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Family Law - Advice required - Single mother looking for information

  • 30-01-2013 9:29am
    #1
    punkypolly
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 27 ✭


    Hello, I'm wondering if anyone could give me some advice on a matter.

    I am a single mother. My child is 10 years old. When his father was told that I was pregnant he decided that he did not want to be a "part-time" dad and made the decision to not have anything to do with his child.

    At the time I accepted this. I just wanted the man to know that he was going to be a father. If he didn't want to deal with it then that was fine, at least he knew.

    I have raised my son for the past 10 years alone. I work full time, pay child care, and pay rent on an apartment. I do not receive lone parents benefit. I do however, have a medical card (which, due to the last budget, I will lose soon enough). I give my son whatever I can and we live a nice, happy, frugal life.

    However, I am now fed-up. I am fed-up that this man hasn't made any form of an effort for the past 10 years. He has never made contact (I did contact him last month) He has never offered to help out. I am annoyed finally.

    So, after my rather drawn-out explanation, I want to know if I can do something about this situation. I want his father to step up to the plate. Even if the man does not want to meet his beautiful son, I want him to help out financially. This might sound harsh, but I want the man to pay up.

    I will obviously need to speak with a solicitor who specialises in Family Law, but should I be asking for anything in particular? Can anyone help please?

    Many thanks.


Comments

  • #2
    ABajaninCork
    Closed Accounts Posts: 8,411 ✭✭✭ABajaninCork


    punkypolly wrote: »
    I will obviously need to speak with a solicitor who specialises in Family Law, but should I be asking for anything in particular? Can anyone help please?

    Yes. Maintenance! Half of the child care costs!! If he's working then ask for medical insurance for the child too. Man's been getting a free ride all these years...

    Try to come to an agreement without involving the courts, but if he doesn't play ball, then that's the route to go.

    Can I ask? Why didn't you sort out maintenance earlier??


  • #3
    punkypolly
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 27 ✭punkypolly


    I didnt ask for maintenance earlier because I was afraid he would want to have involvement and he would insist on looking to see my son. It would have been hard on my boy, suddenly realising that he has a father. But from when I was in communication with him before Christmas, he still doesnt want to see him. And after 10 years of not feeling angry or annoyed, I am now. Also, he since got married and has a child. And if he can look after his wife and other child, then he can cop on and look after his other child.


  • #4
    ABajaninCork
    Closed Accounts Posts: 8,411 ✭✭✭ABajaninCork


    punkypolly wrote: »
    I didnt ask for maintenance earlier because I was afraid he would want to have involvement and he would insist on looking to see my son. It would have been hard on my boy, suddenly realising that he has a father. But from when I was in communication with him before Christmas, he still doesnt want to see him. And after 10 years of not feeling angry or annoyed, I am now. Also, he since got married and has a child. And if he can look after his wife and other child, then he can cop on and look after his other child.

    I do understand. Obviously you have your own reasons for not wanting the father to see his son and have involvement with him. But now you say he has another child. Does your son know? Does his stepmother know about him??

    I would try to negotiate with the father. IMHO, this is now a much bigger question than just paying maintenance.

    Hope it works for you!


  • #5
    wmpdd3
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 9,626 ✭✭✭wmpdd3


    Write to him outlining what maintenance you will be seeking. Give him 30 days to reply and set up payment. Through the bank is the best for all as there is a paper trail.

    If you get no where, go down to the office in the local court, you can fill out a request for maintenance and file it with the court, its pretty straight forward. If he still does not reply or offer maintenance you will have a date to go before the family law court, just you and him and ant legal representation you might bring and it will be sorted out.

    There are ways that the absent parent could make this a drawn out situation like asking for proof of the child being his etc but if it goes smoothly you could have an agreement in a few weeks.


  • #6
    punkypolly
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 27 ✭punkypolly


    Thank you. If he does ask for proof, thats fine. I presume he will want a paternity test. How do I go about getting that? Its quite expensive isnt it? Should I insist he pay for it?


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  • #7
    ABajaninCork
    Closed Accounts Posts: 8,411 ✭✭✭ABajaninCork


    punkypolly wrote: »
    Thank you. If he does ask for proof, thats fine. I presume he will want a paternity test. How do I go about getting that? Its quite expensive isnt it? Should I insist he pay for it?

    No. Tell him to pay half.


