Sold Bike - buyer rings me with a problem

Surveyor11

Here's my quandary. I sold my Giant Talon mountain bike last night to a guy, put it on adverts and let it go for what was a good deal - about half what I paid for it, plus put a good few extras on it. Wanted to be shot of it as the bike is taking up room. Guy came in with a low ball offer initially but we settled in between. He came last night, showed him the bike and he took it for a spin. Came back happy and money and bike were exchanged - we'd settled for €75 less than the asking price. First time I've ever sold a bike and was chuffed. I gave it a through going over before I sold it, took it for a spin myself and was happy that the bike functioned perfectly.

Guys texts me this morning to say I never told him about the "broken chain and cogs" on the bike. My initial reaction was to ignore the text, but it bothered me in that the guy would be thinking I'm selling him a pig in a poke - the bike is a few years old but has had very little use, I'd say if it's covered 500km tops - never off-roaded (I fitted slick tyres on it), the worst it's had is when I took it up and down the canal paths around the house and that's about it.

I gave him a call to see what the problem is. He says he was cycling at speed, and that the chain popped off in the high gear at the back - he thought it was kind of dangerous. My initial reaction was that it was the derailleur that needs adjustment. His reaction was that the bike was dangerous and that I shouldn't have sold it. He also said there were missing teeth on the cogs which I refuted - he sends me a picture of the cassette, and sure thing one missing cog is evident on the 6th gear. Now, I am 100% sure that this was not the case when I sold the bike, but it's my word against his. It's a Shimano Hyperglide cassette with little use, and I can tell you I've churned SRAM, Shimano and Campag cassettes without ever breaking a tooth on the cogs. He says he took it for a spin last night and that's when it occurred.

He's taken it to Halfords who've told him €80 to replace the cassette and the chain, and he thinks he has some sort of come back against me - has asked me to contribute to the cost. What would you do in this scenario?

RobFowl

Looks like a case of Caveat emptor ...

jimmer123

Dude just feel sorry for him. As RobFowl said Caveat emptor.

You buy a dud you take it on the chin you dont ring the seller moaning.

07Lapierre

Tell him to "Go Away"!

Raam

With that 75 quid he saved he has almost got enough to pay Halfords.

Magnet

Buyer beware - not to sound too harsh but its his own problem now unless he bought a lifetime guarantee with the bike.

Rhys Essien

Dont respond to him anymore.He bought it as he saw it and he also tested it.

Ilik Urgee

Had this happen to me on a (car)sale once.
He turned up at the door when I did the same as you OP and told him t'was sold as seen. Does he know where you live?

Surveyor11

jimmer123 wrote: »

You buy a dud you take it on the chin you dont ring the seller moaning.

Thing is, it's not a dud. It's a bike that was functioning perfectly, now it doesn't. I've no proof whether or not the cog was missing.

C3PO

If the situation is as you've described then I would send him an email outlining the facts as you see them and let it go at that. Even if the cassette and chain were past their best when you sold the bike to him, it's a second hand bike and worn parts are always a possibility!

Paul Kiernan

I disagree.

The "breakage" occurred within 12 hours or so of him buying the bike. It must have happened the first time he used it. He's entitled to feel aggrieved. I'd be inclined to pay maybe €40 towards it. Or if you can get the parts for less and have tools and know-how, offer to sort it out for him!

Now I'll just sit back and wait for the abuse:).

godtabh

Send him one simple text and dont enter in to any further conversations with him

Caveat emptor

Bike was sold as seen and he was happy with it at the time. He doesnt have a leg to stand on after the cash has been handed over unless you are a commercial operation (which I figure you arent)

seamus

He took it for a spin, experienced no problems, you sold it in good faith and without hiding anything.

The guy admits himself that the bike was fine and then broke while he was riding it. Tough ****, things wear out and break when you use them.

The "breakage" occurred within 12 hours or so of him buying the bike. It must have happened the first time he used it. He's entitled to feel aggrieved. I'd be inclined to pay maybe €40 towards it. Or if you can get the parts for less and have tools and know-how, offer to sort it out for him!

