Any Decent Number Plates on the Horizon???

The Aussie

Just wondering if there is any talk/rumour about a decent number plate allocation coming up*, I mean the motor industry seem to ask for something and they seem to get it i.e. Scrapage Scheme, stupid 131 # ### ect...

Is there any chance of them issuing them over the next while?

* I know number plates are just that but some vintage cars look better with a maximum of 6 numbers and or letters instead of a number plate that has more digits than a foreign phone number.

bbsrs

The Aussie wrote: »

Just wondering if there is any talk/rumour about a decent number plate allocation coming up*, I mean the motor industry seem to ask for something and they seem to get it i.e. Scrapage Scheme, stupid 131 # ### ect...

Is there any chance of them issuing them over the next while?

* I know number plates are just that but some vintage cars look better with a maximum of 6 numbers and or letters instead of a number plate that has more digits than a foreign phone number.

Not unless you go through Donedeal and find a plate and logbook that suits your needs.

steveone

sorry to butt in on your thread with not a lot to say but I thought that people were only joking about the 131 reg... I can't believe that they wouldn't put 13d or whatever...can you apply for a 13 straightforward reg? tell you what.. if you got a modern that might be considered a hot rod of the future....with a 13 reg.....

Capri

131 is a bit like the yearly NCT tests / 6mth NCT's for older taxis - a sop to the Arfur Daley's of Ireland who just rip customers off :mad:

IF the govt. had any cop on they'd just do like the Aussies/Kiwi's do and sell whatever combination the punter wants :rolleyes:

The Aussie

Capri wrote: »

IF the govt. had any cop on they'd just do like the Aussies/Kiwi's do and sell whatever combination the punter wants :rolleyes:

100% agree, its strange to see those shower to miss a trick like that, especially when you see them off shaking the poor tin around the place and riding everybody at every available opportunity.

I can only speak for the Queensland system here but a Personalised Plate goes anywhere upto $3300 so thats about €2500. Just for a small bit of paperwork, that's easy money for them if someone wishes to pay for it.

Capri

The Aussie wrote: »

100% agree, its strange to see those shower to miss a trick like that, especially when you see them off shaking the poor tin around the place and riding everybody at every available opportunity.

I can only speak for the Queensland system here but a Personalised Plate goes anywhere upto $3300 so thats about €2500. Just for a small bit of paperwork, that's easy money for them if someone wishes to pay for it.

And there's enough here that would give up eating just to get a personalised plate. :rolleyes:

There ARE some examples the would be like 95 D 911 (911), 07 WW 211 (W211 Merc) , 11 C 320 (C320 ) , and they would have to pay a relatively small fee to 'reserve' that number when it comes up in the sequence, but nothing like the UK system that tells you it's 'illegal' to make up something by altering the spacing/font, yet sells the plates on the basis that someone WILL do exactly that in order for the name to be understood MAR 1 E (MARiE ), 1 MRN ( IMR(a)N ), . The Poles and the Latvians allow full personalisation such as QUATTRO 8 or SPICEK R .

corktina

that "small" fee is a Grand....

what about a 1913 car imported? would that be "131" or "13" I wonder?

Capri

corktina wrote: »

what about a 1913 car imported? would that be "131" or "13" I wonder?:p:p:p:p

A grand for a reserved plate :eek::eek::eek: Typical of this country, GREED that shoots itself in the foot :p

A pro-rata sliding scale would be more logical :rolleyes:

John Larkin

13 C 20 is on a Rolls Royce.

iverjohnston

Might be time to get that Fiat Miafiori registered!

corktina

John Larkin wrote: »

13 C 20 is on a Rolls Royce.

but if you brought it in today would it get a 131?

gipi

Worse than that, would it get 131 D 120001 (if registered in Dublin, for example)?

The Aussie

gipi wrote: »

131 D 120001

Yep, that the idiotic foreign phone number size plate I was thinking of, one word for it is Stupid.

Silvera

AFAIK, only vehicles first registered after 1-1-13 (i.e. NEW) will be allocated 131/132, etc plates.