  • #8
    tayto lover
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 53,835 ✭✭✭✭tayto lover


    You should have done something about this situation before now.
    You say you didn't want the father's involvement before but now that you're boy is 10 years old you feel you need financial assistance.
    That's fine but the father of you're child is now married and has a child with his wife. Had you contacted him earlier on in you're child's life he might have been in better financial circumstances to help and should have helped.
    However now that he is married if he has to help you then his own wife and child will probably suffer as a result. Maybe he would never have got married if he had been paying for his first child all along.
    It seems to be all about timing.
    You have my sympathies but why did you leave it so long?


  • #9
    punkypolly
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 27 ✭punkypolly


    Yes, you're right, I shouldnt have waited so long to try. However, I was scared, I was also stubborn and felt that I could cope completely independently on my own. However, I've realised that I cant. And I don't have a problem admitting that I need help. Before I was too proud to ask.
    But would you think that because I have left it so long, there will be a problem with this?
    Also, I dont think his wife knows about my child. And my son certainly does not know he has a half sister. With regards to his financial life/problems, I really dont care if it causes him trouble! He has lived with the knowledge that he has a child for 10 years and has done nothing about it. He was living with his head in the sand.


  • #10
    hyperborean
    Closed Accounts Posts: 655 ✭✭✭hyperborean


    He didnt want a child, you did. Why should he have to pay?


  • #11
    ABajaninCork
    Closed Accounts Posts: 8,411 ✭✭✭ABajaninCork


    hyperborean wrote: »
    He didnt want a child, you did. Why should he have to pay?

    Because he DID create a child. Whether he wanted to or not. If the father was so adamant he didn't want to be a father, then he, you, I and the dogs on the street knows there are certain steps to take to ensure this doesn't happen.

    So now the child is here, he pays to help bring him up. It's that simple.

    I hate stupid comments like this.


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  • #12
    punkypolly
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 27 ✭punkypolly


    Dear Hyperborean, I really dont think you should post statements like that when you have absolutely no clue or facts on the matter.


  • #13
    hyperborean
    Closed Accounts Posts: 655 ✭✭✭hyperborean


    ABajaninCork wrote: »
    Because he DID create a child. Whether he wanted to or not. If the father was so adamant he didn't want to be a father, then he, you, I and the dogs on the street knows there are certain steps to take to ensure this doesn't happen.

    So now the child is here, he pays to help bring him up. It's that simple.

    I hate stupid comments like this.

    She could have taken these steps too?

    The comment was not stupid, did you read above?

    This is simple and clear cut, he didnt want a child, she took a decision to have it and be a single mum, she takes full responsibiltiy.

    She cant change her mind 10 years later and force him to pay half for a decision he had no part in!

    I would love to know the legalisties of this, hopefully someone with better knowledge and less emotional opeinion comes along to clear it up.


  • #14
    hyperborean
    Closed Accounts Posts: 655 ✭✭✭hyperborean


    punkypolly wrote: »
    Dear Hyperborean, I really dont think you should post statements like that when you have absolutely no clue or facts on the matter.

    I can only go by the posts you made, if you have anything to add then by all means go ahead, I am not judging you.

    I read it that you advised him, he didnt want to be a father and this suited you for 10 years, now you want him to contribute?


  • #15
    wolfpawnat
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 6,124 ✭✭✭wolfpawnat


    Regardless of him wanting to have anything to do with his son or not, he has an obligation to pay for him.

    There are 2 paternity tests OP, one is called the peace of mind (€250-300) and the other is the court standing one (€1000) if he wants one you can offer half, but to be honest if he is contesting it he should pay. Although I feel if a woman has pulled a man along she should be forced to refund him the money were it to come back the child wasn't his.

    Having a new family does not excuse anyone for neglecting their duties to their other children. My father got remarried and would not pay for me and my sister after his son was born, and to be honest, every parent should pay for their children, don't want that hassle, get the snip!


  • #16
    ABajaninCork
    Closed Accounts Posts: 8,411 ✭✭✭ABajaninCork


    hyperborean wrote: »
    She could have taken these steps too?

    The comment was not stupid, did you read above?

    This is simple and clear cut, he didnt want a child, she took a decision to have it and be a single mum, she takes full responsibiltiy.

    She cant change her mind 10 years later and force him to pay half for a decision he had no part in!

