Has learning to drive become nothing but a money making racket?!

thenewmanIII

Last March I started learning to drive since then I have been giving four different instructors they all say something different to each other. I know
I need to get out more when my father is around (I remember I was advised
never to go driving with your parents) but I don't really have a choice. Apart
of me extremly hates driving..
Although I have heard that there is people out there who hate driving that have passed the test. I am getting more and more put off by it learning to drive and really losing the enthuasism. I have one more EDT lesson to do and I don't see the point of the log book when the best thing to do is for your driving instructor tells you your mistakes and what to work on.
I do thing driving has become nothing but a money making racket. According to a friend of mine who lives in Austrailia it takes them two years before they get a full license.

thenewmanIII

by the way I had edt and extra driving lessons when I first started.

sandin

The fact that people still die because of stupid young drivers who don't know how to drive properly negates your argument. Up til recently it was thesingle biggest group who had serious accidents. Then the new driving rules started to have effect.

When you are driving you effectively have a 1ton machine in your hands - not knowing how to use it properly can prove fatal.

The rules of the road outline exactly how you should drive and the instructor is there to ensure you put them in place on a practical level. If an instructor tells you somethign that is at odds with the rule book, ask them why?

BTW - the most contentious item is roundabouts and indicators. Once you understand that an INDICATOR indicates to other mororists what you are plannign to do on the roundabout, then you are on the way to knowing rounabouts well. - e.g. if going straight though a roundabout you do not indicate on the approach as cars already know you are going onto the roundabout. (sooo many get this wrong), also when goin straight through a roundabout you use the left lane unless indicated otherwise by road signage.

ABajaninCork

Was this a serious question OP? I mean. How on earth is teaching a life skill safely and properly a money making racket? :rolleyes:

Jesus wept...

ABajaninCork

It also occurs to me that if you're cribbing about the cost, then you cannot afford to drive...

dudara

Moving to the Learning to Drive Forum

Personally, the move to standardised driving instruction is one of the best things to happen in Ireland. We need to move away from this sense of entitlement about driving to realising that it is a skill you have to learn and prove.

OP - I don't know why you've moved around between instructors. You really should find an instructor that suits you and stick with them.

SteM

Who advised you to never drive with your parents? It's nonsense. Maybe to not get thought by your parents but that's different.

You've done 9 edt lessons at this point, those lessons along with learning the rules of the road mean that you should be good/confident enough to go out in the evenings for an hour with a parent or someone else that has had a full license for 2 years. I recently passed my test and the most important thing I found was practice, practice, practice. If you hate driving so much then don't drive, it's as simple as that.

Am reading your post correctly, have you had 4 separate instructors over 9 lessons? If that's the case then that's BS, i would advise finding a driving school that you are comfortable with that will commit to giving you the same instructor every time.

I'm not sure what your point about Australia is. Here you can get your full license in 6 months if you apply yourself.

- pass your theory
- do your edt lessons over the following 6 months
- 4 months after you pass your theory apply for your test which can take 2 months to come through.

December2012

Why are you getting different instructors?

Calling learning a life saving skill a money making racket is something that bitter people say.

thenewmanIII

December2012 wrote: »

Why are you getting different instructors?

Calling learning a life saving skill a money making racket is something that bitter people say.

The instructor I had in the city was not a great instructor because he really wouldn't tell me anything but to get more practise. then got a good one in my town the problem was that in the city I had paid for the edt. In the city the driving instructors changed twice and had a different one last week for a non-edt again!

A lot of people say that learning to drive has beceome a moneymaking racket and I thouroughly agree with them. I understand you need to learn how to be safe when driving but still....oh well dosen't look like anyone is going to agree with me on this forum.

ABajaninCork

thenewmanIII wrote: »

The instructor I had in the city was not a great instructor because he really wouldn't tell me anything but to get more practise. then got a good one in my town the problem was that in the city I had paid for the edt. In the city the driving instructors changed twice and had a different one last week for a non-edt again!