I used to be (kinda) in favour of personalised plates, however I think that such plates can be very tacky. Many countries don't allow (bother with) personalised plates, e.g. Switzerland (who I personally think have probably the nicest looking type/style/system of plates).

I totally agree that the current plate system for pre-1987 vehicle imports is totally wrong e.g. '120000'+ on (Dublin) plates.

ZV followed by 5-digits also look wrong. They should at least introduce an update ZV system (as I have suggested many times previously) -

1 ZV - 999 ZV (pre-1920 vehicles)
1000 ZV - 9999 ZV (1921-1960 vehicles)
ZVA 1 - ZVA 999
ZVB 1 - ZVB 999
ZVC 1 - ZVC 999
etc etc etc (1961-1987 vehicles)

It always seems to be the case that unless there is money to be made out of it the govt just doesnt care. God forbid they might do something with the registration system that favours/benefits the average person for a change - and doesnt involve people having to hand over their hard-earned cash (e.g. an updated ZV system).

Capri

The Aussie wrote: »

Yep, that the idiotic foreign phone number size plate I was thinking of, one word for it is Stupid.

India has new 10 digit number plates

http://rakesh-roczs.blogspot.ie/2012/01/new-age-number-plates.html

http://www.team-bhp.com/forum/indian-car-scene/23057-high-security-number-plates-india-26.html


http://www.highsecurityplates.com/

Sam Russell

Capri wrote: »

India has new 10 digit number plates

http://rakesh-roczs.blogspot.ie/2012/01/new-age-number-plates.html

http://www.team-bhp.com/forum/indian-car-scene/23057-high-security-number-plates-india-26.html


http://www.highsecurityplates.com/

India, with a population of 1.2 billion can have 10 digit number plates and we have 15 digit ones for a population of 4 million. There has to be something wrong here.

If the Government were to introduce a scheme like the UK SORN to get people to notify that the cars were off the road, then after an appropriate time, old registrations that were dormant could be cancelled and all the old numbers reused. People with cars hidden in the barn could 'reserve' the numbers under the scheme.

Simple solution.

Silvera

As a matter of interest, can you give me an example of a 15-digit Irish plate?

Maybe I am missing something, but by my reckoning Irish plates could (potentially) have a potential maximum of 10-digits, e.g 131-D-120000..

Dont get me wrong, I believe we should have a smaller/better registration system, perhaps like Switzerland where they use the Canton (i.e. County) letters, followed by UP TO six-numbers. e.g. Zurich registration 'ZH 300 100' (numbers are also re-issued there).

Ireland could do likewise, e.g. Wicklow Reg 'WW 300 100'

Capri

The funny thing is we were actually the first in the EU to introduce the EU plates :cool::cool:

Then Revenue/DoE fecked it up :mad::mad:

Silvera

Capri wrote: »

The funny thing is we were actually the first in the EU to introduce the EU plates :cool::cool:

Then Revenue/DoE fecked it up :mad::mad:

If they were more interested in putting together a registration system for simply and easily identifying a vehicle, and less interested in trying to create revenue from the registration plate system, we would all be better off.

carchaeologist

Why the obsession with reissuing old pre '87 plates? If a plate was already issued to a car it should never be issued to another.

Simple fix would be to reverse the 1980s AZV-YZV issues giving 1AZV- 999YZV, a huge amount of issues and still looking authentic.

With all the clubs in the country no one seems to be pushing for anything decent apart from a few enthusiasts.

Sam Russell

Silvera wrote: »

As a matter of interest, can you give me an example of a 15-digit Irish plate?

Maybe I am missing something, but by my reckoning Irish plates could (potentially) have a potential maximum of 10-digits, e.g 131-D-120000..

Dont get me wrong, I believe we should have a smaller/better registration system, perhaps like Switzerland where they use the Canton (i.e. County) letters, followed by UP TO six-numbers. e.g. Zurich registration 'ZH 300 100' (numbers are also re-issued there).

Ireland could do likewise, e.g. Wicklow Reg 'WW 300 100'

I exagerated the number of digits. In Switzerland, the number is related to the owner, not the car. If you change cars, the plates stay with you. Change Canton, and you have to get a new number. If you get a second car, you get a new number.

