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Shower types

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  • 27-03-2013 10:20pm
    #1
    dunnoreally
    Registered Users Posts: 5 ✭


    We're (still) starting to build verrry soon, its about 2500 sq ft,two storey .
    Anyway we had planned to have pump showers (3 of them), as we are using solar panels and will have a bored well. We heard today that we shouldn't use pumped showers and to get a pressurised system.
    Anybody have any advise please....I'm hugely confused, thanks!


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    #2
    DOCARCH
    Moderators, Home & Garden Moderators, Science, Health & Environment Moderators Posts: 17,764 Mod ✭✭✭✭DOCARCH


    Probably best to post this in the Plumbing & Heating thread.


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    #3
    Dtp79
    Closed Accounts Posts: 2,097 ✭✭✭Dtp79


    dunnoreally wrote: »
    We're (still) starting to build verrry soon, its about 2500 sq ft,two storey .
    Anyway we had planned to have pump showers (3 of them), as we are using solar panels and will have a bored well. We heard today that we shouldn't use pumped showers and to get a pressurised system.
    Anybody have any advise please....I'm hugely confused, thanks!

    A pressurised plumbing system already has its own large pump dedicated to the entire house. Therefore you don't need pumped showers ( as in a shower with a built in pump ). Just buy ordinary mixer showers. The big system pump will provide great pressure to all your showers. I'd recommend Grundfos mq pump for the system


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    #4
    zom
    Registered Users Posts: 1,908 ✭✭✭zom


    Dtp79 wrote: »
    A pressurised plumbing system already has its own large pump dedicated to the entire house. Therefore you don't need pumped showers ( as in a shower with a built in pump ). Just buy ordinary mixer showers. The big system pump will provide great pressure to all your showers. I'd recommend Grundfos mq pump for the system


    With bored well they already have pump - are you sure it will work correctly with pressurised system?


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    #5
    Dtp79
    Closed Accounts Posts: 2,097 ✭✭✭Dtp79


    zom wrote: »
    With bored well they already have pump - are you sure it will work correctly with pressurised system?

    Not sure what you mean. I'm saying use the Grundfos with a break tank


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    #6
    Outkast_IRE
    Registered Users Posts: 7,515 ✭✭✭Outkast_IRE


    zom wrote: »
    With bored well they already have pump - are you sure it will work correctly with pressurised system?
    As Dtp79 said, the usual setup would be to use a break tank/storage cistern.
    Only your kitchen area and the storage cistern would be directly from the well pump.

    Grundfos pumps are a good choice. Just decide what pressure pump you want, lot of people go for 2 bar.

    Some people go for 3 bar but that usually means a serious flow rate and depending on what showers etc you pick it can pump up to 60l/min which would empty a hot water tank nice and quick.


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    #7
    Joey the lips
    Registered Users Posts: 10,262 ✭✭✭✭Joey the lips


    If I had a wee this is what I would do.

    We'll
    Break tank
    Grundfos pump mq35
    Pressurised triple coil cylinder one for solar one for a stove and one for oil
    Showers of choice

    T90 back up in one shower in case pump fails at some stage.


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    #8
    Dtp79
    Closed Accounts Posts: 2,097 ✭✭✭Dtp79


    Joey the lips wrote: »
    If I had a wee this is what I would do.

    We'll
    Break tank
    Grundfos pump mq35
    Pressurised triple coil cylinder one for solar one for a stove and one for oil
    Showers of choice

    T90 back up in one shower in case pump fails at some stage.

    Pressurised cylinder and a stove??!!!


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    #9
    ccsolar
    Registered Users Posts: 423 ✭✭ccsolar


    Dtp79 wrote: »
    Pressurised cylinder and a stove??!!!
    Ya, no problem
    Your stove in working off a coil which can be vented not a problem.
    The solar works off another coil and is pressurised.
    The oil can be vented or pressurised in the 3rd coil.
    Basic plumbing stuff....
    You can pressurise the cylinder without any problems..
    Cc


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    #10
    ccsolar
    Registered Users Posts: 423 ✭✭ccsolar


    Dtp79 wrote: »
    Pressurised cylinder and a stove??!!!
    Ya, no problem
    Your stove in working off a coil which can be vented not a problem.
    The solar works off another coil and is pressurised.
    The oil can be vented or pressurised in the 3rd coil.
    Basic plumbing stuff....
    You can pressurise the cylinder without any problems..
    Cc


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    #11
    Dtp79
    Closed Accounts Posts: 2,097 ✭✭✭Dtp79


    ccsolar wrote: »
    Ya, no problem
    Your stove in working off a coil which can be vented not a problem.
    The solar works off another coil and is pressurised.
    The oil can be vented or pressurised in the 3rd coil.
    Basic plumbing stuff....
    You can pressurise the cylinder without any problems..
    Cc

    You cannot connect a solid fuel appliance to an unvented cyclinder.... That's the most basic of all plumbing stuff


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    #12
    Joey the lips
    Registered Users Posts: 10,262 ✭✭✭✭Joey the lips


    Dtp79 wrote: »
    You cannot connect a solid fuel appliance to an unvented cyclinder.... That's the most basic of all plumbing stuff

    That's why you go with triple coil. One coil is for the Steve and s unpressurised.

    Oh bee it was just suggested as requested. It won't be an issue if a coil is not bought.