A lot of people say that learning to drive has beceome a moneymaking racket and I thouroughly agree with them. I understand you need to learn how to be safe when driving but still....oh well dosen't look like anyone is going to agree with me on this forum.

Yup, you're right. You see, most people on here tend to speak sense, not nonsense!

As a matter of interest. What would YOU suggest in place of ADI approved instructors teaching you how to control a ton of steel safely?

ProudDUB

Yes. It is indeed a money making racket. I don't think that anyone that is in control of a multi ton vehicle that can kill people, should ever receive instruction from trained professionals on how to operate said vehicle safely. In fact, I make it a point to only fly on planes with pilots who are self taught, and who make it up as they go along ! I find it adds greatly to the thrill of it all !

I get your frustration OP, but step back for a second and take a deep breath. Would you want to be operated on by a doctor who had not received the proper training? Would you go to a dentist who had not been properly trained? Would you get on a plan with a pilot who had not been properly trained? I rest my case. Driving a car is no different to any of those scenarios.

Yes, it takes time, money and effort to become properly proficient in wide variety of things. You won't become good at them over night. Your feeling browned off at the process does not give you a free pass to skip any of the steps involved. Take a deep breath and step back. We have all been there.

toastedpickles

I spent roughly over 600 euro on lessons/tests over a period of 3 years on and off, looking back now it was worth it, I'm now going to spend an extra couple of hundred on an advanced driving course, because well i'd rather drive safely than like a gobsh*te who thinks they're the next lewis hamilton

thenewmanIII

ProudDUB wrote: »

Yes. It is indeed a money making racket. I don't think that anyone that is in control of a multi ton vehicle that can kill people, should ever receive instruction from trained professionals on how to operate said vehicle safely. In fact, I make it a point to only fly on planes with pilots who are self taught, and who make it up as they go along ! I find it adds greatly to the thrill of it all !

I get your frustration OP, but step back for a second and take a deep breath. Would you want to be operated on by a doctor who had not received the proper training? Would you go to a dentist who had not been properly trained? Would you get on a plan with a pilot who had not been properly trained? I rest my case. Driving a car is no different to any of those scenarios.

Yes, it takes time, money and effort to become properly proficient in wide variety of things. You won't become good at them over night. Your feeling browned off at the process does not give you a free pass to skip any of the steps involved. Take a deep breath and step back. We have all been there.

Thank you. At least someone has an objetive understanding here. I think you have made good points such as needing the 'contempt doctor/surgeon' to operate on you the way you would need a 'contempt driver' who has no clue at all.

thenewmanIII

Sorry let me requote please


At least someone has an objetive understanding here. I think you have made good points such as needing the 'competent doctor/surgeon' to operate on you the way you would need a 'comptent driver' rather than a driver who has no clue at all.

keithclancy

thenewmanIII wrote: »

Last March I started learning to drive since then I have been giving four different instructors they all say something different to each other. I know
I need to get out more when my father is around (I remember I was advised
never to go driving with your parents) but I don't really have a choice. Apart
of me extremly hates driving..
Although I have heard that there is people out there who hate driving that have passed the test. I am getting more and more put off by it learning to drive and really losing the enthuasism. I have one more EDT lesson to do and I don't see the point of the log book when the best thing to do is for your driving instructor tells you your mistakes and what to work on.
I do thing driving has become nothing but a money making racket. According to a friend of mine who lives in Austrailia it takes them two years before they get a full license.

Wife has spent around 2500 euros so far on her Driving Lessons (Netherlands)

I think its comparatively cheap in Ireland, I just wish that the driving lessons in Ireland included driving on motorways.

I mean you just get your license and then can just drive on a motorway without (In Theory) ever being on one before. :rolleyes:

munchkin_utd

keithclancy wrote: »

Wife has spent around 2500 euros so far on her Driving Lessons (Netherlands)

I think its comparatively cheap in Ireland, I just wish that the driving lessons in Ireland included driving on motorways.

