air rifle for rabbits

sniperman

hi lads,can any of you tell me is an air rifle really any good for rabbiting?whats the most power full on the market that one can own here in ireland,what kind of distance could i expect to head shoot cotton tails,i would mostly use it at night,thanks all.

TriggerPL

Get ur self .22 , it the same licence and u have more of a kill range and bullets are for dirt

Johnny max

I hav a webley exorcet .22
Kills them out to 50 yds no prob

extremetaz

Air rifles have plenty of power for rabbits.

This however:

sniperman wrote: »

whats the most power full on the market

is an incorrect approach.

What you need is a good quality air rifle which will put the pellet where you send it every time.

It only takes about 7J at impact to drop a rabbit with a headshot so you don't need silly levels of muzzle energy. What you need is to be able to produce consistant head shot groups and where air rifles are concerned, more power actually makes that harder - not easier (air pellets in general aren't very stable at high energies).

The three main brands to look at would be Air Arms, Weihrauch and Daystate. They aren't particularly cheap but they all do a ~30J (24ft.lb) variant which give the best of accuracy and ballistic properties and in skilled hands will do the job happily out to about 70m assuming no wind.


NOW - On the other hand, unless you have a specific preference for more technical shooting, then Tigger is entirely correct.

A .22LR will be:
- cheaper (a very good .22lr costs about the same as a very good piston gun)
- lighter (a LOT lighter!)
- have a longer effective range (or a similar range with less technique)
- better ballistics over that range (better projectile dynamics and more mass behind it)
- won't require a charging action between shots (as a piston or ram gun will), or a dive cylinder or hill pump to pressurise it(as a PCP will).
- is a lot easier to get decent ammo for in this country
- is just as easy to licence and has the same security requirements

and seen as you mentioned it - will have far more power.


Now I'm not running down airguns - I personally own (and love) both air and .22lr but if you want maximum reward for minimum effort, it's very hard to beat the .22.

sniperman

extremetaz wrote: »

Air rifles have plenty of power for rabbits.

This however:



is an incorrect approach.

What you need is a good quality air rifle which will put the pellet where you send it every time.

It only takes about 7J at impact to drop a rabbit with a headshot so you don't need silly levels of muzzle energy. What you need is to be able to produce consistant head shot groups and where air rifles are concerned, more power actually makes that harder - not easier (air pellets in general aren't very stable at high energies).

The three main brands to look at would be Air Arms, Weihrauch and Daystate. They aren't particularly cheap but they all do a ~30J (24ft.lb) variant which give the best of accuracy and ballistic properties and in skilled hands will do the job happily out to about 70m assuming no wind.


NOW - On the other hand, unless you have a specific preference for more technical shooting, then Tigger is entirely correct.

A .22LR will be:
- cheaper (a very good .22lr costs about the same as a very good piston gun)
- lighter (a LOT lighter!)
- have a longer effective range (or a similar range with less technique)
- better ballistics over that range (better projectile dynamics and more mass behind it)
- won't require a charging action between shots (as a piston or ram gun will), or a dive cylinder or hill pump to pressurise it(as a PCP will).
- is a lot easier to get decent ammo for in this country
- is just as easy to licence and has the same security requirements

and seen as you mentioned it - will have far more power.


Now I'm not running down airguns - I personally own (and love) both air and .22lr but if you want maximum reward for minimum effort, it's very hard to beat the .22.

hi there,thanks for that info.think you made up my mind for me,thanks alot:D

darrensingh16

Hello im 16 and have been told its 18 for an air rifle an 16 for a shotgun is this true as ive been wait for the past while to get one...thinking of a weichrauch hw 97 or 77 in .177

garv123

darrensingh16 wrote: »

Hello im 16 and have been told its 18 for an air rifle an 16 for a shotgun is this true as ive been wait for the past while to get one...thinking of a weichrauch hw 97 or 77 in .177

No its 16 for a .177 air rifle all the way up to a large centrefire rifle or shotgun.

Anyone else who tells you different is wrong.

darrensingh16

Hello i was told 18 in griffen and hawe in athy!Are you sure thats correct ur man sed it changd recently just last year or sumthin

garv123

darrensingh16 wrote: »

Hello i was told 18 in griffen and hawe in athy!Are you sure thats correct ur man sed it changd recently just last year or sumthin

4. How old do I have to be before I can apply for a firearms certificate?
You have to be over 16 years of age before you can apply for a firearms certificate. You have to be over 14 years of age before you can apply for a firearms training certificate.

http://www.justice.ie/en/JELR/Pages/Firearms_and_Ammunition_FAQ

darrensingh16

Thanks for the help!any tips on getting my first air rifle going to be hunting birds mabye rabbits up to 70 yards...im think weihrauch hw 97 or 77.

