Phone calls asking for Private Data

Piliger

In the last three weeks I have received three calls. O2, Electric Ireland and the Electoral Register office.

They immediately launch into saying that in order for them to discuss the matter, always a 'serious' matter, they need to confirm my identity .... and ask for my Birth Date or my Address or my Username.

I actually answered one of these two years ago and after I got off the phone I realised what a complete Dick I was.

I think we should have a sticky on this forum reminding people that birthdays, addresses or ANY information can be used for identity theft ... and we should not give a SINGLE piece of information out despite how urgent or important the caller says it is !

I have raised with with a few people and it is astonishing how willing several were to give out their birthdate .... truly amazing.

What do people think ?

Fey!

My bank and credit card issuer (Ulster Bank) do the same thing. I have lodged complaints about the practice as their customer advice specifically states not to give out information when approached like that (phishing scams).

The other thing that happens with Ulster Bank is that their call comes up as ablocked number, so you can't verify the number, and they won't tell you who they're calling from until you give them a large amount of personal information (baffling).

Oink

Fey! wrote: »

The other thing that happens with Ulster Bank is that their call comes up as ablocked number, so you can't verify the number, and they won't tell you who they're calling from until you give them a large amount of personal information (baffling).

What happens if you refuse to give personal information until you know who you are talking to and why they are calling?

Lord Nikon

I ask are my calls recorded, how long the recordings are kept for, and who is allowed to access such recordings. One company, can't think of their name, said that I am the only one who can access the recordings which was a nice comfort.

Piliger

Oink wrote: »

What happens if you refuse to give personal information until you know who you are talking to and why they are calling?

I don't know about Ulster Bank .... but when I refuse the others ... they are always totally flummoxed. I think they find that most people they ring just cough up whatever they ask ! It is astonishing !
Then they start to explain the whole thing again .. and then end up telling me to call the company.

It's about time NONE of us gave ANY information to ANY of these calls.

Piliger

Lord Nikon wrote: »

I ask are my calls recorded, how long the recordings are kept for, and who is allowed to access such recordings. One company, can't think of their name, said that I am the only one who can access the recordings which was a nice comfort.

.... and .... you believe them ? (I doubt that you do )

keithclancy

If someone rings you from a company and you do not want to talk to them, just tell them you are recording the call and continuing the call implies their consent.

They will hang up.

ABajaninCork

I usually say to them unless they can verify their identity and purpose of the call to MY satisfaction, then I will not engage further. Usually shuts them up...

slimjimmc

Fey! wrote: »

My bank and credit card issuer (Ulster Bank) do the same thing. I have lodged complaints about the practice as their customer advice specifically states not to give out information when approached like that (phishing scams).

The other thing that happens with Ulster Bank is that their call comes up as ablocked number, so you can't verify the number, and they won't tell you who they're calling from until you give them a large amount of personal information (baffling).

Seeing a number is of little benefit when it comes to confirming the caller's identity. It's much better to get their name and branch, etc and call them back to a number you know to be genuine. I won't play along if they don't.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Caller_ID_spoofing

ABajaninCork

You can also insist all communication is in writing. You don't have to accept phone calls if you don't want to.

ibarelycare

I got a call like this from Bank of Ireland last year. I was completely baffled, I was convinced that it was a scam (it was from a blocked number) and I told the guy that I wasn't willing to give out my information over the phone. He was surprised but very nice about it, so I figured afterwards that it probably was genuine, but it just seems like bad practice, when they try and drill into people to be so vigilant with their personal details!

noodler

I got one from AIB sue to unusual activity on my account (flight tickets).

I can't remember the details they wanted from me but when I hesitated they told me I can ring the credit card number on the back of the card and complete the check that way.

So I did that and everyone was happy.

LeftBlank

noodler wrote: »

I got one from AIB sue to unusual activity on my account (flight tickets).

I can't remember the details they wanted from me but when I hesitated they told me I can ring the credit card number on the back of the card and complete the check that way.

So I did that and everyone was happy.

This is what I do - find out which company they are calling from and ring them back on the public customer service number.

Shelflife

Vodafone do it as well, they make sales calls and before they continue you must confirm certain account details with them.

When they are pulled on the fact that I am expected to give confidentail information over the phone to a complete stranger they just dont get it.

That said when I rang my bank they asked me to confirm recent transactions (not DD) on my account to verify who I was, i replied that there were no recent transactions to report. I was told that seeing as I couldnt confirm a transaction that wasnt there, they couldnt continue the call.

Del2005

noodler wrote: »

I got one from AIB sue to unusual activity on my account (flight tickets).

I can't remember the details they wanted from me but when I hesitated they told me I can ring the credit card number on the back of the card and complete the check that way.

So I did that and everyone was happy.

I've had a few calls from AIB. They never usually ask you for all the information, they'll just ask for a bit of your DOB or similar. But I've also got missed calls from them, on a number I couldn't find on their system, asking me to ring back another number I couldn't find on their system. Called the main number and got it sorted.

Piliger

I think all of these companies are thoroughly inconsistent and unnecessarily ridiculous 'in the name of' the data protection act which they then blame for everything.

