Finishing cattle

severeoversteer

just contemplating the short keep style of indoor finishing, have a shed empty from april to early november each year and often thought of making use of it during that period when my grass cattle are grazing,

have very good facilities weighing etc, am within 20 minutes of 5 marts that have good store cattle, im in the west, have local grain growers i could buy off the combine for feedstuffs,
would like to know of anyone at it how it works for them.
p.s i know there isnt a fortune in it, the slurry would be valuable though.

have housing for 80 cattle easily

epfff

severeoversteer wrote: »

just contemplating the short keep style of indoor finishing, have a shed empty from april to early november each year and often thought of making use of it during that period when my grass cattle are grazing,

have very good facilities weighing etc, am within 20 minutes of 5 marts that have good store cattle, im in the west, have local grain growers i could buy off the combine for feedstuffs,
would like to know of anyone at it how it works for them.
p.s i know there isnt a fortune in it, the slurry would be valuable though.

have housing for 80 cattle easily

Good question
Often thought abt this myself
But I struggle to make money on grass finishing in summer so shed could be even trickier

severeoversteer

epfff wrote: »

Good question
Often thought abt this myself
But I struggle to make money on grass finishing in summer so shed could be even trickier

i did a few sums myself and a barley beef finishing setup returns at best 50 euro a head and definitly no more than 80-100 a head. and if cattle price fall in the 2 months that you have them you are facing a loss situation.

does anybody fix a price in advance with factory before they buy the stock at all ? say 4.10 a kilo for a certain conformation fat etc..

also have seen alot of herefords in those feedlots

Farmer Pudsey

severeoversteer wrote: »

just contemplating the short keep style of indoor finishing, have a shed empty from april to early november each year and often thought of making use of it during that period when my grass cattle are grazing,

have very good facilities weighing etc, am within 20 minutes of 5 marts that have good store cattle, im in the west, have local grain growers i could buy off the combine for feedstuffs,
would like to know of anyone at it how it works for them.
p.s i know there isnt a fortune in it, the slurry would be valuable though.

have housing for 80 cattle easily

Very low margin buisness. Everybody has sheds empty from April-November. At present most cattle ae costing more to feed indoors than they put on in weight except good quality bulls and factories are more and more looking for them to be under 16 months. During the summer factories have there pick o0f cattle and seldom pay top money for bulls and definately want them inspec that time of year.

Cattle tend to be too expensive in the spring for this type of trade and prices in September/November too poor to justify. Capital costs are horrendus. Take even 50 cattle at over 1K/ head and feeding costs of over 3 euro/ day for 60+ days. Even on a staggered basis and at that you will not get much of a bonus from factories. 60K + tied up in 50 cattle.

If you want to have a fiancial headache have a go lots of sellers of stores need another victim.

bob charles

severeoversteer wrote: »

i did a few sums myself and a barley beef finishing setup returns at best 50 euro a head and definitly no more than 80-100 a head. and if cattle price fall in the 2 months that you have them you are facing a loss situation.

does anybody fix a price in advance with factory before they buy the stock at all ? say 4.10 a kilo for a certain conformation fat etc..

also have seen alot of herefords in those feedlots

50 a head would be going well, its a high turnover, low margin, race to the bottom business. its an incurable disease for most guys at it. Very like betting, the more you lose the higher you bet hoping to hit the jackpot. do you sums carefully and see where you are going. include a mortality of 2% aswell

No forward prices fixed so you carry all the liability. best advice I would give you is dont get into the vicious circle.

Or maybe there is a fortune to be made at the business and im trying to throw you:D

severeoversteer

Farmer Pudsey wrote: »

Very low margin buisness. Everybody has sheds empty from April-November. At present most cattle ae costing more to feed indoors than they put on in weight except good quality bulls and factories are more and more looking for them to be under 16 months. During the summer factories have there pick o0f cattle and seldom pay top money for bulls and definately want them inspec that time of year.

Cattle tend to be too expensive in the spring for this type of trade and prices in September/November too poor to justify. Capital costs are horrendus. Take even 50 cattle at over 1K/ head and feeding costs of over 3 euro/ day for 60+ days. Even on a staggered basis and at that you will not get much of a bonus from factories. 60K + tied up in 50 cattle.

