% of people who actually qualify as an accountant?

ianuss

As per thread heading I was just wondering if anyone knew or had an idea of the ratio of people who start out training/studying accountancy and those who end up qualifying.

I know an absolute figure is probably impossible but even a ballpark guesstimate would be interesting.

Ideo

If I had to hazard a guess, I'd say 80% finish. And would have thought that ACA would have a higher completion rate than the likes of the ACCA which is more drawn out. That's my my gut feeling

The Big Red Button

My gut feeling would be closer to 60%, tbh.

I started off in a big 4 firm, with maybe 100 others. Twelve months in, there were maybe 40 of us. By the time I left (about three years in), there were even less.

And I was ACA. And, no, I'm not qualified yet - far from it - but I'm happy, which in my opinion is far more important.

power101

chatterpillar wrote: »

My gut feeling would be closer to 60%, tbh.

I started off in a big 4 firm, with maybe 100 others. Twelve months in, there were maybe 40 of us. By the time I left (about three years in), there were even less.

And I was ACA. And, no, I'm not qualified yet - far from it - but I'm happy, which in my opinion is far more important.

Your maths don't add up....

The Big Red Button

power101 wrote: »

Your maths don't add up....

Why not?

I imagine Big4 drop-out rate would be higher than other firms?

Marcusm

chatterpillar wrote: »

My gut feeling would be closer to 60%, tbh.

I started off in a big 4 firm, with maybe 100 others. Twelve months in, there were maybe 40 of us. By the time I left (about three years in), there were even less.

And I was ACA. And, no, I'm not qualified yet - far from it - but I'm happy, which in my opinion is far more important.

60% drop out in a big 4 firm within 1 year. Wow, considering the number of people who would not have even sat an exam (M.Acc etc) by that stage, I am shocked (i.e. I have a low level of credence in your anecdote).

T L

OP, check this thread:

http://www.boards.ie/vbulletin/showthread.php?p=83206652

Please bear in mind that that's just the pass rate for the people sitting the finals themselves. Take the CAI for example. There are two sets of exams before the finals, CAP1 and CAP2. A certain percentage of people will obviously stop at these stages.

Then you need to consider whether you're taking into account people who start studying accounting in college and stop at that stage.

Take for example my college class. I think we started with about 70-80 in the year. About 50 graduated. We were exempt from CAP1 of the CAI at stage. I did a masters, and was exempt from CAP2 at that stage. As far as I remember, about 80% of people graduated from the masters class. Then I did the finals, which had a 55% pass rate when I did them in 2011. So you could stack all those rough percentages, but there are so many different course and routes to qualify as an accountant, and so many different bodies you could qualify with, it's really really hard to be anywhere remotely near exact.

The bottom line I'd say is that no matter the percentages, if you have an interest and an ability to study, then all of the exams no matter who they're with are doable and passable.

T L

chatterpillar wrote: »

Why not?

I imagine Big4 drop-out rate would be higher than other firms?

You said that 60% pass. Then you said you started with 100, and less than 40 qualified.... That's not 60%....

jjjd

T L wrote: »

You said that 60% pass. Then you said you started with 100, and less than 40 qualified.... That's not 60%....

I think he was referring to the industry as a whole, not just his experience in the big four.

JAKE11

T L wrote: »

You said that 60% pass. Then you said you started with 100, and less than 40 qualified.... That's not 60%....

You do realise that quite a lot of drop outs in big 4 will complete their qualification somewhere else.

T L

JAKE11 wrote: »

You do realise that quite a lot of drop outs in big 4 will complete their qualification somewhere else.

Sure. So he's just pulling a 60% number out of thin air then. Gotcha.

barneystinson

T L wrote: »

Sure. So he's just pulling a 60% number out of thin air then. Gotcha.

Like everyone on this thread is, since its a question no-one knows the answer to.

No need to get ratty just because you missed the point of what the guy said.

T L

barneystinson wrote: »

Like everyone on this thread is, since its a question no-one knows the answer to.

No need to get ratty just because you missed the point of what the guy said.

I'm as far from ratty as can be. A 60% drop out rate in the first year just seems quite unbelievable, and takes away from the credibility of his post.

The Big Red Button

T L wrote: »

You said that 60% pass. Then you said you started with 100, and less than 40 qualified.... That's not 60%....

There was a huge drop-out rate within the first year. The fact is that, once you have that Big Four experience on your CV, you'll have no bother getting a job elsewhere on better money with better hours. Most of those who left did leave within the first year. There weren't many drop-outs after that. I left after three years myself.

But most of those who left did end up in accountancy roles elsewhere. That's why I made a guess at maybe 60%-ish qualifying as an accountant eventually.

T L wrote: »

Sure. So he's just pulling a 60% number out of thin air then. Gotcha.

barneystinson wrote: »

Like everyone on this thread is, since its a question no-one knows the answer to.

Exactly.

barneystinson wrote: »

No need to get ratty just because you missed the point of what the guy said.

Except I'm not a guy!

ianuss

Thanks for all the replies. It was just something I was curious about and figured this forum might be a good place to try and get some sort of an idea of the completion ratio. As such, all reasoned guesses are welcome.

Ideo

T L wrote: »

I'm as far from ratty as can be. A 60% drop out rate in the first year just seems quite unbelievable, and takes away from the credibility of his post.

Would tend to agree here. Gut feeling again would think that big 4 completion rates are probably on the high side - some people leave big 4 and go to smaller firms but continue studying ACA or ACCA or whatever and some leave full stop. Would have thought that the ones leaving completely are low, like 5%?

Industry - would have thought that ACCA is probably more popular? Think completion rates here would be lower as its more drawn out?

Out of interest, why are you curious OP?

Ideo

chatterpillar wrote: »

My gut feeling would be closer to 60%, tbh.

I started off in a big 4 firm, with maybe 100 others. Twelve months in, there were maybe 40 of us. By the time I left (about three years in), there were even less.

And I was ACA. And, no, I'm not qualified yet - far from it - but I'm happy, which in my opinion is far more important.

50 or 60 people left in their first year? Really?!

ianuss

Ideo wrote: »

Would tend to agree here. Gut feeling again would think that big 4 completion rates are probably on the high side - some people leave big 4 and go to smaller firms but continue studying ACA or ACCA or whatever and some leave full stop. Would have thought that the ones leaving completely are low, like 5%?

Industry - would have thought that ACCA is probably more popular? Think completion rates here would be lower as its more drawn out?

Out of interest, why are you curious OP?

It was just something that came up in pub-talk. One friend was saying that out of about 15/20 people he knew that had attempted professional exams with the various bodies that he only knew of 5 or so who had actually qualified. Some remain working in industry in accountancy but haven't completed all their exams.

Personally, I only know 3 people who had attempted them and 2 of those had qualified so I had kinda figured that the number might be somewhere around the 50% mark.

mydiscworld

ianuss wrote: »

As per thread heading I was just wondering if anyone knew or had an idea of the ratio of people who start out training/studying accountancy and those who end up qualifying.

I know an absolute figure is probably impossible but even a ballpark guesstimate would be interesting.

One method you could use is the IAASA stats.

Annual Reports 2006 to 2011 are here
http://www.iaasa.ie/publications/index.htm

Per 2011 Report Chapter 7 pg 20 which gives Irish student numbers stats
http://www.iaasa.ie/publications/Annual_Report2011_Ch7.pdf

Students admitted as members in 2011: +1,629

Lapsed student registrations in 2011: -1,856

Cancelled student registrations in 2011: -266

That's only 43% going on to be accountants in 2011

(of course a portion of lapsed/cancelled people will just switch body and not leave accountancy fully)