On the one hand they are idiotically restrictive when we want to sort a problem ... But when they want to call us ... They got themselves in a complete knot.

We should ALL just refuse to discuss ANY issue on the phone if they ask us for ANY confidential info ! After all they all have our email address and postal address. I refuse on principle to be burdened by having to call them in response. Let them email me or write to me.

emer_b

I think I started a thread on this before. It's a crazy system and one that the companies blame on data protection, even though it seems like the opposite of that to me!
I got a call from Electric Ireland 2 days ago wishing to discuss something with me. Then she asks me to confirm my address even though she rang me from a blocked number. She seemed a bit p!ssed when I didn't cooperate but said she would send me a text to confirm something or other and I could ring her back. Never got the text!

Piliger

emer_b wrote: »

I think I started a thread on this before. It's a crazy system and one that the companies blame on data protection, even though it seems like the opposite of that to me!
I got a call from Electric Ireland 2 days ago wishing to discuss something with me. Then she asks me to confirm my address even though she rang me from a blocked number. She seemed a bit p!ssed when I didn't cooperate but said she would send me a text to confirm something or other and I could ring her back. Never got the text!

Same here, exactly. Got the text but ignored it. If they want to contact me they seem to have no trouble when they send me spam every week promoting something or other ! :rolleyes:

schnitzelEater

Lord Nikon wrote: »

I ask are my calls recorded, how long the recordings are kept for, and who is allowed to access such recordings. One company, can't think of their name, said that I am the only one who can access the recordings which was a nice comfort.

Did you test that?

Lawrence1895

There is a 'Talk to' section, get on to the reps, and give them a shout, that you want to opt out of marketing calls. It worked for me alright (ESB and UPC it was, btw)

Menas

Lord Nikon wrote: »

I ask are my calls recorded, how long the recordings are kept for, and who is allowed to access such recordings. One company, can't think of their name, said that I am the only one who can access the recordings which was a nice comfort.

They have given you duff information.

Legally the only people allowed to access the recording is yourself and the party that recorded the call.
In this case the party can be seen as the agent you spoke to or the company they represent.
The recording cannot be shared with any other 3rd party (without a court order) but either party can otherwise do what they want with the recording.

Eg, use it for training purposes, agent assessment or keep it as a back up record of the conversation in case of future dispute between the two parties.

UB do the same with calling from a blocked number. I gave them one piece of info, then refused the rest. They said that was fine, just call any number for the bank that I know and trust and we could go through it then
Bit of a joke though, how would you know the difference?
And the reason they were calling was suspicious activity on my credit card!

Piliger

bluewolf wrote: »

UB do the same with calling from a blocked number. I gave them one piece of info, then refused the rest. They said that was fine, just call any number for the bank that I know and trust and we could go through it then
Bit of a joke though, how would you know the difference?
And the reason they were calling was suspicious activity on my credit card!

And did they tell you that when they called you or did you have to call them to find that out ?

kbell

MBNA are guilty of this practice also, and they get very irate when I refuse to give them any details over the phone.

Piliger

Piliger wrote: »

And did they tell you that when they called you or did you have to call them to find that out ?

Told me when they called, but anyone could say that

Greyfox

Piliger wrote: »

I think all of these companies are thoroughly inconsistent and unnecessarily ridiculous 'in the name of' the data protection act which they then blame for everything.

What's silly is the fact that a lot of companies call with numbers that don't look right e.g starting with 00 which is genuine in a lot of cases, all outbound calls should have a proper recognised long outgoing numbe.

As it happens data protection is a huge deal these days and must be strictly enforced by all companies, particularly telecom companies.

Pablo Sanchez

At the end of the day the companies are not only legally obliged to verify your identity, its for your own protection too. They can identify where they are calling from but should not divulge the department or purpose before you have been verified.

If you are concerned about the legitimacy of the call, the caller should have no problem giving you a number to contact them back on, they will understand your concern, or simply take their full name and callback through a published customer service number and ask to be transferred over.

Imagine you took a credit card out ten years ago and at the time you had a company mobile phone which you used as your personal number which you never updated when you left the company.

''Hi John this is Angela from XYZ credit card's unpaid bills department, do you have a minute to talk?''

''Sorry this is not John he left the company 2 years ago, is he having problems paying his bills??''

In this situation you can imagine that the customer would have a genuine complaint as the company did carry out their obligations under Data Protection and Consumer protection legislation.

99 times out of a 100 no issue would arise but in this day and age its well worth putting up with the procedures in order to keep your information private.

gordongekko

how would that even happen. the call would go like. "hello can i speak with john x" "sorry john left the company 2 years ago."

Pablo Sanchez

Or the person could just say 'yes im John' would that be sufficient verification? It could well be a former business partner or anyone else.

RustyNut

I got one of these calls recently from ptsb. First I was asked for details which I wouldnt give, I asked what the call was in relation to and was told a suspicious transaction. About 15 mins earlier I had set up a Netflix account and when I mentioned this the girl said that's it thanks. Didn't need to give personal details and job still done. Well done ptsb.