We have a 2 digit year, now we have a three digit year. We could have used a single letter that would give 20 years worth of numbers, and reversed another 20 years( as the Bitish did from 1963) So we now have two extra digits. We started the year number on 87, which is not very clever as 88, 89, 90, 93, 96, 98, 99, 00, are all very simillar. We could have started with a 1, which is a narrow number but instead started with 87. Just to certain it was screwed up, we went back in time and gave out 86, 80 as well. So that means all these year number plates can be easily confused by a quick glance. Then we gave out numbers for cars going back to the year dot. So 12D1 is either the Lord Mayors car or an ancient 2 HP yoke from a century ago. As time goes on, they will add a digit every time there is a drop in car sales. They have already added digits to avoid 13 under the pretence of adjusting people purchasing time so the back end of the year will get sales. They have added digits to imported cars so it easier to spot them. So maybe cars first registered this year may end up with 15 digit numbers. We do not need 10 or 12 digits. There is no logic to the current screwed up system. We have three different schemes at present. The ancient one, the ZV one and the year based one. Even that has now been modified to look stupid. Heaven help us and guard us from Civil Servants with ideas and politicians that listen to them.

[Rant over]

corktina

The Aussie wrote: »

Any Decent Number Plates on the Horizon???
Just wondering if there is any talk/rumour about a decent number plate allocation coming up*, I mean the motor industry seem to ask for something and they seem to get it i.e. Scrapage Scheme, stupid 131 # ### ect...

Is there any chance of them issuing them over the next while?

* I know number plates are just that but some vintage cars look better with a maximum of 6 numbers and or letters instead of a number plate that has more digits than a foreign phone number.

Is it a Chrysler Horizon or a Talbot Horizon?

macplaxton

Talbot



Nice Serck plate that.:pac:

Silvera

Sam Russell wrote: »

I exagerated the number of digits. In Switzerland, the number is related to the owner, not the car. If you change cars, the plates stay with you. Change Canton, and you have to get a new number. If you get a second car, you get a new number.

We have a 2 digit year, now we have a three digit year. We could have used a single letter that would give 20 years worth of numbers, and reversed another 20 years( as the Bitish did from 1963) So we now have two extra digits. We started the year number on 87, which is not very clever as 88, 89, 90, 93, 96, 98, 99, 00, are all very simillar. We could have started with a 1, which is a narrow number but instead started with 87. Just to certain it was screwed up, we went back in time and gave out 86, 80 as well. So that means all these year number plates can be easily confused by a quick glance. Then we gave out numbers for cars going back to the year dot. So 12D1 is either the Lord Mayors car or an ancient 2 HP yoke from a century ago. As time goes on, they will add a digit every time their is a drop in car sales. They have already added digits to avoid 13 under the pretence of adjusting people purchasing time so the back end of the year will get sales. They have added digits to imported cars so it easier to spot them. So maybe cars first registered this year may end up with 15 digit numbers. We do not need 10 or 12 digits. There is no logic to the current screwed up system. We have three different schemes at present. The ancient one, the ZV one and the year based one. Even that has now been modified to look stupid. Heaven help us and guard us from Civil Servants with ideas and politicians that listen to them.

[Rant over]

I am aware that plates in Switzerland stay with the owner, which is a good system in itself. Ireland could have done likewise, hence my example of 'WW 300 100' (even the way the Swiss space out their plates (e.g. 'ZH 300 100') makes them easier to remember - surely the whole point of a good reg plate system in the first place).
Technically speaking a Swiss driver can use the same number on two different vehicles - but only one may be on the road at any given time.

I agree with your rant, our system wasnt thought out clearly from the start and has resulted in duplication, re-issues, etc
For example, '03-WX-1' was issued many years ago to a vintage 1903 vehicle. However I have since seen '03-WX-1' on a 2003 Ford Focus saloon?!. Go figure?!

The Aussie

corktina wrote: »

Is it a Chrysler Horizon or a Talbot Horizon?

Just a general inquiry, but I've got 2 early land rover for instance the space on the front wing is 9 inches X 12 inches, could I legally fit in all the stupid ##~C~###### into that space, for example (photos off a sale add, so not my vehicle just wanted an example of a 3 letter 3 number plate for reference).





