mortgage with online gambling transactions

pico24

I recently applied for a mortgage and got approval in principle.
I went sale agreed on a house and paid 5k booking deposit.
Now bank have come back and declined the lend due to these transactions. There were 4 in last 2 months which are relatively small to my income.
I dont expect to close the sale until May.
Just wondering what are my options??
Can I continue with the sale until May when I can reapply with a 4-5 month 'clean slate' its a new house that needs repair due to a leak.
Or do I pull out of sale and take my 5k back, not sure when this becomes non-refundable.
thanks for any help...

irishgeo

pico24 wrote: »

I recently applied for a mortgage and got approval in principle.
I went sale agreed on a house and paid 5k booking deposit.
Now bank have come back and declined the lend due to these transactions. There were 4 in last 2 months which are relatively small to my income.
I dont expect to close the sale until May.
Just wondering what are my options??
Can I continue with the sale until May when I can reapply with a 4-5 month 'clean slate' its a new house that needs repair due to a leak.
Or do I pull out of sale and take my 5k back, not sure when this becomes non-refundable.
thanks for any help...

cant you appeal this to some government agency.

pico24

cant seem to find much info on appeals process

killers1

irishgeo wrote: »

cant you appeal this to some government agency.

You can appeal it with the lender particularly if this was the only reason for the decline. Otherwise you can keep you accounts clear until you have 6 full months clean statements and apply elsewhere. You're booking deposit doesn't become non-refundable at any stage, the seller will eventually instruct the EA to return your booking deposit if you have not signed contracts and moved things on.

pico24

ok, thanks, applied thru a broker, I have no paperwork for application, do I contact bank directly to appeal??

killers1

pico24 wrote: »

ok, thanks, applied thru a broker, I have no paperwork for application, do I contact bank directly to appeal??

You contact your Broker and ask him to appeal via his Intermediary Relationship Manager...

pico24

ok, not holding my breath on this but thanks

poker--addict

I have a slightly different situation.

I have a full time job with a gross around 50K a year. I have solid ability to save putting aside an average of €1400/month and I have being doing this consistently for some time. I however gamble significant amounts of money weekly. In simple terms my online betting is not for entertainment, it is a part-time business which makes me slow steady money - a few thousand each year.(Several bookmakers have shut me down or will only take tiny bets off me because my strategy beats them). I have a current account set aside for all my online bet transactions. All my "normal" transactions and bills go via my "main" current account which happens to be in another bank.

Firstly i assume the lending back would request to see or would have the ability to see my second account?
Secondly from what i have read on boards.ie and researched in newspapers the banks are unlikely to care about the loss or profits i make, this doesn't concern them?
Finally, how long would i need to stop completely and show "clean" statements for?

I suspect the simple answer (only answer?) is to stop but i wanted to hear other peoples opinions too, especially any brokers or bank staff here. I could stop my betting tomorrow if required however i personally find that very frustrating and narrow minded by the banks if they do not hear me out. At the same time I accept they obviously have their reasons and statistics which gives them good reason to not "waste time" with anyone associated with gambling. (I think something like 4 or 5 % of gamblers are profitable).

Mezcita

poker--addict wrote: »

I have a slightly different situation.

I have a full time job with a gross around 50K a year. I have solid ability to save putting aside an average of €1400/month and I have being doing this consistently for some time. I however gamble significant amounts of money weekly. In simple terms my online betting is not for entertainment, it is a part-time business which makes me slow steady money - a few thousand each year.(Several bookmakers have shut me down or will only take tiny bets off me because my strategy beats them). I have a current account set aside for all my online bet transactions. All my "normal" transactions and bills go via my "main" current account which happens to be in another bank.

Firstly i assume the lending back would request to see or would have the ability to see my second account?
Secondly from what i have read on boards.ie and researched in newspapers the banks are unlikely to care about the loss or profits i make, this doesn't concern them?
Finally, how long would i need to stop completely and show "clean" statements for?

I suspect the simple answer (only answer?) is to stop but i wanted to hear other peoples opinions too, especially any brokers or bank staff here. I could stop my betting tomorrow if required however i personally find that very frustrating and narrow minded by the banks if they do not hear me out. At the same time I accept they obviously have their reasons and statistics which gives them good reason to not "waste time" with anyone associated with gambling. (I think something like 4 or 5 % of gamblers are profitable).

