Visual Impact Assessment

hobnobie

Hi!
In the middle of a planning application at the moment for a once off rural house and the council are recommending refusal based on the fact the site is based in a sensitive area. They're also saying the site is quite exposed.
They agree that we qualify to live in the area etc and are happy with the style of the house.
We're considering getting a visual impact assessment done but am just wondering if anyone thinks this would be worthwhile? (They seem pretty pricey:() Does anyone know of anyone who could carry out one of these assessments?
Would really appreciate any help:)

sydthebeat

hobnobie wrote: »

Hi!
In the middle of a planning application at the moment for a once off rural house and the council are recommending refusal based on the fact the site is based in a sensitive area. They're also saying the site is quite exposed.
They agree that we qualify to live in the area etc and are happy with the style of the house.
We're considering getting a visual impact assessment done but am just wondering if anyone thinks this would be worthwhile? (They seem pretty pricey:() Does anyone know of anyone who could carry out one of these assessments?
Would really appreciate any help:)

wait to see what the council decide.

They may request further information outlining changes they want, or they may refuse and give reasons for the refusal.

adding unsolicited information at this stage may be difficult anyway

hobnobie

Sorry didn't explain myself very well. They've come back to us recommending refusal mainly based on the sensitive area issue. We're on time extension at the moment. They haven't specifically asked for VIA but just not sure what the best plan of action is and thought this might be a tool we could use to support our argument.

sinnerboy

hobnobie wrote: »

Sorry didn't explain myself very well.

You still need to clarify

hobnobie wrote: »

They've come back to us recommending refusal

Is meaningless ! Do you mean that you have been informally told that you will be refused ? If so wait for that to happen and then obtain the planners report which will be available from the public desk at the planning department. It is that document which will guide your next move.

hobnobie

Sorry! I'm new here!!:) They have officially come back recommending refusal and we have applied for a time extension which has been granted. We have the planner's report and as i say reason for refusal is due to the sensitive nature of the site and its exposed nature. Sorry again for lack of clarity!

sydthebeat

hobnobie wrote: »

Sorry! I'm new here!!:) They have officially come back recommending refusal and we have applied for a time extension which has been granted. We have the planner's report and as i say reason for refusal is due to the sensitive nature of the site and its exposed nature. Sorry again for lack of clarity!

still not clear....

either they made a decision to refused the application, or they didnt?
if they decided to reuse, and made the decision offically, you cannot extend any time period.

what stage is your application at at the moment? have you been asked for Further Information, and if so EXACTLY what does the FI say?

the council use phrases such as "the current proposal is not accpetable" but then they go on to describe why, and most importantly they offer you a chance to change the proposal.

exactly what have they officially said?

sinnerboy

hobnobie wrote: »

They have officially come back recommending refusal and we have applied for a time extension which has been granted.

Again this is not making sense . If the application is refused then the application is decided and that decision can only be appealed to An Bord Pleanala. There can be no extension of time to a refused application.

However - to try to be helpful and move away from (important) semantics I suggest that you need to seek out a clever architect here to inspect whatever documentation you have to hand and / or which is available only by request now from your public file in the planning department.

Look for someone with a good track record of securing permissions - the counter staff at the planning desk should know a few names so that's not a bad place to start.

Is it worth it ? To obtain permission to live in a sensitive area of our country - I should think so. Few are so lucky.

DOCARCH

As sinnerboy suggests, the decision is already made, so there is little point, at this stage submitting any more information, it will not or cannot be considered.

The reason the Council comes back to you to tell you in advance that they will be refusing your application is so you have the opportunity to withdraw the application so there is no negative decision associated with your site, i.e. planning refused. This is a country thing! It does not happen in Dublin.

If you qualify to live in the area/site and the planners are happy with the style of the house, then you are nearly there!

If the only reason for refusal is the sensitive nature of the sight - not knowing the ins and outs of the particular site, etc. - I would tend to withdraw the application, then deal with that issue, get a visual impact assessment done, get a good landscape architect to draw up plans for screening, etc., get photomontage's done, and submit a new planning application with all this information included.

Certified

This is a very common occurrence with rural planning applications. If I am correct in understanding the op, an administration officer for the local planning authority gave a courtesy call to either the agent or the applicant in order to inform them that the case planner has recommended the file for refusal. The applicant then has the option to either, withdraw the application, let it get refused and possibly appeal to an bord pleanala or if not previously extended, request a time extension.
It is not unusual to request that a time extension be given to the planning application (normally 4 months). A benefit to this is that all the planning reports to date are available for inspection by the applicant and it may be possible during the time extension to submit additional (unsolicited) information to address any issues behind the impending recommendation for refusal.

In this case, it appears that the applicant has been granted a time extension. They are also in possession of the planners report. They now can make an informed decision whether to submit additional information such as a visual impact assessment. Really the person to answer whether or not this is worthwhile is the architect or planning consultant for the application.

Without knowing the details of this case, it is common enough that additional unsolicited information submitted will address the planners concerns and eventually lead to grant permission.