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    #13
    Dtp79
    Closed Accounts Posts: 2,097 ✭✭✭Dtp79


    Joey the lips wrote: »
    That's why you go with triple coil. One coil is for the Steve and s unpressurised.

    Oh bee it was just suggested as requested. It won't be an issue if a coil is not bought.

    Maybe I'm not being clear. You cannot connect an open vented soiled fuel stove to heat pressurised water in a cylinder.


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    #14
    SmallBalls
    Registered Users Posts: 533 ✭✭✭SmallBalls


    I would NEVER use a solid fuel boiler with an un-vented cylinder.

    How do you regulate the temp going through the coil to stop the cylinder from overheating?


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    #15
    Dtp79
    Closed Accounts Posts: 2,097 ✭✭✭Dtp79


    SmallBalls wrote: »
    I would NEVER use a solid fuel boiler with an un-vented cylinder.

    How do you regulate the temp going through the coil to stop the cylinder from overheating?

    Nice to hear some sense!


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    #16
    ccsolar
    Registered Users Posts: 423 ✭✭ccsolar


    SmallBalls wrote: »

    How do you regulate the temp going through the coil to stop the cylinder from overheating?
    Fit a high temperature stat on the cylinder and connect to the circulating pump for the central heating .

    There is also the option to fit a pressurise the solid fuel stove..
    Cc


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    #17
    Dtp79
    Closed Accounts Posts: 2,097 ✭✭✭Dtp79


    ccsolar wrote: »
    Fit a high temperature stat on the cylinder and connect to the circulating pump for the central heating .

    There is also the option to fit a pressurise the solid fuel stove..
    Cc

    I fell like I'm being wound up here. I've never heard such nonsense. Here's a quote from shane007 a few months back that wraps everything up nicely


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    #18
    Joey the lips
    Registered Users Posts: 10,262 ✭✭✭✭Joey the lips


    Dtp79 wrote: »
    Maybe I'm not being clear. You cannot connect an open vented soiled fuel stove to heat pressurised water in a cylinder.

    No our being clear that's why you dedicate into its own coil which is open.


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    #19
    Dtp79
    Closed Accounts Posts: 2,097 ✭✭✭Dtp79


    Joey the lips wrote: »
    No our being clear that's why you dedicate into its own coil which is open.

    It doesn't matter if it has it own vented coil. The fact of the matter is that you are using an uncontrolled heat source ( stove ) and heating pressurised water in a cyclinder. It's extremely dangerous and I'm in shock that there's qualified plumbers still out there that do it


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    #20
    Joey the lips
    Registered Users Posts: 10,262 ✭✭✭✭Joey the lips


    Dtp79 wrote: »
    It doesn't matter if it has it own vented coil. The fact of the matter is that you are using an uncontrolled heat source ( stove ) and heating pressurised water in a cyclinder. It's extremely dangerous and I'm in shock that there's qualified plumbers still out there that do it

    Now I catch you. I must look into that. It's an interesting point, I actually thought this would be controlled with a pipe stat or the likes but as it needs to be a fail safe close then it's interesting.


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    #21
    Dtp79
    Closed Accounts Posts: 2,097 ✭✭✭Dtp79


    Joey the lips wrote: »
    Now I catch you. I must look into that. It's an interesting point, I actually thought this would be controlled with a pipe stat or the likes but as it needs to be a fail safe close then it's interesting.

    Exactly. What if the stat fails!! Read the attachment i put up a few posts back. Shane 0007 wrote it a few months ago


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    #22
    ccsolar
    Registered Users Posts: 423 ✭✭ccsolar


    The solid fuel association in the Uk have no problem with connecting a stove to a pressurised cylinder.
    In the UK the G3 regulations specify the three tier level of protection required to ensure safety. All unvented installations are controlled and installers must be qualified to be able to certify the installation and sign the commissioning certificate..

    If you cannot connect a uncontrollable heat source to a pressurised cylinder wouldnt that also include solar as it's also uncontrollable once you remove 1 thermostat if it's not installed correctly.

    http://www.jradmin.com/hwa/uploads/img4d511368a8a9d1.pdf
    http://uk.answers.yahoo.com/question/index?qid=20081126114937AAfLbjS
    http://www.joulesolutions.ie/Copper_Stratification_Thermal_Store/294

    Cc


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    #23
    Dtp79
    Closed Accounts Posts: 2,097 ✭✭✭Dtp79


    ccsolar wrote: »
    The solid fuel association in the Uk have no problem with connecting a stove to a pressurised cylinder.
    In the UK the G3 regulations specify the three tier level of protection required to ensure safety. All unvented installations are controlled and installers must be qualified to be able to certify the installation and sign the commissioning certificate..

    If you cannot connect a uncontrollable heat source to a pressurised cylinder wouldnt that also include solar as it's also uncontrollable once you remove 1 thermostat if it's not installed correctly.

    http://www.jradmin.com/hwa/uploads/img4d511368a8a9d1.pdf
    http://uk.answers.yahoo.com/question/index?qid=20081126114937AAfLbjS
    http://www.joulesolutions.ie/Copper_Stratification_Thermal_Store/294

    Cc

    To the best of my knowledge ( correct me if I'm wrong ) you can't connect a gravity circuit to an unvented cylinder.


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