And Rear is 9 inches X 13 inches

macplaxton

The Aussie wrote: »

the space on the front wing is 9 inches X 12 inches, could I legally fit in all the stupid ##~C~###### into that space

First thing, Cork isn't quite as massive a number as Dublin. It would YY - C - nnnnn (they kick off at 40001). Now technically, on a 1987> style format, the plate itself must be done on a 1987> style plate. The size of all those characters would fit inside the prescribed modern 340mm x 220mm "square" plate. The exception to the "must be done on a 1987> style plate" rule is the ZV series, which is (also) permitted to be done in <1987 style, covered by the 1982 regs (there is nothing preventing ZV series plates being done in the new style). The 1982 regs do not specify a standard plate size, but either a oblong and square arrangement of letters and specification of the stroke width,spacing of letters and borders which would, depending on the actual registration mark, dictate the minimum size of plate. So something like "Z 1" would only need a very smalll plate and ZV 26401 would need something a bit bigger (or longer)

John Larkin

macplaxton wrote: »

The 1982 regs do not specify a standard plate size, but either a oblong and square arrangement of letters and specification of the stroke width,spacing of letters and borders which would, depending on the actual registration mark, dictate the minimum size of plate. So something like "Z 1" would only need a very smalll plate and ZV 26401 would need something a bit bigger (or longer)

Since you mention it....

The Aussie

macplaxton wrote: »

First thing, Cork isn't quite as massive a number as Dublin. It would YY - C - nnnnn

Semantics, Cork was used as a generic example of a number plate, exchange with D or DL if it makes you feel better

Dublin should not even be a massive number if someone used their brain to start with, it's a fine example of the biggest word in Irish marketing being "New" and this 131/132 rubbish just goes to proves it.

mb1725

Michael Noonan has already ruled out any personalised plates, no mention of vintage/classic reg.
http://www.dailyedge.ie/government-rules-out-allowing-personalised-registration-plates-327708-Jan2012/

Maybe organised, concerted lobbying is called for?

DieselPowered

gipi wrote: »

Worse than that, would it get 131 D 120001 (if registered in Dublin, for example)?

The unusual "D-120xxx" only applies in Dublin to 2010 and older cars, for some reason it stopped and went back to next-in-line with 2011, 2012 and soon to be imports in 2013.

Each county starts at a different number


10-D-120001
09-D-120001
etc

Sam Russell

Norn Iron manages with just 7 digits. Example AIZ 3120. (Hope that is not a real vehicle).:)

hi5

If the indentation or space provided is is not big enough, then you can reduce both the plate and number size to suit, this goes for new cars too:)

http://www.ncts.ie/pdf/NCT%20Manual%20Revise%20May%202012.pdf

Page 8 section 7.

6. Dimensions for letters and numbers should be as shown in the sketch on page 12.
7. Where the indented space provided for the number plate is not sufficient to accommodate a standard size number plate, the registration plate and registration letters and numbers may be reduced in size relative to the space provided for the number plate.

bijapos

mb1725 wrote: »

Michael Noonan has already ruled out any personalised plates, no mention of vintage/classic reg.
http://www.dailyedge.ie/government-rules-out-allowing-personalised-registration-plates-327708-Jan2012/

From that article above:

Noonan dismissed the proposal, however, saying he did not want to change the current system which allows prospective buyers to figure out the age, and registration place, of a vehicle at a glance.

This shows the imbecile thinking behind government decisions: he says the current system allows people to figure out the age of the car; why the hell would someone need that? The easy way around this is to change the log book and give every car an original Irish number under the existing system by year, i.e. 77KY834 or 09D120345, then allow them to change the number if they wish with the original number staying in the log book so that it can be verified.

Not happy with that? Then keep the county and year on it, and allow the rest to be modified, e.g. 09 D TOMMY 1 . Maintain the original number in the log book as well. Charge people for this, it's revenue that some people will gladly hand over.

It is seen as a simple and effective registration plate system which is indeed the envy of many European registration authorities, including the UK,” Noonan wrote in a parliamentary reply to Timmins.