With respect, I disagree. The time between him buying it and the bike breaking is irrelevant. The OP isn't running a business. If the bike broke when the guy jumped on it to cycle it home, it's his problem. Only if the OP deliberately hid any faults can he be held in any way accountable. Otherwise it's just tough luck.

Surveyor11

Paul Kiernan wrote: »

I disagree.

The "breakage" occurred within 12 hours or so of him buying the bike. It must have happened the first time he used it. He's entitled to feel aggrieved. I'd be inclined to pay maybe €40 towards it. Or if you can get the parts for less and have tools and know-how, offer to sort it out for him!

Now I'll just sit back and wait for the abuse:).

Well, I was inclining this way. Best case is I will order the cassette and change it over for him. I have the shimano tools.

Mycroft H

Ignore him from now on, buyer beware. I wouldnt even contemplate paying anything, you're admitting liability then.

Rhys Essien

Paul Kiernan wrote: »

I disagree.

The "breakage" occurred within 12 hours or so of him buying the bike. It must have happened the first time he used it. He's entitled to feel aggrieved. I'd be inclined to pay maybe €40 towards it. Or if you can get the parts for less and have tools and know-how, offer to sort it out for him!

Now I'll just sit back and wait for the abuse:).

Are you for real?

The OP is not a bike shop.In a private sale,you buy as is and have no come back.

What would happen if you bought a car privately and the clutch went(~€300) a week later.So you think we can ring up previous owners for the money??

seamus

Surveyor11 wrote: »

Well, I was inclining this way. Best case is I will order the cassette and change it over for him. I have the shimano tools.

You can do that if it makes you feel better, but don't be surprised when the guy keeps ringing you over the next few weeks asking you to just give the gears a quick tweak, and tighten up the brakes, and have a look at the weird click that's coming from it.

You're not running a business. You have no legal or ethical obligation to provide aftersales on the stuff you've sold on.

dmc17

Surveyor11 wrote: »

Thing is, it's not a dud. It's a bike that was functioning perfectly, now it doesn't. I've no proof whether or not the cog was missing.

I'd say it's up to him to prove that the cog was missing when he bought it and if he can prove it then he shouldn't have bought it

Rhys Essien

OP,Do NOT entertain this idiot.You gave him €75 off what you wanted.It was a private sale.

DoneDeal would close down if every second fool wanted money back from the seller.A person does not want any hassle doing a private sale.

It a wonder this dope isnt asking for a three year warranty.

petethedrummer

Send him a link to this thread.

Paul Kiernan

In fact, on second thoughts, it might be better not to get involved in repairing the bike. Let Halfords handle that. €80 isn't bad for replacing chain and cassette.

If you do contribute to the repair, make it clear, in writing e.g. email, that it is purely as a goodwill gesture and that you are not admitting responsibility.

Paul Kiernan

You know, the more and more I think about how this could happen, the more suspicious I get.

I picture some beefy thighed bloke, with his new bike, doing a gearchange as he pumps down on the pedals. The chain, dragged off the cogs, shoots forward before catching the new cog, shearing it off and bending the chain.

Maybe you should just tell him to go and learn how to ride a bike.

el tel

The guy sounds like a jackass. He tested it and bought it end of. He also used the word cog. You should ignore his calls, change your phone number and just to be sure, move house.

smacl

Paul Kiernan wrote: »

If you do contribute to the repair, make it clear, in writing e.g. email, that it is purely as a goodwill gesture and that you are not admitting responsibility.

Contributing to a post sale repair is a tacit acceptance of liability that may be repeated ad nauseum in the future. I'd strongly advise against this. Bike was bought as seen, he tried it before he bought it, and appears to have damaged it after the event. Not the OPs responsibility.

Slo_Rida

If you have lots of money pay the €80, actually no, buy him a new bike, he deserves it for all the grief you gave him.

Is it definitely the same bike that is broken? Is he trying to scam €80 off you by sending a picture of some other bike? I mean there is no other logic in someone buying something privately and thinking he has a comeback, the dog in the street knows that doesn't work.

