Intimacy and warmth problem

LegacyUser

Hi.

Understandably I know that a lot of people will find this post disgusting- I cant blame you I will try to make sense of my current perspective with a bit of an intro.

I am a 24 year old man. I was severely depressed and suffered from social anxiety for me teens and early 20's, I also never received any warmth from my parents (in fact I was horribly neglected). I have done some great work on my social anxiety and depression, though there is still much to do.

Recently I have started attracting some attention from girls (I am a reasonably handsome fella :P), though as I have never even so much as kissed a girl my anxieties have made it difficult to fumble may way through anything, so I have tended to avoid this completely. Not so long ago I was a dating a great girl with whom I shared a real connection, however I didnt even so much as touch her on our dates- it's hard to believe but its a very real problem for me. We've ended up becoming close friends, but she has told me that the lack of any chemistry was the deciding factor in things not progressing further.

Now I have known this girl about 6 months and I can see that she is really something special, that I have missed out on. I dont want this to happen again with the next girl I meet.

I am considering hiring a professional a couple of times to get over the initial humiliation I expect. I know this is horrible. I know this is taking advantage of a person in a vulnerable position, and I feel disgusting thinking about it.

But I also know that I need to deal with this problem now. Nobody reached out to help the depressed and obviously neglected kid I was and it's not going to happen with adult I am now.

Has anyone been in a similiar situation, did it help?

ivytwine

I honestly don't know how having sex with a woman who is being paid to touch you will help.

I'll be blunt. Your problem is intimacy and the lack of it you have experienced. Intimacy is completely different to sex as a transaction. The emotional side of sex is absent from prostitution, where each sex act that normally occurs spontaneously during which two (or more, hey I'm not Michelle Mulherin :P) people endeavour to give each other pleasure is itemised and accounted for. It's a transaction.

If you really want to experience warmth and intimacy, you can only do so with someone you feel warmly towards and close to. I'm not knocking one night stands, cos they can be great, but it is a different type of sex.

It sounds like you really love this girl. Well, come clean. Guaranteed she will not freak out. I was in a similar position once myself and I had so much respect for the guy for telling me he had no experience and we went slowly and made it special.

Also, have you gone for counselling? Your self-esteem still sounds low and there is quite a lot of negativity in your post. Trust me, sex is scary and intimidating, but once you get the hang of it, you're away!

Good luck

thingshavereallygottenthisbad

thingshavereallygottenthisbad wrote: »

I am considering hiring a professional a couple of times to get over the initial humiliation I expect.

There's nothing humiliating about having sex. I know you're apprehensive, but hiring someone to sleep with you will only serve to create humiliation. Think about the consequences:

You hire a professional to have sex with. You'll then have to have sex with them, knowing that they're only there for the money and not knowing whether or not they've been forced into prostitution. If they have been forced into it by someone who takes a cut of what they earn, you'll effectively be raping them. You'll then meet women and when the time comes to have sex, you'll feel (as you said in your own words) disgusting thinking about when you had sex with a prostitute. Your memories of your past experience with sex will cause you to feel a very real humiliation.

Or

You wait to find someone you have a connection with. You take it slow, and let her know that you find these things difficult. She guides you and helps you feel at ease, and reassures you. Over time you get to a point where you feel comfortable having sex and being intimate and you realise that any humiliation you've been expecting is entirely of your own construction.

I really hope you choose the latter, you sound like a nice guy that just needs a patient partner.

LegacyUser

i am now in a relationship with a guy a lot like you. take my advice, the only professional you should be thinking of right now is a councellor to deal with your issues of self esteem and intimacy.

as much of a cliche as it is you can't fully love someone else before you love yourself, so i''d advise you to sort yourself out first before you even think about entering a relationship.

i can come back to this thread and elaborate on that if you like but intimacy and self esteem are a lot deeper rooted than simply sexual experience. please take my word on that.

blatantrereg

I was confused for a moment as I interpreted professional as a counsellor or similar type in the context of what you said on my first reading. I did this because your idea is bonkers.

The above suggestions are much more reasonable. Additionally I don't see how you expect to function with a stranger, who has zero interest in you beyond a payment, if you can't even touch a woman on a date - not that your idea would be any less bonkers if you could.

LegacyUser

OP, the fact you say the idea is disgusting says it all really you obviously don't think too fondly of it yourself. I'm wondering though is it more a case of you think people will be disgusted with you??? I know guys your age, who bounce around from one girl to the next, sleep with prostitutes and have no quams shouting about. If you ask me they've bigger issues. Go and have a chat with a counsellor OP, it can only help.

_Whimsical_

OP I think this is a really bad idea too. Intimacy is not about being fantastic in bed. It's about sharing an experience with someone, trusting them enough to be yourself and be vulnerable. Laying yourself on the line is the risk you take and the pay off is forming is a real connection. It's a complete fallacy that everyone out there in their 20s is a would be sexual olympian after years of practice. The truth is most women bring some insecurities to the table too. They'll be understanding of yours as you will be of theirs. That's where trust, relationship and intimacy is born.

You want to start small though. Start with hand holding, hugging, kissing...put the sex stuff on the back burner for a while. There are loads of 24 years old out there who are in the same position as you, you havent been left behind here at all. Don't be too stressed about it, let it develop naturally when you meet someone you like. I would have no problem understanding where you're coming from and it would not put me off, I'm sure lots of other women would feel the same as me.

justaskin likeyakno

Oh please, please take the above advice, I can't really add to it only to say maybe a counsellor wfo also deals with sexual intimacy might help.
I lost my virginity horribly and it was just sex, get to know someone first, you sound like you've put a lot of work into healing the effects of your upbringing and while I'm sure you know you're not still that neglected teen, it is hard to forget what happens to us in those years.
Take it slow and be honest, with yourself and any girl you think is worth confiding in, if she's ok with it, she'll help you along, if she's not, then you missed a bullet in your self esteem.