I mean you just get your license and then can just drive on a motorway without (In Theory) ever being on one before. :rolleyes:

Myself and the wife spent a shade less than that (each) learning in Germany but have to say its worth it.

A car is a hideously expensive thing to keep on the road but that cost is nothing compared to the cost in money, pain grief and hassle if you have an accident.

If anything the Irish system has a way to go to being more thorough and that would add a little to the cost again.
One of the best features of the german system is that theres a dozen classroom lessons you must take before the theory test.
On paper they are to prepare you for the theorytest but they are in practice its an indoctrination in road safety and a lot of the stuff that was emphasized there still sticks in my brain years later.
For example, the amount of times it was pointed out to us NOT to stop on the motorway in any circumstance was countless and by having it emphasized in person is far more effective in bringing across the message than simply printing 1 line on one page of 100odd pages of the rules of the road.

But anyhow, I do have to agree that if you want to save money then just try to avoid cars/ driving altogether as the lessons are a small outlay compared to the many many thousands that a car costs to buy and upkeep (and thats leaving aside fuel costs).

H3llR4iser

I think everybody in this thread misunderstood what the OP is saying. To me, the point is that he doesn't feel like getting proper driving training for the money paid towards the lessons.

Nobody is saying that any teenager (or anybody, really) should just jump in a car and go. Driving training is essential. However, it needs to be done properly and in this I agree that it doesn't look like we're quite there yet.

My girlfriend is currently learning to drive and going through her EDT; At 27 she is clearly not a teenager anymore but still needs all the training she can get.

Last night we went for a short practice session; She drove around for about 45 minutes going through main roads, roundabouts, traffic lights and finally parking the car. Then the shocker - she goes and says:

"I prefer practicing to drive with you rather than the instructors because you tell me what I do wrong and how to get it right."

This should give you the meaning of what I'm saying. She went with two two driving instructors (mostly because the first one went away on a two-weeks holiday after five lessons, so she decided to try a different one in order not to let too long between lessons) and both of them never really told her anything other than "you need more practice". They never explained anything to her and the reports in her EDT are no help at all - they also sing the "more practice needed" tune, but without really saying what needs to be improved and how.

It's not the concept of driving lessons and EDT to have a problem, quite the contrary - it's fine and finally brings Irish motorists in line with the rest of the EU when it comes to learning; It's the quality of the tutoring available that is, in many cases, really low: if you don't tell a learner driver what they're doing wrong and how to fix it, the EDT really only becomes a matter of 12 signatures on a logbook.

thegreatiam

Ive had 5 different instructors since starting lessons in November. And each of them has taught me something useful.

If you ask then they will answer, but a lot of driving knowledge will come from reading the ROTR and practice.

Take an edt lesson with your instructor, ask any questions you have.
Then practice the lessons content with your sponsor until your next lesson. Begin by asking any questions about the previous week. Repeat until pass.

Most instructors want to teach you, its human nature, I haven't met one who doesnt want to impart some knowledge.
If all they are saying is practice then you are either not listening to them or not responding to what they teach. If that is still the case, find a different ADI there are plenty out there.

thenewmanIII

H3llR4iser wrote: »

I think everybody in this thread misunderstood what the OP is saying. To me, the point is that he doesn't feel like getting proper driving training for the money paid towards the lessons.

Nobody is saying that any teenager (or anybody, really) should just jump in a car and go. Driving training is essential. However, it needs to be done properly and in this I agree that it doesn't look like we're quite there yet.

My girlfriend is currently learning to drive and going through her EDT; At 27 she is clearly not a teenager anymore but still needs all the training she can get.

Last night we went for a short practice session; She drove around for about 45 minutes going through main roads, roundabouts, traffic lights and finally parking the car. Then the shocker - she goes and says:

"I prefer practicing to drive with you rather than the instructors because you tell me what I do wrong and how to get it right."