A relatively low cost visual impact assessment can be done by erecting building profiles on site.

sydthebeat

Certified wrote: »

This is a very common occurrence with rural planning applications. If I am correct in understanding the op, an administration officer for the local planning authority gave a courtesy call to either the agent or the applicant in order to inform them that the case planner has recommended the file for refusal. The applicant then has the option to either, withdraw the application, let it get refused and possibly appeal to an bord pleanala or if not previously extended, request a time extension.
It is not unusual to request that a time extension be given to the planning application (normally 4 months). A benefit to this is that all the planning reports to date are available for inspection by the applicant and it may be possible during the time extension to submit additional (unsolicited) information to address any issues behind the impending recommendation for refusal.

In this case, it appears that the applicant has been granted a time extension. They are also in possession of the planners report. They now can make an informed decision whether to submit additional information such as a visual impact assessment. Really the person to answer whether or not this is worthwhile is the architect or planning consultant for the application.

Without knowing the details of this case, it is common enough that additional unsolicited information submitted will address the planners concerns and eventually lead to grant permission.

A relatively low cost visual impact assessment can be done by erecting building profiles on site.

Well, in my experience with offaly, laois, carlow, kildare and kilkenny I've never experienced such a thing.

To be honest it sounds contrary to the planning act. I assume applications have to go to fi stage in order for this to work? Also, I thought it wasnt possible to see a planners report while an application was live.....

Also, if additional unsolicited information is good enough to get an application refusal recommendation overturned thats a fierce indictment on the planner who recommended the refusal in the first place!!!

DOCARCH

sydthebeat wrote: »

To be honest it sounds contrary to the planning act.

Indeed, there is no provision for this in the planning acts.

I believe this similar type of arrangement/notification happens in Wicklow CC, but as I alluded to above, if they are going to refuse the application, they will let you know in advance and give you the opportunity to withdraw the application...as far as I am aware...that's all.

It is not an invitation to start submitting more information, as in essence, the decision has already been made, based on the information provided. Withdrawing the application would mean that the decision is not formally registered, so your site would remain 'clean'/allow you to re-apply without a negative planning history.

If they wanted more information, obviously, a formal request for additional information would be made/issued.

sinnerboy

Never experienced it in either DLR CoCo or Meath CoCo.

No6

It was a common practice in Mayo Co Co, and in relation to the op the first thing they need to do is see if they can talk to the planner, see if theres anything that they believe can be done to rescue the project, I have got these elevated / exposed sites several times and have usually overcome them by doing a few photo montages with the project house highlighted but also higlighting all the other rural houses around whaich were usually higher or moew exposed than the project house.

In my experience when mayo did this they were gererally looking for you to make some ammendments and they would then grant the permission!!

sydthebeat

DOCARCH wrote: »

If they wanted more information, obviously, a formal request for additional information would be made/issued.

this is a good point... how exactly do you get granted an extension of time if:
1. an fi request has been sent out
2. a fair assumption is the FI request is answered


at what point are you allowed apply for an extension of time?

in my experience its only when the FI isnt answered, either fully or in part, and the client requires more time to gather the information?

and as DOCARCH says, clarification FI should be requested.

sydthebeat

No6 wrote: »

In my experience when mayo did this they were gererally looking for you to make some ammendments and they would then grant the permission!!

are they afraid to ask for montages or other amendments???

these are commonly asked for when i mainly work.

BryanF

an administration officer for the local planning authority gave a courtesy call to either the agent or the applicant in order to inform them that the case planner has recommended the file for refusal

i've had this issue in cork coco

No6

No they are not afraid to ask for things they usually ask for loads!! what they often do in Mayo if they are not happy with a file is look for FI including photomontages but then put an advice note at the bottom of the FI letter say they are most likely going to refuse. This is the usualy way mayo handle it but I have come accross them doing it as per the OP too. The net result is the same, get your skate on and haggle or as some people do get the councilors on the job. I find in general that the councilers don't help much but the odd time they do!!

Bullseye1

This practice is common with Wicklow Co Co.

build120

Same thing happened to my first planning app Galway coco.

we requested an extension as we would have been refused if we had not asked for it.

we sent further information but we could not get over the landscape sensitivity of the area we were building in.

DaBisc

As outlined previosuly its is down to the planner to highlight that the application may be refused, prior to official notification, this is also one resaon that you see applications withdrawn. In the industry more often than not a withdrawn application, unless it was in breach of the procedures as set out in the planning and development act, is going to be refused so the applicant instead of getting a refusal does this instead.

Regarding you visual impact, I would think that poles wouldnt suffice - thats a bit prehistoric, it really depends on the site first, and where the site is located - there is a load of variable to take account of. I assume what you sought out was a illustrate of your proposal on the landscape to evaluate the possible impact, these can be expensive alright.

do you mind me asking where is your site located? I have experience in the field, and it might be better to re-design the house? I worked on an application before where the total fee came to 12000+ due to all the cgi stuff and it didnt make a difference . that application was for a house by the sea, in a designated area.

Feel free to pm if you like.