Mk2 Focus: Water in cylinder head?

stiofan85

Hi Guys,

So a couple of months ago the car (05 Focus, 1.6 Zetec) started misfiring badly when driving in very heavey rain, so brought it to the garage. Found loads of water in the rocker cover. Had plugs, HT Leads, coil pack and "frost plugs" replaced as they had been badly corroded by the water. Car drove perfectly afterwards.

Having read up on the problem since then, I've learned that there's a flaw with the washer nozzles on the Mk2 Focus and they leak water in the rain, which caused my problem in the first place. I checked my nozzles and they have some silicon sealant around them, so I hoped my problem wouldn't re-occur.

Today I was driving in heavy rain for the first time since the original problem - decided I'd check under the hood and unsurprisingly there was a load of water on top of the rocker cover. I mopped it up with some tissue, but still had about 30km to drive home in heavy rain. Shock horror as I drove down the M50, I got the chugging and misfiring, but thankfully not nearly as bad as the first time and was able to continue on.

Got it home, popped the hood and pulled out the leads from the rocker cover. Loads of steam came out and there were drops of water on the plastic hoods as well as some down at the base of the spark plugs. I mopped up the drops on the plastic hoods and let the steam come out of the cover for a while. There was still a little at the bottom beside the plugs. I also noted a little on what I *think* are the frost plugs (I'm not 100% sure of what these are, but based on what the mechanic told me last time, I think that's them with the sealant over them between the main plugs?)

So, my questions, after all that are:

• Is the misfiring caused by water between the ht lead and the tip of the spark plug? Or has water penetrated into the combustion chamber?
• If there is water in the combustion chamber, if I remove the spark plugs and dry it up, will I have to replace the plugs? (Since I've caught this early, I'm hoping not!)

I've stuck some images in below - hopefully those who actually know what they're talking about can see what's what and advise me! Photo quality isn't great I'm afraid.







Many thanks in advance for any help

Nissan doctor

Its a very common problem.

I have pics of replacing the frost plugs which I was going to post as a how for DIYers if your interested.

stiofan85

Nissan doctor wrote: »

Its a very common problem.

I have pics of replacing the frost plugs which I was going to post as a how for DIYers if your interested.

Do you reckon I need to replace those too?!

Bejubby

Water will cause the misfire.
If theres water in the plug wells try blow it out with air.

You dont want water in the cylinders.

Dry up everthing and start it and see if its ok,then find the leak or your back to square 1

stiofan85

Bejubby wrote: »

Water will cause the misfire.
If theres water in the plug wells try blow it out with air.

You dont want water in the cylinders.

Dry up everthing and start it and see if its ok,then find the leak or your back to square 1

OKay, so it is the water, but do you reckon it's only in the cover and not beyond that (i.e. in the cylinders)?

Just reading this thread:

http://www.fordownersclub.com/forums/topic/16039-water-in-plug-ports-issue-with-pictures/

Holy crap - all of that water! Seems I'm getting off lightly enough spotting it earlier this time!

Bejubby

Doubt its in the cylinders but then I cant see it so..

Bring it to a mechanic as it would be the safest bet.
If you start it with wster in the cylinders you could ruin the engine

Mar4ix

if water would be in cylinders, then engine would have aqua seizure, which often happens, if headgasket badly blown. , and you would not able start engine, or would break it.


Me think, you need to look at water drainage , could be blocked. i am not familiar with ford, but that first comes in to my mind, as rain water drainage system is blocked, and water floods engine bay, ,,, coilpacks not deigned to stop water.

stiofan85

Okay so I actually started it last night prior to the posts above and it ran fine - I think by taking out the leads, drying them and letting all the steam evaporate from inside I got rid of most of it. I took it for a 10 minute spin (no rain this time) and got the engine up to full temperature then took the leads out again when I got back. Still a bit of water there, but because the engine was so hot, most of it seems to have evaporated now. I left the leads out in the air overnight (car is in the underground car park, so no rain to leak in), so hopefully when I check tonight it'll be dry

From reading a lot more on this it seems I'm okay. If there was water in the cylinder head I'd probably know all about it.