juice1304

garv is right it is 16 for any full firearms licence he was talking out of his rear end.

darrensingh16

juice1304 **** was coming out of more than hole with dat lad...wont be going there!thank god its 16 i wasnt allowd a proper gun by my parents which is understandable so an air rifle is perfect!u dont need a liensce in america or uk for an air rilfe which is annoying that u need 1 here but will be worth the wait! sound lads

lb1981

darrensingh16 wrote: »

juice1304 **** was coming out of more than hole with dat lad...wont be going there!thank god its 16 i wasnt allowd a proper gun by my parents which is understandable so an air rifle is perfect!u dont need a liensce in america or uk for an air rilfe which is annoying that u need 1 here but will be worth the wait! sound lads

A air rifle is a "proper gun" it is a licensed firearm and will cause a serious injury if not used safely.
Griffin hawe is not my normal dealer but i have used them a number of times and have found them sound ,fair and very knowledgeable to deal with, how can you come on here and start saying he was talking ****e and running them down when you dont have a clue what your talking about yourself

darrensingh16

i know it can cause serious injury and its not a toy an its a classed as firearm but in my opinion a "propper gun" fires real bullets that just my view. take that back wha i sed about them but i am unhappy about the misleading info and he should of sed he just doesnt know...i could of had my license by now.in all fairness he should know this!

extremetaz

darrensingh16 wrote: »

in my opinion a "propper gun" fires real bullets that just my view.

Bunnies can't tell the difference.


And speaking as a man who owns and uses both it's unwise to catagorise like that. If air is up to the task, then I'll choose my hw100 over the rimfire every time.

There's nothing improper about it and there certainly isn't anything 'un'-real about what it fires.

1shot16

Did my safety course im 16 and wondering will i get a license for a .22 air rifle...they class a air rifle the same as any .22 rifle coz well its ireland....whats the odds on getting it!?....

Witcher

1shot16 wrote: »

Did my safety course im 16 and wondering will i get a license for a .22 air rifle...they class a air rifle the same as any .22 rifle coz well its ireland....whats the odds on getting it!?....

Do you have your land permission and safe sorted?

If ya do then ya shouldn't have a problem.

1shot16

ye its 2 right...the gaurds class a air rifle as a rifle so im basically asking for a .22 ....i was told its 18 in the shop so i got my parent to get a full and ill get a training... so when i went for the course the man sed for both of us to get a full license...this makes no sense!?

garv123

1shot16 wrote: »

ye its 2 right...the gaurds class a air rifle as a rifle so im basically asking for a .22 ....i was told its 18 in the shop so i got my parent to get a full and ill get a training... so when i went for the course the man sed for both of us to get a full license...this makes no sense!?

The fella in the shop was talking out his arse basically.

You can buy what you want at 16.. training cert is at 14..

1shot16

Ill put in both full licenses and if i dont get it hopefully my parent will and if i do i wont pay for the second license...that will be 80 saved!

garv123

1shot16 wrote: »

Ill put in both full licenses and if i dont get it hopefully my parent will and if i do i wont pay for the second license...that will be 80 saved!

its 40euro for a training cert and u cant use the gun without the parent present..

dogcityroller

A good air rifle will only manage about 50 yards and that's if the wind allows it. But you will get no better gun for learning the field craft to get within shooting distance to hit them effectively. Any man can take a 22 and shoot a rabbit at 100 yards but it takes a lot more skill to close the distance to say 30-40 yards. On the other hand you have the extra range of the 22 along with the lighter weight of the rifle to contend with. I use both and enjoy the merits of both but I started off with an air rifle and wouldn't have it any other way. Anybody that thinks an air rifle is a toy needs their head examined.

1shot16

not getting a training license... im getting 2 full which makes no sense if i get the full myself no need to have my parent payin another 80 euro...

Witcher

1shot16 wrote: »

not getting a training license... im getting 2 full which makes no sense if i get the full myself no need to have my parent payin another 80 euro...

But if your parent gets a licence and you don't then you cannot use the rifle unless you get a training licence and ieven if you get the training licence your parent still has to be with you every time you take the rifle out.

1shot16

im sure i can put in a training license straight away if mine gets rejected anyways...

1shot16

Get urself the daystate wolverine .303 its has 100 foot pounds of energy serious air rifle will kill anything 100 yards easy mabye even 150 yards only thing is u only get 10-15 shots per fill!Aint cheap ur talking 1500 to 2000 but worth it if u have the money to spend!

benjii187

its 16 lads.. i got mine just after my 16th birthday its a gamo vipermax .177 and it will take rabbits up to 50 yards..

rsole1

1shot16 wrote: »

Get urself the daystate wolverine .303 its has 100 foot pounds of energy serious air rifle will kill anything 100 yards easy mabye even 150 yards only thing is u only get 10-15 shots per fill!Aint cheap ur talking 1500 to 2000 but worth it if u have the money to spend!