They are only doing their job. I always ask them politely to put whatever they wish to discuss in writing and I will take it from there.
Last weekend I had a respectable well dressed couple call to the door asking me to buy a ticket for a fundraiser for a local community project. I know the project is under way, but I didn't know the couple from Adam, so I told them that I would buy from someone I knew, as I NEVER give money to anyone on the doorstep.

Del2005

Deleted User wrote: »

They are only doing their job. I always ask them politely to put whatever they wish to discuss in writing and I will take it from there.

By the time the email or letter arrives you could have a large credit card bill.

Del2005

Del2005 wrote: »

By the time the email or letter arrives you could have a large credit card bill.

Most people have online banking, so it is easy to check on any questionable transactions. I always ring and let them know if I'm leaving the country and to expect transactions from there.

RustyNut

Del2005 wrote: »

By the time the email or letter arrives you could have a large credit card bill.

You could be looking at a bigger bill or worse by giving out personal details to randomers who phone you.

ytpe2r5bxkn0c1

[Deleted User] wrote: »

Most people have online banking...

Many do, but certainly not most. Think beyond your own age group. Bank stats show something like 28% of accounts using online facilities.

Giving private details on the phone is a paradox certainly and something each person has to make a judgement call on as they arise.

Piliger

Pablo Sanchez wrote: »

At the end of the day the companies are not only legally obliged to verify your identity, its for your own protection too. They can identify where they are calling from but should not divulge the department or purpose before you have been verified.

This is a complete fallacy. There is no such restriction imposed by the law.

If you are concerned about the legitimacy of the call, the caller should have no problem giving you a number to contact them back on, they will understand your concern, or simply take their full name and callback through a published customer service number and ask to be transferred over.

Please gell me how you could possibly know if they are giving you a legitimate number ? or transferring you to someone else legitimate ?

Imagine you took a credit card out ten years ago and at the time you had a company mobile phone which you used as your personal number which you never updated when you left the company.

''Hi John this is Angela from XYZ credit card's unpaid bills department, do you have a minute to talk?''

''Sorry this is not John he left the company 2 years ago, is he having problems paying his bills??''

In this situation you can imagine that the customer would have a genuine complaint as the company did carry out their obligations under Data Protection and Consumer protection legislation.

Only because they directly transmitted the fact that the bill had not been paid.

99 times out of a 100 no issue would arise but in this day and age its well worth putting up with the procedures in order to keep your information private.

Yes it is. But not procedures that go beyond the law and beyond common sense.

Piliger

RustyNut wrote: »

I got one of these calls recently from ptsb. First I was asked for details which I wouldnt give, I asked what the call was in relation to and was told a suspicious transaction. About 15 mins earlier I had set up a Netflix account and when I mentioned this the girl said that's it thanks. Didn't need to give personal details and job still done. Well done ptsb.

Demonstrating how easy it is to deal witha situation in a common sense way without breaking the law. he saying that it was in relation to a suspicious transaction in no way breached the law.

Bigcheeze

Del2005 wrote: »

By the time the email or letter arrives you could have a large credit card bill.

You won't because they lock down your card until you go through the security check with them.

Degag

Piliger wrote: »

Please gell me how you could possibly know if they are giving you a legitimate number ? or transferring you to someone else legitimate ?

I'm guessing that it would be very easily verified by checking the website of the company in question?

Pablo Sanchez

Piliger wrote: »

This is a complete fallacy. There is no such restriction imposed by the law.

From the data protection act:

(d) appropriate security measures shall be taken against unauthorised access to, or unauthorised alteration, disclosure or destruction of, the data, in particular where the processing involves the transmission of data over a network, and against all other unlawful forms of processing.”,

I dont think that just asking 'is that you' would be considered appropriate security measures.

Please gell me how you could possibly know if they are giving you a legitimate number ? or transferring you to someone else legitimate ?

Easily, they can call back through the main company switch if they have any concerns.

Piliger

Pablo Sanchez wrote: »

Piliger wrote: »

This is a complete fallacy. There is no such restriction imposed by the law.

From the data protection act:

Nothing there that has anything to say about disclosing the department or the topic. This is typical of the gross and widespread misunderstandings of the actual Act.

Pablo Sanchez

Piliger wrote: »

Pablo Sanchez wrote: »

Nothing there that has anything to say about disclosing the department or the topic. This is typical of the gross and widespread misunderstandings of the actual Act.

May i ask why you believe that compliance departments of all the financial institutions have misinterpreted the act? What should a company do to ensure that they are taking the necessary steps to protect their customers privacy when they are talking to them over the phone?

uck51js9zml2yt

In my dealings with realxex and Sky.

If I call them they will always call back to verify you are who you say you are.

Piliger

Pablo Sanchez wrote: »

Piliger wrote: »

May i ask why you believe that compliance departments of all the financial institutions have misinterpreted the act? What should a company do to ensure that they are taking the necessary steps to protect their customers privacy when they are talking to them over the phone?

Stick with the Act.

Pablo Sanchez

Piliger wrote: »

Pablo Sanchez wrote: »

Stick with the Act.

Specifics? What would you consider to be appropriate before giving a person access to your account information?