How Alonso and ferrari lost a certain WDC the last seven races of 2012

the culture of deference

I had posted this in another thread and the more I read it the more interest I have in it.

The last seven races of 2012.

Ferrari were doing fantastic with 1 car, after Hungary (round 11) Alonso was leading the championship 40 points ahead of 2nd place Webber and 42 ahead of Seb.

After Italy (round 13) Alonso had 179 points, 39 ahead of Vettel with 7 races to go.

Massa only had scored 39 points in total at this stage. 140 points behind his team mate. Massa's poor performance skewed the results.

Seb and Mark were almost equal at this stage with seb on 140 points and MW on 132. Seb used a private jet for the end of the year in a show of commitment to win a third title.
http://www.express.co.uk/sport/f1-autosport/351772/Flying-Sebastian-Vettel-the-jet-setter

Now look at the points scored from the last 7 races of 2012.

Vettel 141

Alonso 99

Button 87

Massa 75

Kimi 64

Hamilton 48

Webber 47

Rosberg 10

Schu 7

T-Maxx

:eek:

I expected a conspiracy theory.

Or at least a detailed analysis of what went wrong for Alonso.

Meh, at least Kimi's put a smile on my face.

Slutmonkey57b

Slightly more likely that the reason Vettel scored all those points is because of technical upgrades which Ferrari couldn't match.

lolie

The reason Alonso didnt win was because the people who hired him didnt give him a good enough car.
Were it not for some brilliant driving and plenty of luck he wouldnt have been in the fight in the first place.

Corben Dallas

Easy.....

Roman Grosjean at Spa 1st corner.

Simples.

the culture of deference

T-Maxx wrote: »

:eek:

I expected a conspiracy theory..

Sorry about that ...

Slutmonkey57b wrote: »

Slightly more likely that the reason Vettel scored all those points is because of technical upgrades which Ferrari couldn't match.

Then explain Webber in the same car, webber ended the season like Massa began it.

Corben Dallas wrote: »

Easy.....

Roman Grosjean at Spa 1st corner.

Simples.

Yea and Kimi in Suzuka.

Slutmonkey57b

the culture of deference wrote: »

Then explain Webber in the same car, webber ended the season like Massa began it.

Webber is not as good as Vettel, and is wildly inconsistent.

donspeekinglesh

The method the Red Bull used in 2011 and towards the end of last year to generate downforce (blowing the diffuser with the exhaust) requires a driving style Vettel excels at, and Webber can't get to grips withat all.

vectra

Corben Dallas wrote: »

Easy.....

Roman Grosjean at Spa 1st corner.

Simples.

Correct me if I am wrong but didn't Vettel suffer some DNF as well not through his own fault?
Blaming Roman is nothing only "Passing blame"

lolie

vectra wrote: »

Correct me if I am wrong but didn't Vettel suffer some DNF as well not through his own fault?
Blaming Roman is nothing only "Passing blame"

No no, your only supposed to mention the points alonso lost and not vettel.
Also had alonso not stalled the car in Japan he may have got a few points like webber managed to do.

Myrddin

I think a good example of where Vettel won the title, due to an external incident, is Hamiltons car failing in Singapore. No crashes, no drama, just a car failure meant Vettel went from 2nd to 1st & those points gifted him the title.

All the other examples are crashes & what-if's

lolie

EnterNow wrote: »

I think a good example of where Vettel won the title, due to an external incident, is Hamiltons car failing in Singapore. No crashes, no drama, just a car failure meant Vettel went from 2nd to 1st & those points gifted him the title.

All the other examples are crashes & what-if's

Each driver had plenty of good and bad luck during the season so it evened itself out.
This thing of blaming another driver is pointless and a silly.

Myrddin

lolie wrote: »

This thing of blaming another driver is pointless and a silly.

I agree, which is why I used the Hamilton breaking down example...its not placing any blame on any driver...simply a situation where Vettel gained that little few points that made the difference & its literally nobodies fault

the culture of deference

Vettel had an extraordinary end to the season. Average 20 points per race for 7 races in a row, and in 1 of those races he was in last place, in another he was last twice, I am still not sure how his car survived the Senna hit in Brazil.

StephenHendry

great article op, fernando was unlucky not to win the WC last year, it would have been a great achievement considering where ferrari were at the start of 2012, it looked like they were going to have another season
similar to 09 but they turned things around really well. i think the dnfs that fernando had in belgium and japan ultimately cost him a 3rd WC

vectra

StephenHendry wrote: »

great article op, fernando was unlucky not to win the WC last year, it would have been a great achievement considering where ferrari were at the start of 2012, it looked like they were going to have another season
similar to 09 but they turned things around really well. i think the dnfs that fernando had in belgium and japan ultimately cost him a 3rd WC

So you are assuming the Flonso would have won both of those races?
Are you forgetting that Vettel also had 2 DNF's.

Grim.

vectra wrote: »

Are you forgetting that Vettel also had 2 DNF's.

Your facts have no place here Vectra :P

the culture of deference

vectra wrote: »

So you are assuming the Flonso would have won both of those races?
Are you forgetting that Vettel also had 2 DNF's.