If our system is the envy of the world why has nobody else copied it?:rolleyes:

A move to a more complicated plating system, using variations of letters and numbers, could create confusion without providing any real benefits.
The minister also warned that allowing a parallel system of personalised numberplates would place further demands on other agencies like the Gardaí, the government and the Revenue Commissioners.

Who would be confused? Is Noonan saying that Revenue and the Guards are too thick to implement a system like this, sounds to me like he was stuck for some lame excuse. There is another reason for this, he just isn't prepared to tell us what it is.

“The small size of the Irish car market, the potential for confusion and increased tax evasion, as well as the costs of administering such a scheme, raise considerable doubts as to whether any real overall benefit would accrue to the State,” he said.

If he wants to avoid tax evasion then he should introduce the SORN system ASAP. He could also move the tax disk from the windscreen to the reg plates like Sweden or Germany, and while he's at it, move the insurance disk there too. It might also have the added advantage of reducing registration plate cloning.

Maybe organised, concerted lobbying is called for?

Want to lobby a political party ? Then make a hefty donation.

Sam Russell

The Gardai have the ability (at least in some of their vehicles) to check the registrations against the database of a vehicle in moving traffic, so no cause for confusion there.

A further way of saving costs would be to move the Road Tax collection to the insurance companies and tie the two together. So Road Tax becomes a levy on insurance, not a seperate charge. The SORN system is coming, only trouble is WHEN?

If that is implemented, then it would make it easier to tackle the elephant in the room. Not taxed or SORN, then registration lapses after a period (say a year) and vehicle goes through re-registration, including NCT check and €200 charge. Old registration books become pointless except for genuine collectors (if any).

Silvera

It is seen as a simple and effective registration plate system which is indeed the envy of many European registration authorities, including the UK,” Noonan wrote in a parliamentary reply to Timmins.

Technically speaking the UK 'copied' our system when they introduced the 'year' on their plates from 2001. (While not a direct 'copy' of our system, new vehicles registered there from 2001 do show the 'year' every second registration period.).


I believe the IVVCC are formulating ideas to put to govt with regard to the ZV/Vintage registration system.

corktina

Silvera wrote: »

Technically speaking the UK 'copied' our system when they introduced the 'year' on their plates from 2001. (While not a direct 'copy' of our system, new vehicles registered there from 2001 do show the 'year' every second registration period.).


I believe the IVVCC are formulating ideas to put to govt with regard to the ZV/Vintage registration system.

the UK system is odd...a vehicle registered in Jan or feb 2013 gets a 2012 registration...(62)

Capri

corktina wrote: »

the UK system is odd...a vehicle registered in Jan or feb 2013 gets a 2012 registration...(62)

?????????????/ :eek::eek:

corktina

Capri wrote: »

?????????????/ :eek::eek:

tis true...the numbers change in March(and sept or thereabouts) ...so a Jan or feb 2013 car would have a 2012 number...

macplaxton

But it's not an odd system, it's just you Corky.

All the old year letters, bar the A-E suffixes, represent more than one calendar year.

A-D suffix - 1963-1966 Jan-Dec.
E suffix - 1967 Jan-Jul (a short 7 month period)
F suffix onwards 1st August annual change - (having a sales peak (or not) due to a year letter change in the middle of winter was deemed daft)
The annual year letter changed to semi-annually in 1999 which used up the last year letters quickly and requiring a new system to be drawn up for 2001.
So S-prefix runs from Aug 1998 to Feb 1999, then every six months there is a change on the 1st March / 1st September. The semi annual system sorts out the massive bulge in sales half-way through the school summer holidays. Makes in much easier for the trade to do half in spring / half in autumn.

Anyway, the DVLA are going head with "13" from the 1st of March 2013 to August 31st. Apparently, their solution to those of a superstitious persuasion is to offer the concession of previous half-year denominator (62) to be taken instead.

http://www.evo.co.uk/news/evonews/285994/superstitious_buyers_can_skip_13reg.html

(Seems a sensible compromise to take and doesn't involve make the numbers stupidly long or changing the system completely)