This should give you the meaning of what I'm saying. She went with two two driving instructors (mostly because the first one went away on a two-weeks holiday after five lessons, so she decided to try a different one in order not to let too long between lessons) and both of them never really told her anything other than "you need more practice". They never explained anything to her and the reports in her EDT are no help at all - they also sing the "more practice needed" tune, but without really saying what needs to be improved and how.

It's not the concept of driving lessons and EDT to have a problem, quite the contrary - it's fine and finally brings Irish motorists in line with the rest of the EU when it comes to learning; It's the quality of the tutoring available that is, in many cases, really low: if you don't tell a learner driver what they're doing wrong and how to fix it, the EDT really only becomes a matter of 12 signatures on a logbook.

That's exactly the same thing I am experiencing the ADI I had in Galway who I had for most of the lessons kept saying more pracitise without telling me anything but that... I understand ROTR need to be read which I do. I drive with my father but I think both our problems is that we are 'committee' type people so gone to meetings some evenings of the week.

The reason why I got lessons in the city is because my father said he wanted me do get a lot of practise with roundabouts and new the instructor (my father did pay for 50% of the lessons too so don't want to waste money either) were there really isn't many roundabouts in the town. Learning to drive is so frustrating it makes you not want to bother more than try (I find anyways). Maybe I am just being impatient but I do thing driving lessons should be less if the company are getting a handful of people.

donkey balls

The op has a point regarding having had four different instructors as they will have different ways of training,Your better off sticking with one instructor as they will know at what stage/level you are at.
I know this from having done lessons with a well known motoring school before and the first half an hour was going over things I all ready did with another instructor,When I changed school I went from having just a provo licence to having a full artic licence in just under 18 months.

thenewmanIII

donkey balls wrote: »

The op has a point regarding having had four different instructors as they will have different ways of training,Your better off sticking with one instructor as they will know at what stage/level you are at.
I know this from having done lessons with a well known motoring school before and the first half an hour was going over things I all ready did with another instructor,When I changed school I went from having just a provo licence to having a full artic licence in just under 18 months.

I asked before to one of the instructors (a good one) in the company about a standard rules of the road and he said there all the same but instructors will tell you something slightly different each time you move from one to another. (Not my fault but the comapany's bar me getting extra lessons at the start.).
I still think the log book not nessary. I want were an ADI tells me were I am going wrong and helps me improve not one that keeps saying 'more practise, more practise'.

Del2005

H3llR4iser wrote: »

I think everybody in this thread misunderstood what the OP is saying. To me, the point is that he doesn't feel like getting proper driving training for the money paid towards the lessons.

Nobody is saying that any teenager (or anybody, really) should just jump in a car and go. Driving training is essential. However, it needs to be done properly and in this I agree that it doesn't look like we're quite there yet.

My girlfriend is currently learning to drive and going through her EDT; At 27 she is clearly not a teenager anymore but still needs all the training she can get.

Last night we went for a short practice session; She drove around for about 45 minutes going through main roads, roundabouts, traffic lights and finally parking the car. Then the shocker - she goes and says:

"I prefer practicing to drive with you rather than the instructors because you tell me what I do wrong and how to get it right."

This should give you the meaning of what I'm saying. She went with two two driving instructors (mostly because the first one went away on a two-weeks holiday after five lessons, so she decided to try a different one in order not to let too long between lessons) and both of them never really told her anything other than "you need more practice". They never explained anything to her and the reports in her EDT are no help at all - they also sing the "more practice needed" tune, but without really saying what needs to be improved and how.

It's not the concept of driving lessons and EDT to have a problem, quite the contrary - it's fine and finally brings Irish motorists in line with the rest of the EU when it comes to learning; It's the quality of the tutoring available that is, in many cases, really low: if you don't tell a learner driver what they're doing wrong and how to fix it, the EDT really only becomes a matter of 12 signatures on a logbook.