2 ninth places would have been enough.

Alonso went for consistency in 2012 and he scored points in 18 races.

3 wins, 13 podiums, +3 top 5 finishes, and 2 other top 10

vectra

the culture of deference wrote: »

2 ninth places would have been enough.

Alonso went for consistency in 2012 and he scored points in 18 races.

3 wins, 13 podiums, +3 top 5 finishes, and 2 other top 10

even if vettel finished both races as well and also only got 9th each time? :P

the culture of deference

vectra wrote: »

even if vettel finished both races as well and also only got 9th each time? :P

If's and but's all round.

Seb had a fantastic end to the season, Webber was level up to the last 7 races.

vectra

the culture of deference wrote: »

If's and but's all round.

Seb had a fantastic end to the season, Webber was level up to the last 7 races.

Say's the fellow that said "If" Alonso finished 9th would do :P

Vettel beat him fair and square as he will do again this year. Ferrari had their glory days.

Frank Bullitt

vectra wrote: »

Say's the fellow that said "If" Alonso finished 9th would do :P

Vettel beat him fair and square as he will do again this year. Ferrari had their glory days.

Can I borrow that crystal ball please?

vectra

Gintonious wrote: »

Can I borrow that crystal ball please?

Do you really think you need one?
Red bull are now doing what Ferrari did in the 2000's

Frank Bullitt

vectra wrote: »

Do you really think you need one?
Red bull are now doing what Ferrari did in the 2000's

Well at the minute I would have it even.

RB are not doing what Ferrari did in the 2000's, that was never close, not even slightly.

The field is much closer this year, if RB were doing what Ferrari did in the 2000's then why did they only go backwards in Oz?

vectra

Gintonious wrote: »

Well at the minute I would have it even.

RB are not doing what Ferrari did in the 2000's, that was never close, not even slightly.

The field is much closer this year, if RB were doing what Ferrari did in the 2000's then why did they only go backwards in Oz?

Hmm..
Cant be bothered answering every query but to be fair. Does it matter if a team wins by and inch or by a mile? a win is a win.

RB go backwards in Oz.?
Show me which season Ferrari won every race in one season in their glory years.

Frank Bullitt

vectra wrote: »

Hmm..
Cant be bothered answering every query but to be fair. Does it matter if a team wins by and inch or by a mile? a win is a win.

RB go backwards in Oz.?
Show me which season Ferrari won every race in one season in their glory years.

Yes, RB going backwards in Oz, when you start on pole and finish 3rd, that is going backwards.

Where did I say that Ferrari won every race in one year in their high times? But winning 15 out of 18 races is still rather impressive and dominant, wouldn't you say?

vectra

Gintonious wrote: »

Yes, RB going backwards in Oz, when you start on pole and finish 3rd, that is going backwards.

I genuinely do not get why you are knocking RB and Vettel.
They are the team to beat as were Ferrari and schui in the 00's
Every team has a bad hair day.

Gintonious wrote: »

Where did I say that Ferrari won every race in one year in their high times? But winning 15 out of 18 races is still rather impressive and dominant, wouldn't you say?

You missed my point.
Of course you did not say that but again. Do you expect one particular team to have a glory year and win every race and not have a bad day?

Would Ferrari have won 15 out of 18 races if they had a "Racer " as their second driver and not a pack of minders?

Frank Bullitt

I genuinely do not get why you are knocking RB and Vettel.
They are the team to beat as were Ferrari and schui in the 00's
Every team has a bad hair day.

Knocking them? I am not a fan of them no, but I am not trying to take away from their abilities, but they did go backwards in Oz, that is just a plain fact.

You missed my point.
Of course you did not say that but again. Do you expect one particular team to have a glory year and win every race and not have a bad day?

Would Ferrari have won 15 out of 18 races if they had a "Racer " as their second driver and not a pack of minders?

A pack of minders? Barrichello was no mary behind the wheel, but Schumacher had the team around him, he built that team for god sake, and that year was the pinnacle of that task he set himself.

vectra

Gintonious wrote: »

Knocking them? I am not a fan of them no, but I am not trying to take away from their abilities, but they did go backwards in Oz, that is just a plain fact.



A pack of minders? Barrichello was no mary behind the wheel, but Schumacher had the team around him, he built that team for god sake, and that year was the pinnacle of that task he set himself.

Don't turn this in to a Schumacher discussion.
Have you heard of the "Dream team" ?
It was not Schu on his own you know.

Myrddin

Aw god not another Schumacher/Ferrari glory days argument

Frank Bullitt

vectra wrote: »

Don't turn this in to a Schumacher discussion.
Have you heard of the "Dream team" ?
It was not Schu on his own you know.

Well you mentioned the Ferrari dominance, and I believe Schumacher was driving the car?

I know perfectly well it was not him on his own, and I think he knew that more than anyone.

paddy147

He lost and vettel won.Alonso and Ferrari got over it.

So should alot of you too.

New year,new F1 season so stop crying over spilt milk.

End communication.