Surveyor11

I passed him on the links to the new cassette and chain at CRC, they are £20 delivered tops. Any decent lbs can fit, so if this costs him €50 it's still less than the asking price. Btw there's two other examples of my bike for sale for €500, I left mine go for far less than that and the guy texts me saying my bike wasn't worth the sale! I wouldn't mind, but I threw in 2 Kenda tyres, one was pretty worn but usable and also offered to root out the gadget for bleeding the hydraulic brakes and post it on to him. Now if I was dodgy would I bother doing that? I'm just going to leave it as is and hope the guy doesn't come to my door pestering me.

I bought a bike off boards a few years back. Replaced the chain, cassette and front two chain rings within a few months. The frame also cracked within 12 months, but didn't even consider going near the seller. It is a case of buyer beware.

derealbadger

tell him he bought it how he saw it did you throw a dog in with the deal?.If he is still not happy tell him you will fight him for it

kuro_man

Ignore him, don't pay.

He could have broken the chain himself (crossing etc)

Anyway used goods are cheap because you are taking a risk that something may be worn or borken and needs replacing. If you want to sell bikes with guarantee, add another €200 to the price.

Cee-Jay-Cee

You sold the bike for €75 less than your asking price so offer him €5 and tell him that's the €80 covered. Like it or lump it. He has no recourse on this one.

Finnt

Tell him to FRO! I helmer a fella used to go to england and buy plant machinery at auctions bring it home and resell it here,
Every now and again he'd buy a crock or take a trade in of a dud, all he'd do with is is drop it to his brother in law up the country and he'd sell it on done deal or something similar.
He'd often get calls back this isn't working or this is wrong but all that he'd tell them was it was sold as seen what do I know i'm a farmer!!
Never went further,

Moral of the story ignore him he'll p*ss off!

Dermot Illogical

You both checked it over and agreed a price, so that's where it should end.
Any damage he's done to it since is his own business.
I'd be politely telling him where to get off if I were you.

ozmo

If you feel bad about not getting what its worth - and bad for him - give him his money back if bike is still in good nick - buy the 20 euros parts - and resell it this time ensuring you get the full market value of the bike.
Then everyone's happy?
But no way Id be giving him cash or paying for parts.

BUACHAILL

These people get on my tits. If you want a bike thats comes with a service schedule and warranty but it from a f@cking LBS. He bought it used for one reason and thats its cheaper just like we all do. With that comes a risk.

Not only did you agree a price initially even after riding it and agreeing it was of sound quality he proceeded to knock it for another €75. Tell him to go and take a jump.

I would not however ignore him, you have nothing to hide nor do you have a responsibility to fix the bike. Point it out very clearly that the bike was working fine when he picked it up and test rode it. End of for me.

Discount is always in lieu of warranty when you buy anything an unwritten rule as such. You want a best cash price its as is take it away no come back. you want a service and a come back buy from a LBS and pay the sticker price.

Simples

CramCycle

Surveyor11 wrote: »

Well, I was inclining this way. Best case is I will order the cassette and change it over for him. I have the shimano tools.

Do not do this, lawsuit awaits when it "breaks" again. Your not a mechanic nor do you have insurance, do not do this.

Its done deal, you'll get an outrageous amount of this sh1te on there, I had the same when I sold a car.

Surveyor11

Ok it's done, I've replied telling him where to get parts and told him to get it sorted himself.

Sulla Felix

Do nothing bar reply with ' bought as seen, sorry'.
DO NOT REPAIR IT YOURSELF

Wishbone Ash

Surveyor11 wrote: »

... and hope the guy doesn't come to my door pestering me...

I realise its a bit late now but when selling a bike, car etc. always meet half way or at the buyers house and also offer to deliver rather than have them pick it up at your place.

(When buying do the opposite - always go to the sellers house.)

derealbadger

Wishbone Ash wrote: »

I realise its a bit late now but when selling a bike, car etc. always meet half way or at the buyers house and also offer to deliver rather than have them pick it up at your place.

(When buying do the opposite - always go to the sellers house.)

You would need to be fair thick as a buyer to meet half way or at your place what if its stolen etc

el tel

Wishbone Ash wrote: »

I realise its a bit late now but when selling a bike, car etc. always meet half way or at the buyers house and also offer to deliver rather than have them pick it up at your place.

(When buying do the opposite - always go to the sellers house.)

Are you sure?