If you want to have a fiancial headache have a go lots of sellers of stores need another victim.

youve outlined the reason i havent done it already i suppose :rolleyes:

im just keen to know how there are so many lads at it and they appear to be doing well over the years, its all about scale id say, if you were growing the feed id say you'd have some chance

mf240

The slurry would have a value and the labour should be minimal but buying stores against those grass men will make it hard to stack up.

bob charles

mf240 wrote: »

The slurry would have a value and the labour should be minimal but buying stores against those grass men will make it hard to stack up.

the value of the slurry is negated by the cost of applying it. If you are valuing the slurry to make figures stack up, your for the birds

mf240

bob charles wrote: »

the value of the slurry is negated by the cost of applying it. If you are valuing the slurry to make figures stack up, your for the birds

Was only putting it out there as the one positive.

If his silage ground is near the yard and he has a tractor and tank all ready and you drive it yourself it will cost very little to spread. slurry from high meal systems will be very high in nutrients.

Manoffeeling

Is there any market for veal type stock?

severeoversteer

60 days ad lib barley 180
test 7
medecine 5
transport 10
empty slurry 5
straw for fibre 20
vet 5
mortality 15

= €247 total cost

estimated gain 80-100 kg
57% killout = 57 kg x €4.20/kg = €239.40

your making a loss at 4.20 a kilo

beef price would want to be 5.20 a kilo to get 50 euro a head

for this idea anyway, any suggestions ? did i miss anything :rolleyes:

could try a better diet and longer period but i would be all night doing sums

rancher

severeoversteer wrote: »

youve outlined the reason i havent done it already i suppose :rolleyes:

im just keen to know how there are so many lads at it and they appear to be doing well over the years, its all about scale id say, if you were growing the feed id say you'd have some chance

Most of them have a good SFP and that's the reason they look to be doing well

Farmer Pudsey

severeoversteer wrote: »

60 days ad lib barley 180
test 7
medecine 5
transport 10
empty slurry 5
straw for fibre 20
vet 5
mortality 15

= €247 total cost

estimated gain 80-100 kg
57% killout = 57 kg x €4.20/kg = €239.40

your making a loss at 4.20 a kilo

beef price would want to be 5.20 a kilo to get 50 euro a head

for this idea anyway, any suggestions ? did i miss anything :rolleyes:

could try a better diet and longer period but i would be all night doing sums

Your calculations are for good bulls on ad-lib with no silage they will consume over 15 kgs. Ad lib barley will not be suitable you will need a fibre source soyahulls and a little protein. 15kgs/day is costing you around 4.5/day. Your store bull ( if uoy want to finish in 60 days are going to cost 2.3/kgs so a 500 kgs store will cost 1170 in the yard. 60 day at 5/day =300 so 1470 euro. now if he kills 57% he will ko 360kgs at 4.2/kg he will come into 1512 euro.s so 42 eoro/head. Now I have not allowed for intrest, own labour, machinery and as you say the shed is sitting there.

Most finishers work on the basis that if they sell 20 cattle this week they will buy the same this reduces the risk of price flucation. It also mean that they are always turning over cattle summer and winter

rancher wrote: »

Most of them have a good SFP and that's the reason they look to be doing well

With some of them I sometimes wonder you have hit the nail on the head rancher. And yet it is these people that will benifit the most if the historical system is left in place.

pakalasa

I know of a farmer that feeds bulls on slats over the summer with a zero-grazer. These would be weanlings around the 400kg when bought the previous Autumn (Nov/Dec). He doesn't even finish them. Sells them on to another one for finishing. Wonder now the figures stack up for that kind of system. I don't know what level of concentrates he feeds.

severeoversteer

pakalasa wrote: »

I know of a farmer that feeds bulls on slats over the summer with a zero-grazer. These would be weanlings around the 400kg when bought the previous Autumn (Nov/Dec). He doesn't even finish them. Sells them on to another one for finishing. Wonder now the figures stack up for that kind of system. I don't know what level of concentrates he feeds.

So you reckon the bull over the steer, ya i was thinkin protein was dear, at the moment anyway

blue5000

pakalasa wrote: »

I know of a farmer that feeds bulls on slats over the summer with a zero-grazer. These would be weanlings around the 400kg when bought the previous Autumn (Nov/Dec). He doesn't even finish them. Sells them on to another one for finishing. Wonder now the figures stack up for that kind of system. I don't know what level of concentrates he feeds.

Think they were on da comic last year before the rain, how did they manage in July? The whole thing looked like an ad for zero grazing.