    I would love to know the legalisties of this, hopefully someone with better knowledge and less emotional opeinion comes along to clear it up.

    I can read, thank you. It's a two way street. Despite what you say, NOBODY was forced to do anything! So, no. I don't feel sorry for the father.

    The OP came on here looking for help. Not judgement.


  • #17
    punkypolly
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 27 ✭punkypolly


    hyperborean wrote: »
    She could have taken these steps too?

    She cant change her mind 10 years later and force him to pay half for a decision he had no part in!

    I would love to know the legalisties of this, hopefully someone with better knowledge and less emotional opeinion comes along to clear it up.

    Yes, this is why I would like some advice. I dont think it is fair though that you assume that I "wanted" to be a single parent. I lived with the responsibility. I took it on. I took the responsibility, yes, but as an adult I think that he should be held responsible for his actions, or lack thereof - even after 10 years.


  • #18
    wolfpawnat
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 6,124 ✭✭✭wolfpawnat


    hyperborean wrote: »
    I would love to know the legalisties of this, hopefully someone with better knowledge and less emotional opeinion comes along to clear it up.

    The legalities are simple, he can contest the paternity of the child if he wishes. If he is found to be the father, the Irish Legal System will ensure he pays for his child, regardless of the child being 10 weeks, 10 years or even 17 years and 11 months.

    If she had been claiming OPFP the Social Welfare would have gone after him, and trust me when I saw they do not care what way a man feel towards his child.

    There is no point in him saying he did not want to be a father, he had sex, a child was conceived and born, it has two people who contributed DNA, ergo both have to contribute financially.


  • #19
    edgal
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 107 ✭✭edgal


    Is it possible to sue for maintenance for the past 10 years for rearing the child, along with future maintenance ?


  • #20
    hyperborean
    Closed Accounts Posts: 655 ✭✭✭hyperborean


    wolfpawnat wrote: »
    The legalities are simple, he can contest the paternity of the child if he wishes. If he is found to be the father, the Irish Legal System will ensure he pays for his child, regardless of the child being 10 weeks, 10 years or even 17 years and 11 months.

    If she had been claiming OPFP the Social Welfare would have gone after him, and trust me when I saw they do not care what way a man feel towards his child.

    There is no point in him saying he did not want to be a father, he had sex, a child was conceived and born, it has two people who contributed DNA, ergo both have to contribute financially.

    So he has to pay for a decision he had no part in making?

    Has nobody challenged this law?


  • #21
    punkypolly
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 27 ✭punkypolly


    hyperborean wrote: »
    So he has to pay for a decision he had no part in making?

    Has nobody challenged this law?

    Sorry, you dont have the full story.

    He was told that he was going to be a father. He answered me with "i dont want to be a part-time father". He then asked me "what do you want me to do about it?". He never made any decision or suggested I terminate, when he had all the chances he could have. ERGO, he took responsibility then and there by NOT making a decision.


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  • #22
    wolfpawnat
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 6,124 ✭✭✭wolfpawnat


    edgal wrote: »
    Is it possible to sue for maintenance for the past 10 years for rearing the child, along with future maintenance ?

    No, you cannot, only from the time you request it.
    hyperborean wrote: »
    So he has to pay for a decision he had no part in making?

    Has nobody challenged this law?

    The law was changed to make sure that children would be cared for. It is not the states job to pay for children unless the parents are struggling through no fault of their own. YOU have sex, YOU risk either getting pregnant or getting someone pregnant. Sex is the biological process of procreation, don't like that, then don't have it.

    People seem to think the can have sex and not wanting kids means the natural processes of the action should be ignored.

    As I said previously, if she had went to the SW, they would have gone after him and they are merciless at getting the money as it saves the state from the cost, they will go after your income at source. She has done what she could alone for as long as possible. He helped conceive it and he should help pay, a judge will tear a man to pieces for claiming he shouldn't pay for his actions.


  • #23
    hyperborean
    Closed Accounts Posts: 655 ✭✭✭hyperborean


    punkypolly wrote: »
    Sorry, you dont have the full story.

    He was told that he was going to be a father. He answered me with "i dont want to be a part-time father". He then asked me "what do you want me to do about it?". He never made any decision or suggested I terminate, when he had all the chances he could have. ERGO, he took responsibility then and there by NOT making a decision.

    I can only go by the posts you make, so not having the full facts is not my fault.