As with all professions you'll get great, good, bad and useless ones so if you think an ADI is bad report them to the RSA. Nothing can be done to improve the situation if they don't know there's anything wrong with it.

thenewmanIII wrote: »

I asked before to one of the instructors (a good one) in the company about a standard rules of the road and he said there all the same but instructors will tell you something slightly different each time you move from one to another. (Not my fault but the comapany's bar me getting extra lessons at the start.).
I still think the log book not nessary. I want were an ADI tells me were I am going wrong and helps me improve not one that keeps saying 'more practise, more practise'.

Sounds like the company is messing you around. When arranging your next lesson insist they provide the same ADI. Then you need to ask the ADI what you need to improve, learning is a 2 way thing.

daveyeh

SteM wrote: »

Who advised you to never drive with your parents? It's nonsense. Maybe to not get thought by your parents but that's different.

Jesus, give him a break, its obvious what he means. Theres no need to be jumping down his throat like a class A jerk.

SteM

daveyeh wrote: »

Jesus, give him a break, its obvious what he means. Theres no need to be jumping down his throat like a class A jerk.

So what did he mean?

He said '(I remember I was advised never to go driving with your parents)' and I told him that was nonsense. Pretty simple really.

I'm not reading something else into what he said, just disputing what he typed. Am I supposed to translate what he typed into meaning something else like you obviously have?

Edit: By the way - read my whole reply to him. I was constructive there unlike your post to me that was just a way to call me a name.

daveyeh

SteM wrote: »

So what did he mean?

He said '(I remember I was advised never to go driving with your parents)' and I told him that was nonsense. Pretty simple really.

I'm not reading something else into what he said, just disputing what he typed. Am I supposed to translate what he typed into meaning something else like you obviously have?

Edit: By the way - read my whole reply to him. I was constructive there unlike your post to me that was just a way to call me a name.

I didn't call you a name, i implied you were acting like a twat. And i think you've proven my point with your above comments.

"I told him that was nonsense" - well isn't the internet lucky to have people like you pointing out the flaws of everyone. Who do you think you are? Important?

Just another keyboard warrior jerk off. Now I'm calling you a name.

SteM

daveyeh wrote: »

I didn't call you a name, i implied you were acting like a twat. And i think you've proven my point with your above comments.

"I told him that was nonsense" - well isn't the internet lucky to have people like you pointing out the flaws of everyone. Who do you think you are? Important?

Just another keyboard warrior jerk off. Now I'm calling you a name.

Clam down dear, the vein on the side of your head is about to pop.

thenewmanIII

SteM wrote: »

Clam down dear, the vein on the side of your head is about to pop.

People please stop it was a neighbour who was saying never to go driving with your parents because truth is you will go arguing with them which has happened to me a good few times. It was my father who told me to go to this driving company because they thought him in his own company how to drive vans and cars. It turns out it was just a bad decision. I am frustrated because I have not been great ADI for weeks on end who tells me '**** all' how to improve until a good instructor came along and then times got changed.

However, I think I have come up with a good idea now from this thread. I am not going to complain but to be tactical instead. Although I am heavily tempted to rip roar into one of the ADI's of how he has been acting towards me. He recently told me his sons and daughters got bangers of cars when they were learning to drive but what he should realise is that the law has changed since then were you need a supervisor with you while being a provisional driver.

Del2005

thenewmanIII wrote: »

However, I think I have come up with a good idea now from this thread. I am not going to complain but to be tactical instead. Although I am heavily tempted to rip roar into one of the ADI's of how he has been acting towards me. He recently told me his sons and daughters got bangers of cars when they were learning to drive but what he should realise is that the law has changed since then were you need a supervisor with you while being a provisional driver.

:eek::eek:
Whatever about not ripping into him, at least mention that it's illegal what he's advised you and you are thinking about contacting the RSA.