I just need to get the replacement washer nozzles and make sure the leaks don't continue onto the engine.

It's some oversight on Ford's part. They should have recalled all of these as it's a serious problem!

JohnBoy26

stiofan85 wrote: »

Okay so I actually started it last night prior to the posts above and it ran fine - I think by taking out the leads, drying them and letting all the steam evaporate from inside I got rid of most of it. I took it for a 10 minute spin (no rain this time) and got the engine up to full temperature then took the leads out again when I got back. Still a bit of water there, but because the engine was so hot, most of it seems to have evaporated now. I left the leads out in the air overnight (car is in the underground car park, so no rain to leak in), so hopefully when I check tonight it'll be dry

From reading a lot more on this it seems I'm okay. If there was water in the cylinder head I'd probably know all about it.

I just need to get the replacement washer nozzles and make sure the leaks don't continue onto the engine.

It's some oversight on Ford's part. They should have recalled all of these as it's a serious problem!

Your best bet would be to make a cover for over the top of the engine that would repel the water away from the engine.

Mar4ix

just keep thinking, why you blame washer nozzles. do you use water instead screen washer ? or use proper screen wash liquid. ??? if that evaporate , you should smell.

stiofan85

Mar4ix wrote: »

just keep thinking, why you blame washer nozzles. do you use water instead screen washer ? or use proper screen wash liquid. ??? if that evaporate , you should smell.

It's a well noted complaint on that model. Also, I looked at the nozzles and could see water coming down from them. Check out this other thread below:

http://www.fordownersclub.com/forums/topic/3444-water-in-spark-plug-ports/

It's not the actual water sprayed by the washers though, as they ran out of water the other day and I'm yet to top it up. It's definitely rain water.

JohnBoy26 wrote: »

Your best bet would be to make a cover for over the top of the engine that would repel the water away from the engine.

I read another thread on doing similar elsewhere using a Volvo cover but it was pricey as it needed sound insulation and didn't stop the actual problem of water ingress. I think it would be much better to just stop the water coming in in the first place.

Phoned a Ford dealer this morning and they have the necessary nozzles + additional gasket, so it should be just a case of fitting them. The first thread I linked to in the OP mentions putting them on using Silicone Grease to ensure no water gets by, so will pick up a tube of that too.

JohnBoy26

stiofan85 wrote: »

It's a well noted complaint on that model. Also, I looked at the nozzles and could see water coming down from them. Check out this other thread below:

http://www.fordownersclub.com/forums/topic/3444-water-in-spark-plug-ports/

It's not the actual water sprayed by the washers though, as they ran out of water the other day and I'm yet to top it up. It's definitely rain water.



I read another thread on doing similar elsewhere using a Volvo cover but it was pricey as it needed sound insulation and didn't stop the actual problem of water ingress. I think it would be much better to just stop the water coming in in the first place.

Phoned a Ford dealer this morning and they have the necessary nozzles + additional gasket, so it should be just a case of fitting them. The first thread I linked to in the OP mentions putting them on using Silicone Grease to ensure no water gets by, so will pick up a tube of that too.

I know a few that had it done and it has stopped the problem. You don't actually need to go out and buy a volvo cover. If you have an old plastic drum hanging around the place you could cut a piece out of it slightly larger than the area to be covered. This can be easily made to fit above the engine and this method has stopped the problem for the people I know that had it done.

guil

i had the same problem when i had a mk2 focus, i think the cover over the spark plugs from a mk1 will fit over the plug leads

enumbers

Pop the nozzles out, put a little bit of clear sealant round the hole, pop the nozzles back in and wipe away the excess jobs a good un

pissednbroke

Op had an issue with my MK2 focus about 3 months ago, see the thread here http://www.boards.ie/vbulletin/showthread.php?p=81261032.

