in themselves. Certainly when I was studying for them I was putting in more hours and effort than some friends in their final year of college!

What gets me is the fact that people may get degrees in Accounting or Commerce or Psychology etc and then apply for a cadetship. They meet the Bsc requirement but have no real relevant knowledge from those degrees that lends itself hugely to the job of a pilot.

University is not what it once was. In the past going to college was seen as a big thing and a real testament to your level of education. These days it is more the exception for a kid to not go and do some sort of degree or further level of education. Kids look at their school results and guess that they may get 400 CAO points. They then search the colleges for courses in and around 400 points and say they'll do them just so that they can go to college. They then go on the batter for 75% of the term and sober up to skate through their exams.:cool:

In a fully sponsored cadetship an airline wants "stickability". They want you to stay with them for a long time and repay their investment in you. If somebody comes along 3 months after graduation with a Law degree you have to ask why he is not chasing a career in law. If he says "oh I decided it was not for me" then that is fair enough, do what makes you happy....however how do the airline know that he will not be saying the same in 2 year's time at an interview to be a Bank Worker?
The above being said if a lawyer came to you after 10 years of law and said he fancied a different challenge then that is another matter. He has shown an ability to do a job and wants something new.

If I was to start Leftbase Airways tomorrow and had enough money to fully fund a cadetship for 20 people I would set the bar at a University Degree and/or a JAA PPL. That way you keep the age profile up a bit but do not discount those who had the drive, determination and interest in aviation to pursue a pilot's license.

**** me that's a bitter post.

Do you have sources to back up the figures you quoted there or are they from the Pulled-It-Out-Of-My-Arse Institute?

fwiw Ethiad are free to set their entry requirements as they see fit; I'm sure there's other avenues and opportunities out there for 30+ applicants or those without BSc degrees.

LeftBase

cson wrote: »

**** me that's a bitter post.

Do you have sources to back up the figures you quoted there or are they from the Pulled-It-Out-Of-My-Arse Institute?

fwiw Ethiad are free to set their entry requirements as they see fit; I'm sure there's other avenues and opportunities out there for 30+ applicants or those without BSc degrees.

I'm not in the slightest bit bitter. I have a job and a career path and am reasonably close to home base wise. That's more than can be said for the majority of my college educated friends, many of who are on the dole or have no interest in pursuing their studied field.
Why you perceive it as bitter I'm not sure!

I never said Etihad couldnt set whatever requirements they want. I was just highlighting the pit falls of putting a blanket "must have a degree" rule in place.

Pilotdude5

To reiterate my previous points, HR viewing a standalone degree a positive is something I just don't agree with. A degree + years of work is obviously a positive and says a lot of good about the candidate. If the candidate has a degree but no work exp. due to lack of work thats perfectly fine too. We all know its a struggle out there at the moment.

If a candidate just has their degree to tell people they have it, then surely can't be looked on as a positive. If I recently had a Bsc and used it to apply to grad programmes in other random industries I would find myself feeling very guilty. My degree would just be gathering dust in the shed, whereas someone else might have used it! Yes an increase in the education levels is a plus for society, but only if the knowledge is used!. If its used as "CV filler" its more detrimental than anything, and devalues the qualification. These days, people tell you they have a degree first and what it's in second(If they even tell you at all).

I know obviously in this case it's used as a filter, but why not a PPL or even completed ATPL exams? That would filter out enough candidates while leaving a large enough pool to choose from. I would consider them less of a training risk than someone who studied Marketing or Nutrition.

To add: A CEO of a large airline started off in the company in a sales graduate programme, straight after college. What was his degree? - Zoology. It worked out for him but I probably wouldn't have hired him in the first place.

TWITME

Hello ALL!
I am a rookie to this group....
i read this forum from top to bottom!!
got a quick question- I have a BSc aviation from UND and also got all my FAA flight ratings done. but I Sure ended up with a huge loan to pay from my nose! but then again thought that was the type of requirements that are needed in todays airline industry from junior pilots...
will it be too much for etihad since they prefer in recruiting freshers with no flight experience.. and I've heard that the UAE GCAA ATPL is a killer but then again anyone here knows where I might stand with Etihad.. ??? anyone?

TWITME

HAs anyone been contacted yet?

unattendedbag

Got called for first assessment day. An hour long they say and bring a calculator. What level of maths will they expect from someone with zero flight hours.