Every transaction has a buyer and a seller so that advice is quite irreconcilable.

The standard advice is to never meet half way, and to deal at the sellers address or premises.

joxerjohn

It seems to me that the new owner probably damaged the cassette and the chain himself after purchase. I don't think that you have any liability here and it appears that you acted in good faith and the bike was sold as seen, end of story.

However, I can probably see that the buyer may feel a bit miffed but that's life I guess and hardly your fault. If you sold the bike as having just been fully serviced and "in as new condition" etc. then you may feel some moral obligation to assist in some way.
It would appear to me that the RD limt settings were not correct and that this is what would cause this to happen. It is possible of course that the buyer could have been fiddling with these himself in which case he would only have himself to blame, if that was not the case however and the fault was there when you sold it then I guess it is how you represented the condition of the bike to the buyer which you may wish to consider.

I have bought a number of second hand bikes in my time and have found variious faluts after purchase that I needed to fix, I always considered these to be my responsibility.

seamus

el tel wrote: »

Are you sure?

Every transaction has a buyer and a seller so that advice is quite irreconcilable.

The standard advice is to never meet half way, and to deal at the sellers address or premises.

Hah. Yeah, that's actually the general advice you get from loads of places, I've even seen it written in bike magazines - if you're selling don't let them know where you live, but if you're buying don't trust anyone who's not selling from their house.

The two are completely irreconcilable. In terms of "where you live" the best advice is to sell from home, but from outside the front door. Avoid letting a potential buyer into the house and especially don't let them see what your security setup is. That is, if they see you have 3 other bikes in a flimsy wooden shed, they might come back later on.

padjo5

OP, if in your situation, and assuming I found the buyer to be a decent guy, and believed his claim, I would be inclined to offer some sort of consideration. As stated already, if you had the tools to repair it cheaply yourself, or bring to a local bike shop to get sorted, and pay a small portion of the cost. Again, assuming I felt the buyer was genuine. Good luck.

RoboRat

To be honest I wouldn't do anything even though my conscience would tell me otherwise and I would hate to think that somebody thinks I screwed them over.

The problem is if you pay for the repair, you are in essence admitting that you sold him a bike, and that you might have known it had problem. I am no legal eagle but this could be construed as admitting liability and if he happens to be the devious sort, and there are many out there, he could then try and say that he injured himself as a result of this malfunction. Also, if you fix it for him and there is an issue resulting in an accident, once again you are leaving yourself wide open.

I am not saying that this is the case but there are all sorts out there and you need to cover yourself.

A few years ago I bought an xBox on ebay, it worked for less than a week then broke down and I knew it was a dud but I bought it second hand and those are the risks. I didn't bother to follow up on it and took it as a lesson learnt.

ozmo

Hopefully that's it sorted now - it does sound like the op was very fair to the buyer - but just to mention - you Do have *some* rights when buying stuff second hand - even privately.

ie. if you feel you were ripped off the below applies to goods and services (according to the gov site linked to below)
http://www.irishstatutebook.ie/1980/en/act/pub/0016/index.html


Now this link does mention another kind of vehicle - but I'm taking from it the fact that it mentions the same rules apply if you are a business or not.

www.citizensinformation.ie

... the seller is required to give you accurate and truthful information in answer to any questions that you ask. However, a private seller does not have to provide information that is not requested. If you have a grievance after buying a car you should complain to the seller first. If you are not satisfied with the response you may be able to take legal action against the seller....

NeedMoreGears

CramCycle wrote: »

Do not do this, lawsuit awaits when it "breaks" again. Your not a mechanic nor do you have insurance, do not do this.......

This is very good advice

Super Freak

One missing tooth in 6th gear on a cassette with approx 500km?

Now that's not very likely. Smells fishey to me.

Tigger

There is a thing where people buy cars and then ring and say it's broken and can they have some money back

It's a scam
Wonder if it applies here

CardinalJ

Unless you're worried about the guy knowing where you live I wouldn't entertain him. You've already humored him enough by telling him where to get the parts himself. As has been said numerous times, caveat emptor.

If you repair it for him and it breaks again then he'll just keep coming back.

Provided everything's gone down as you described I think you're being too nice to him.