Got some new washer nozzles and gaskets changed them out but before I put the gaskets in i dipped them in silicone grease like the ford thread that you linked to suggests and then tidied up everything, car is still going fine and no water in the recess since car is parked outdoors over the last 3 months.

ford jedi

there was modified washer jets for that problem , if the water is brownish ,, its from the washer jets ,, if its pinkish its the cylinder head core plugs also a very common problem , yours defo looks washer jets

Hal1

Op you could invest in a spark plug cover. It would eliminate this fault and they look good too.

stiofan85

Hal1 wrote: »

Op you could invest in a spark plug cover. It would eliminate this fault and they look good too.

there's water dripping onto the battery from the washers too, so I don't think a cover will solve the problem. I think it's best to stop the leak altogether.

So after drying out the area it's driving 95% perfect again. It still stutters a very slight bit when accelerating in 2nd gear. I'm guessing there's a bit of moisture somewhere, potentially inside one of the HT leads where it meets the spark plug. I've read on a couple of forums that a spray of WD40 should disperse it - anyone have any experience of that?

Thanks for all the comments folks.

gibbon75

We sell a pile of those Volvo covers for Focus MK2 owners:all you need is the bit that Hal1 posted.
The same 1.6 engine in the Volvos doesn't suffer from this water issue and the only difference is that cover.

pissednbroke

do you have a part number for that cover?

JohnBoy26

gibbon75 wrote: »

We sell a pile of those Volvo covers for Focus MK2 owners:all you need is the bit that Hal1 posted.
The same 1.6 engine in the Volvos doesn't suffer from this water issue and the only difference is that cover.

The body of the car is different also and problably the windscreen washers or do the volvos leak aswell?

gibbon75

pissednbroke wrote: »

do you have a part number for that cover?

I'll check it later when I'm at work.

gibbon75

JohnBoy26 wrote: »

The body of the car is different also and problably the windscreen washers or do the volvos leak aswell?

There are no issues with the Volvo jets.

JohnBoy26

gibbon75 wrote: »

There are no issues with the Volvo jets.

So the cover is probably not the reason why the volvo doesn't suffer from the leak issues like the focus, rather they have better designed jets that don't leave water into the engine bay in the first place.

That cover might still help in the focus's case though, but I can't help thinking that water could still go down between it.

stiofan85

JohnBoy26 wrote: »

So the cover is probably not the reason why the volvo doesn't suffer from the leak issues like the focus, rather they have better designed jets that don't leave water into the engine bay in the first place.

That cover might still help in the focus's case though, but I can't help thinking that water could still go down between it.

That's certainly my thinking - also I don't think it can be good for water to be getting in the engine area at all, so best bet is to stop it at source.

Getting the washers on saturday, some silicone grease and hopefully that's the end of it!

gibbon75

Part number is 30650468
For the sake of €18 I would fit it...

stiofan85

gibbon75 wrote: »

Part number is 30650468
For the sake of €18 I would fit it...

Could you PM me the details of where you work? For €18 you've changed my mind!

mondeoman2

stiofan85 wrote: »

That's certainly my thinking - also I don't think it can be good for water to be getting in the engine area at all, so best bet is to stop it at source.

Getting the washers on saturday, some silicone grease and hopefully that's the end of it!

I have a 06 focus 1.6 ghia with the same problem as yourself,i bought the new washer jets some silicone greese,Its been 7 months now & still no leaks;)

jimmyw

Had a similar issue with an 03 Fiesta about a year or two ago where the EML was coming on and the car was really undriveable due to the bad misfire.I never knew of this problem until the garage showed me the plugs and leads.I had to stress to them that the plugs were changed about a year before, but looking at the plugs, anyone would think the car was never serviced.

I sealed up the washer jet and no reappearance of the rust/water on plugs.Well maybe a bit of oil before and after changing the rocker cover gasket:p.

never found any water like the pics in this thread.