A bit pricey £1440 that's sterling not Euro, ouch.

1shot16

rsole1 wrote: »

A bit pricey £1440 that's sterling not Euro, ouch.

If you get a good second hand one and i cant imagine you would lose much get a few years use out it and mabye sell it on.Ill put it to u this way the price of a pellet is alot cheaper than 17hmr or 22lr! ammo plus the air rifle is quite

TriggerPL

Not to much cheaper when u take getting a scuba tank filled cost between 5 and 10 euro on top of pelets

1shot16

TriggerPL wrote: »

Not to much cheaper when u take getting a scuba tank filled cost between 5 and 10 euro on top of pelets

How many fill would you get outa it?

extremetaz

1shot16 wrote: »

If you get a good second hand one and i cant imagine you would lose much get a few years use out it and mabye sell it on.Ill put it to u this way the price of a pellet is alot cheaper than 17hmr or 22lr! ammo plus the air rifle is quite

Trajectory on the other two will still be better making them far more usable - the airgun projectile may have plenty of energy left in it at range, but it's gonna be travelling a hell of a lot slower so it'll still be dropping like a mortar round after 80m.

I've attached a chart of the flight path based on the BC for a standard .303cal 250gr round (which is likely being VERY generous), the peak muzzle velocity from the Wolverine from here, and a pellet weight of 50gr derived from the stated 100ft.lbs produced at the muzzle.

As you can see - you need to know your range down to the inch after about 80-90 yards, and down to about 5yard at any range in order to hold a 1" kill zone.

Now at 2", she's pretty much golden out to 70yards from a zero at 60.


In any case, my point is that it's not just about the projectile energy - it's about being able to place it. And at those velocities, placement becomes a major problem once you head out past about 70 yards.

If you're shooting targets that fine, but on game/vermin, it's a major handicap.

1shot16

Mabye ur better off with a silenced rimfire then but ill have to get some good shooting land first!Lots of sand pits full of rabbits round here but who to ask and with "no trespassing" signs i dont think ill be welcomed haha too bad coz theres hundreds of dem!Air rifles are handy for the garden and sheds!

1shot16

extremetaz wrote: »

so it'll still be dropping like a mortar round after 80m.

ye and kill everything in a 50 yard radius haha :P

TriggerPL

Right not sure of the tank size on one of these rifles , but I play paintball and the tank look double what rifle tank is .

Roughly 10 paintball fills per scuba tank (again depending on tank ) x2 for rifle tank . Means roughly 300 shots out of that rifle ur on about if you only get 15 shots per fill ,

Then refill cost of 10€ and petrol if ya have to travell .

Bottom line with licence being the same and sub sonic bullets being 5-8 euro per 50 just buy a 22lr and shoot all the rabbits ya want !! Happy happy !

extremetaz

TriggerPL wrote: »

Right not sure of the tank size on one of these rifles , but I play paintball and the tank look double what rifle tank is .

Paintball is about 15J muzzle energy to boot - so yeah, you'd really want to be picking your shots.

Having said that you could also keep costs down and fitness up by electing to recharge using a hill pump.

1shot16 wrote: »

Mabye ur better off with a silenced rimfire then but ill have to get some good shooting land first!

I really depends what you're after in your shooting - when you're talking about bunnies, if you want max efficacy for minimum effort & cost, then you simply cannot beat .22LR. It's far more forgiving than anything you'll ever shoot in air and they're generally featherweight which makes them a joy to walk with.

If on the otherhand you want to up the challenge and force a greater emphasis on fieldcraft and technical shooting, then air is the way to go as it demands a hell of a lot more from the shooter for the same end result.

As I've said before, I own both, and I love both - but unless the terrain is really open, I'll usually go for the HW100 over the rimfire because it challenges me a bit more. That's not to say that's the right or wrong approach though - the bottom line is that you should enjoy the experience - so chose whichever you get the most out of.

What's univerally important though is that you put in the practice required to get yourself up to the point that you can land your shot in the right zone every time, and know and respect your limits in this regard - it's one thing to kid yourself when you're shooting target, but it's highly disrespectful to take anything but a sure shot on any quarry.

1shot16

Finally got it¬

benjii187 wrote: »

its 16 lads.. i got mine just after my 16th birthday its a gamo vipermax .177 and it will take rabbits up to 50 yards..

Lad in the gun shop sed its 18 had to get my parents to get a license first b4 i could.Did you do that or just put urs in by urself?I applied for 1000 pellets but only got 500 thats not alot for a air rifle as tins contain 500 pellets!Since mines a .22 range is 40-45 yards.