LegacyUser

voiceofreasonhere wrote: »

i am now in a relationship with a guy a lot like you. take my advice, the only professional you should be thinking of right now is a councellor to deal with your issues of self esteem and intimacy.

as much of a cliche as it is you can't fully love someone else before you love yourself, so i''d advise you to sort yourself out first before you even think about entering a relationship.

i can come back to this thread and elaborate on that if you like but intimacy and self esteem are a lot deeper rooted than simply sexual experience. please take my word on that.

I have been seeing a counsellor. I started 3 months before I met this girl and still am seeing one. It was the first thing I did when I escaped from home...

My personality is not hidden anymore and while I still have a shyness about me I am a million times more confident than before. However physically I cannot bring myself to touch anyone, even if they mean something dearly to me. The idea of a prostitute was not so much about having sex but breaking my cycle of being unable to be physically close to someone- I still havent kissed a girl. When people meet me for the first time they ask me about my girlfriend as I dont appear to have any visible issues, if only the knew how bad things really were.

I guess I am worried as my social life is nearing a huge decline, my friends are leaving for Australia in 2 months. Very rarely will I have nights out to meet new people (not that I am successful at meeting people that way anyway). My work is 99% dominated by older males and my hobbies are male dominated or solitary. I am a bit worried that I missed my chance and that if I don't do something I will never have the physical confidence to be anything other than a hermit. This girl was the only person to show an interest in me in this way for any significant time in my whole life.

Should I open up to her? I don't want to freak her out completely though, as this friendship will be all I have outside of work soon and she is the only true new friend I have gained in around a decade...

xLexie

Open up to her and be honest. If she really does like you, she will want to be there for you, and will understand why you're taking things slow, it's better than leaving her think you've no interest in her.

If she does freak out, then she's not the type of person you want to be around anyway. You'll need support and patience, it's not something that's going to go away with one kiss or having sex one time. I suspect it's something you'll need to work at together, so... Tell her.

You have nothing to lose!

trio

God, definately tell her. As a woman, my reaction would be to be profoundly relieved it wasn't me!

Just say to her "I wasn't hugged or kissed growing up, it's something I'm really trying to work on. " Hopefully if she still fancies you, she'll want to work on it with you.

But tbh you should have said something the first time. There's no shame in coming from a cold family. I have a friend like that - he once told me that he knew that if he ever hugged his mother that she would definately stiffen and it would be hugely awkward and horrible. He wouldn't dream of it. Any affection was viewed as being weak and sappy and sad.

When he spent time with his gf's family he was literally floored when they all hugged and kissed goodbye. He said to me "I didn't know families did that outside of films"

This guy was lucky, he started going out with a girl who was very affectionate, and he told her he didn't know how to do that, and he wanted to learn. So she's been teaching him how and when to hug and give casual kisses and stuff. He's come on loads. He's still not great with other people - I notice when I greet him with a hug it's quite awkward, but I suspect he quite likes it underneath it all so I keep doing it.

Tell her straight. Not all the gory details, just the part about never learning how to touch. At least you'll have cleared the air.

LegacyUser

op i'm really glad to see you're seeing a councellor, that's great that you're dealing with it. intimacy and feeling closeness to others also involves opening up with your feelings so i think a quick breezy comment like the previous poster suggested might be a good idea, see how she reacts.

i'm a bit confused though, you said in your OP that this girl has already said the chemistry isn't there for her and was a deciding factor in her not progressing further with a romantic relationship. i'll be honest here and say that doesn't sound like she's going to be swayed so try and not get your hopes up that explaining your anxieties is suddenly going to make her fancy you back. sorry if that's blunt.

and it's not to say that if she doesn't fancy you back that she's a horrible person or she's not worthy to hang around and be friends with, she might just want different things out of a relationship or see a relationship different to how you might see it.

LegacyUser

Well I decided to say to something to her last night.

I didnt want it to be a big deal, said that the reason I can be so distant with people I like was because I never got the chance to learn what affection was when I was young. She really took this as a huge deal and looked a bit upset I told her.

She said she liked me too, but she had met someone in a nightclub a month ago (I had no idea whatsoever). She advised me that I might want to keep distance for now, she said she doesn't want to hurt me but really wants to keep contact between us going.

Well my hopes werent high but that really isnt how i had hoped things would go, I felt ok at first and didnt act out in front of her though I am definitely feeling that heavy depressive feeling now and a bit anxious, I guess its natural. I am a bit worried that I've damaged my friendship beyond repair, guess I'll just see out a month and test the waters to see where things stand.

LegacyUser

OP, you did the right thing, now both of you know where you stand. Give her some space for a while, as she has asked, but remember that she has said she really wants to stay friends.

When you're talking to her again, assure her that you really value her friendship, and I think things will be alright between you.

Keep up the counseling, it sounds like you're really benefitting from it, which is great.

LegacyUser

Well the good news is my friend wants to see me, I don't feel so depressed about everything, at least she understands that certain things are difficult for me...

I have decided to start getting shoulder and neck massages. I think maybe just getting used to touch without it even being anything intimate will help me, you have to understand I cannot even hug a person no matter how much I like them or appreciate seeing them- I think maybe this is hard for people to comprehend but I'm not exaggerating- my life to date has consisted of zero warmth ever from anyone. I'm really not worried about appearing to be some kind of sex god, but I just want to be able to be close to another person.

It's a tricky thing to overcome, I mean the isolation, shyness, depression and anxiety were horrible but have largely been solved by myself with a lot of effort. This problem requires someone else who is capable of understanding that I want to learn and will learn...