    You really should go to a Family Law specialist,


  • #24
    hyperborean
    Closed Accounts Posts: 655 ✭✭✭hyperborean


    wolfpawnat wrote: »
    No, you cannot, only from the time you request it.



    The law was changed to make sure that children would be cared for. It is not the states job to pay for children unless the parents are struggling through no fault of their own. YOU have sex, YOU risk either getting pregnant or getting someone pregnant. Sex is the biological process of procreation, don't like that, then don't have it.

    People seem to think the can have sex and not wanting kids means the natural processes of the action should be ignored.

    As I said previously, if she had went to the SW, they would have gone after him and they are merciless at getting the money as it saves the state from the cost, they will go after your income at source. She has done what she could alone for as long as possible. He helped conceive it and he should help pay, a judge will tear a man to pieces for claiming he shouldn't pay for his actions.

    What law is this? Can you link to this legislation for the OP?


  • #25
    ABajaninCork
    Closed Accounts Posts: 8,411 ✭✭✭ABajaninCork


    wolfpawnat wrote: »
    If she had been claiming OPFP the Social Welfare would have gone after him, and trust me when I saw they do not care what way a man feel towards his child.

    That's a good point. OP, you might be better off getting this thread moved either to the Parenting or State Benefits forae. You'll get better advice there, as we're not allowed to give legal advice on this forum.

    Just click on the red triangle on your OP and ask the mod to move the thread.


  • #26
    punkypolly
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 27 ✭punkypolly


    ABajaninCork wrote: »
    That's a good point. OP, you might be better off getting this thread moved either to the Parenting or State Benefits forae. You'll get better advice there, as we're not allowed to give legal advice on this forum.

    Just click on the red triangle on your OP and ask the mod to move the thread.

    Thank you! I wasnt sure what forum to post the question on.


  • #27
    wolfpawnat
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 6,124 ✭✭✭wolfpawnat


    hyperborean wrote: »
    What law is this? Can you link to this legislation for the OP?

    http://www.courts.ie/Courts.ie/library3.nsf/pagecurrent/B11AB02FEC1D7101802577EA00400AF8?opendocument

    As it states, the Irish State views both parents as financially responsible for their child(ren) regardless of their status.


  • #28
    Pat Mustard
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 9,554 ✭✭✭Pat Mustard


    hyperborean wrote: »
    What law is this? Can you link to this legislation for the OP?

    The Family Law (Maintenance of Spouses & Children Act 1976 (as amended).

    From reading your posts, it appears that you believe that the father should not have to support his own child because the mother had not previously enforced the child's rights, or because the father was inadequately prepared for fatherhood.

    In this country, parents have a duty to maintain their children.

    Just because the mother has not previously sought maintenance on her son's behalf, does not justify complete neglect of that child by the father for the life of that child.

    In theory, an application for back-maintenance could be made in conjunction with an ordinary application for maintenance, although various different factors would come in to play.

    The law is adequate. The father is not the victim here.




    EDIT: Social Welfare policy and procedure on maintenance recovery.

    The relevant legislation is in ss. 345 and 346 of the Social Welfare Consolidation Act 2005, as amended.


  • #29
    Procrastastudy
    Closed Accounts Posts: 6,224 ✭✭✭Procrastastudy


    How ever the sprog comes into existence it took two to tango and it's the right of the child at issue.

    As an aside, if you'll permit the slight hijack OP, could the father not have given up his parental rights though a court and avoided maintenance?


  • #30
    ABajaninCork
    Closed Accounts Posts: 8,411 ✭✭✭ABajaninCork


    Procrastastudy wrote: »
    As an aside, if you'll permit the slight hijack OP, could the father not have given up his parental rights though a court and avoided maintenance?

    I didn't think that was possible either here or in the UK. It's only in the US (AFAIK) you can do this. But stand to be corrected.


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  • #31
    punkypolly
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 27 ✭punkypolly


    Procrastastudy wrote: »
    How ever the sprog comes into existence it took two to tango and it's the right of the child at issue.

    As an aside, if you'll permit the slight hijack OP, could the father not have given up his parental rights though a court and avoided maintenance?


    I dont know if he could or could not do that. And if he could I wasn't made aware of it! If he did do the above, would he not have to at least make me aware that he was doing this first?

    That's a very odd though. Giving up parental rights would be considered adoption, wouldnt it?


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