Simple answer is to just separate all gambling activity away from your current account.

Moneybookers is ideal for this. All of the major bookies accept it as a payment method and you can basically keep your float there. They also offer one of those prepaid credit cards which enables you to withdraw your profits via an ATM.

MadsL

It seem outrageous that a bank can make a mortgage decision based on a 'moral' standpoint - gambling is legal in Ireland and many other people spend far more on 'entertainment' in the form of alcohol.

Ah, you took €100 out at 3am - must have a drinking problem, deny him a mortgage wouldn't wash.

Nervous Wreck

MadsL wrote: »

It seem outrageous that a bank can make a mortgage decision based on a 'moral' standpoint - gambling is legal in Ireland and many other people spend far more on 'entertainment' in the form of alcohol.

Ah, you took €100 out at 3am - must have a drinking problem, deny him a mortgage wouldn't wash.

I doubt it's to do with morality...

MadsL

Nervous Wreck wrote: »

I doubt it's to do with morality...

Fine, then let them examine the cashback transactions in the pub.

Nervous Wreck

MadsL wrote: »

Fine, then let them examine the cashback transactions in the pub.

You've gone back to the morality thing again. I'd wager (ho ho!) it's more to do with the idea that people who gamble are less likely to be reliable with money. That's what the perception is gonna be and I'd imagine that's what their reasoning is based on.

poker--addict

As i said in my o.p i am sure the banks have their reasons, whether the public agree with them or not does not really matter.The question is do such transactions result in a point bank refusal or is it a case by case bases?

roro2

poker--addict wrote: »

As i said in my o.p i am sure the banks have their reasons, whether the public agree with them or not does not really matter.The question is do such transactions result in a point bank refusal or is it a case by case bases?

It is going to be a case by case basis. But not at the level that they'll ask about your strategy and how successful you are - if they see evidence of "significant" gambling transactions on a weekly basis, it's going to be very difficult to get a mortgage regardless of your gambling P&L. The only sensible thing to do if you want to continue is to have a completely separate gambling account in a bank where you will not be applying for a mortgage. And make sure it is not linked to your other accounts in any way - no transferring funds, etc. Your primary bank will not be able to see this account, but if they know about it they'll ask you to provide statements.

killers1

Gambling transactions in their own right are not a deal breaker on a mortgage application. They are viewed as a lifestyle choice no different to atm withdrawals in a pub. If an applicant chooses to gamble but still pays rent, meets all financial commitments & increases savings consistently on a monthly basis they shouldn't cause a problem. Each application is assessed on its on merits and if the application is strong in terms of income, repayment capacity and good savings they will be overlooked. If it's a marginal case with a couple of negatives to it then the gambling lifestyle may be the straw that breaks the camels back and ends up in decline. Do not try to make the argument that you are a 'good gambler' as that will hold no water with the banks.

roro2

I would still be concerned about "significant" gambling transactions in the context of the OP describing it as a part-time business. But it depends on what "significant" is, what's visible on the account and whether it's enough to cause concern with the lenders. E.g. -€500 week 1, -€100 week 2, +€700 week 3, etc, in the context of c.€2,900 monthly net income. Agree with killers1 re smaller gambling.

OP - if you're as successful as you say, it wouldn't hurt to regularise and reduce the size of the transactions going through the account. Or not withdraw winnings and use them to fund future gambling.

poker--addict

roro2 wrote: »

Your primary bank will not be able to see this account, but if they know about it they'll ask you to provide statements.

Is this true? I presume they can do some search to make sure they know about it?

roro2 wrote: »

OP - if you're as successful as you say, it wouldn't hurt to regularise and reduce the size of the transactions going through the account. Or not withdraw winnings and use them to fund future gambling.

The issue was I had to move the money continuously between bookmakers to get the better prices available. I can use skrill/moneybookers to do this and i will use it more, however it is not always practical. It will go a long way though.

monkeysnapper

If you listen back to a pod cast from the last word on today fm last wed they had a slot on there on how to get a mortgage and the BIG no no was having any gambling proof on credit card or bank account. And to keep such transactions by cash going into bookies.