Trying to understand a problem.

davidod1

Hi Folks,

The first issue is that there seems to be continual hardware failure. Within a year of being installed two immersion heater elements have been fitted. Both failing at the weld between the element rod and the main unit. Then the welded (soldered) pocket for the temperature probe failed and water started leaking out of the cylinder.

Following the failure of the first element we were told that the water was the source of the problem and the only solution would be to spend thousands on a special system.

We had an analysis done on the water and that is now attached and I really would appreciate some unbiased opinion as to what in the water is the real culprit or could it really be either the hardware itself or just not the correct hardware for the job.

One important thing is that both the cylinder and the elements are stainless steel.

I would also like an opinion as to the suitability of the water for human consumption.

Any help would be much appreciated.

Dave

shane0007

No analysis attached!

However, cheap poor quality immersions are often the culprit. I bought one in HM's, installed it, a month later it burnt out. Took it out, brought it back to HM's, they gave me a nice new identical shiney one & I fitted that. A month later, same thing, it burnt out. I then f**ked that one in the bin, as HM's won't pay labour costs for replacing their sh1te. I then went to local electrical wholesaler, bought one that was €9 cheaper than HM, fitted it & it has been a dandy for over a year now. HM's tried that waffle about the water until he got hit over the head with it. He stayed quiet for a bit then.

davidod1

Thanks Shane0007. Didn't realise I hadn't attached the analysis.

The problem is not just the two elements but now the cylinder is leaking and they are saying that it's all the waters fault.

shane0007

You iron level is off the scale & you are now stating the cylinder is stainless steel. A completely different answer so!

The high iron will destroy the welds of the stainless steel cylinder, not the body of it. Unless the iron levels are addressed, you are wasting your time installing a new one.

Is the DHW system pressurised or is it gravity fed from a tank in the attic?

I'm afraid, your water is the issue. Depending upon when it was installed, you should or should not have been informed not to install this type of cylinder on a private well or at least have your water tested before you do. Warranty restrictions apply, i.e. you have no warranty!

davidod1

OK Shane007. The gear was selected by the plumber without a water analysis.

Yes it is pressurised - to 3 bars. The well is a deep well but the pipe is lined so I suppose that means that the iron is most likely coming from the ground.

How would you recommend tackling this problem. Is it a case of removing the iron or changing the cylinder and element for a copper one?

shane0007

You can't properly pressurise a copper cylinder, well I wouldn't anyhow. There are some on the market, but only to 2 bar but they seem to have a PRV of 4bar. Cylinders are only certed for 2 bar!

You will have to replace the cylinder anyhow. You will have to treat the water with iron filter. You will need to check about the ammonia & manganese issue with a water guy.

The other option is a pressurised glass lined cylinder.

How old is the existing cylinder?

TPM

if you get a filter system in fitted to correct the issues with your water you should be able to use a stainless cylinder.

davidod1

The cylinder is in place for just over a year.

If a copper cylinder is better under the circumstances then we could reduce the pressure to 2 bars to accommodate that limit. Would that be the best way to handle it?

Is the iron filter a big expense and probably equally important; is it effective?

TPM

Looking at your water test results you have a few areas that need to be addressed, The iron, hardness, colour, manganese, Ammonium. You will probably need a few filters to address these which van be expensive to install but the long term cost of not doing it (the damage it can cause) could be far more expensive.
You need to contact someone installing these systems and get some quotations, did you get a microbiology test on the water?

davidod1

Getting another more complete test done at the moment.

What we are really trying to do is to build up some understanding and knowledge to able to talk to someone about this problem.

I know these problems can be expensive to solve but what I really need to know is how bad the problem is and what is the minimum that needs to be done in order to solve it. We just don't have the cash to through at this problem but at the moment we have a leaking cylinder and the only way to get hot water is by heating a kettle or turning on the oil.