Are we too bitter when it comes to politics?

Foxhound38

Now, as a disclaimer, I happen to think that the current Dail is littered with incompetant morons, but maybe that's the point - look at any thread here, or politics.ie, or newspaper comment section. They are full to the brim with people whinging about the politicians (which they have every right to, even if it does verge on the ridiculous at times - I am fairly sure I once found someone literallly blaming the government for the weather), I'm convinced we love giving out as a nation, whinging is pretty much the national pass-time and I'm not immune from that myself, and politicians are and always have been a prime target.

But it does beg the question - who in their right mind would put themselves forward for such treatment? Maybe the reason we end up with self-serving crooks in the Dail who don't give a sh*te about others, is because we as a nation have no regard for politics as a profession, or the political system in general beyond giving abuse to politicians - so you need to be that sort of person to survive or even to want to be in such an environment. Could it be this vicious circle of abuse and incompetance that is the cause of our history of atrocious governance?

What do ye think?

Princess Consuela Bananahammock

Foxhound38 wrote: »

Now, as a disclaimer, I happen to think that the current Dail is littered with incompetant morons, but maybe that's the point - look at any thread here, or politics.ie, or newspaper comment section. They are full to the brim with people whinging about the politicians (which they have every right to, even if it does verge on the ridiculous at times - I am fairly sure I once found someone literallly blaming the government for the weather), I'm convinced we love giving out as a nation, whinging is pretty much the national pass-time and I'm not immune from that myself, and politicians are and always have been a prime target.

But it does beg the question - who in their right mind would put themselves forward for such treatment? Maybe the reason we end up with self-serving crooks in the Dail who don't give a sh*te about others, is because we as a nation have no regard for politics as a profession, or the political system in general beyond giving abuse to politicians - so you need to be that sort of person to survive or even to want to be in such an environment. Could it be this vicious circle of abuse and incompetance that is the cause of our history of atrocious governance?

What do ye think?

We don't have politicians in Ireland, generally speaking, we have corrupt business men who won a popularity contest. Why do they put themselves up? Well, mainly becuase they are very thick-skinned and greedy. I'd put up with a little **** for their wages.

smash

Foxhound38 wrote: »

But it does beg the question - who in their right mind would put themselves forward for such treatment?

People with unwarranted superiority complexes who want to get paid a lot for a job that their advisers do for them!

Boombastic

Too many teachers thinking they are dealing with children (electorate) in the dail. They treat us like morans, while lining their pockets. All the bullsh1t talk about what they'll do when they get elected, but the u-turning and pretending the never said it.

Ush1

Democracy is a horror show.

Stupid electorate votes in stupid representatives. I'd love to be really proud of our politicians.....and electorate.

Dravokivich

Ush1 wrote: »

Democracy is a horror show.

Stupid electorate votes in stupid representatives. I'd love to be really proud of our politicians.....and electorate.

You can only vote for what's on the card in your constituency. Voters aren't really the blame, when there's such a lack of credibility available.

nbar12

I've got a combine harvester and I'll give you the key...

Princess Consuela Bananahammock

Dravokivich wrote: »

You can only vote for what's on the card in your constituency. Voters aren't really the blame, when there's such a lack of credibility available.

Disagree with you slightly here because the option is there to not vote for any of them. I know people harp on about being privileged with the right to vote, but you also have to right to NOT vote. And if you think there's no-one in your constituency worthy of being elected, still going ahead and voting for one of them is, I beleive, being overly tolerant.

And politicians rely on this.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=5kS8cLd8KYg

Leftist

you don't get good candidates unless there is some kind of crisis. When society is stable and regardless of what anyone says, irish society is stable, then you get mundane professional politicians. Dorks who dream of beauracricy from a young age.

Ush1

Dravokivich wrote: »

You can only vote for what's on the card in your constituency. Voters aren't really the blame, when there's such a lack of credibility available.

If I believed that most voters felt like that and didn't want to vote for an independant I'd have more sympathy.

For the most part, the electorate seem to vote for someone because they did them a favour, something on a local level, etc...or their family has a link or tradition with certain political parties/party members.

Captain Chaos

Ikky Poo2 wrote: »

Disagree with you slightly here because the option is there to not vote for any of them. I know people harp on about being privileged with the right to vote, but you also have to right to NOT vote. And if you think there's no-one in your constituency worthy of being elected, still going ahead and voting for one of them is, I beleive, being overly tolerant.

It's not an opt out system. If you don't vote then they just take it as you are happy with the current lot. I have never voted because of your above view but at the end of the day it's still wasted but at least I can say I didn't vote them in power but I did nothing to stop them either.

There should be a no confidence vote option.

ejmaztec

The blame for us getting sh1t politicians can be laid squarely on the political parties giving us the wrong candidates. E.G. Some GAA guy reaching the end of his playing career and getting chosen as a candidate solely due to his sporting popularity, when his only talent is that he was once good at kicking a ball around. He then gets a job for life as a TD and all associated benefits, even though he contributes little or nothing to his constituency or country as a whole.

lazygal

I think I'm just bitter enough towards politicians.

Princess Consuela Bananahammock

Captain Chaos wrote: »

It's not an opt out system. If you don't vote then they just take it as you are happy with the current lot. I have never voted because of your above view but at the end of the day it's still wasted but at least I can say I didn't vote them in power but I did nothing to stop them either.

There should be a no confidence vote option.

Or just spoil your vote...? Although how people would get the impression I'm happy with the current lot because I didn;t vote is beyond me.

SebBerkovich

We've got 2 main parties that are both Center Right, and both agree on nearly everything. That doesn't make for an atmosphere where someone in politics can come across as anything other than a yes-man.

Ush1

Captain Chaos wrote: »

It's not an opt out system. If you don't vote then they just take it as you are happy with the current lot. I have never voted because of your above view but at the end of the day it's still wasted but at least I can say I didn't vote them in power but I did nothing to stop them either.

There should be a no confidence vote option.

Agree with that.

Purposefully spoiling your vote make any odds?

Dravokivich

Ikky Poo2 wrote: »

Disagree with you slightly here because the option is there to not vote for any of them. I know people harp on about being privileged with the right to vote, but you also have to right to NOT vote. And if you think there's no-one in your constituency worthy of being elected, still going ahead and voting for one of them is, I beleive, being overly tolerant.

And politicians rely on this.

I get what you're saying, but that's an effect. People feel they need to vote. So when they've shíte choices, they'd pick who they think is less shít. Abstaining from the vote is no different, as mentioned by another guy above, that means you are accepting other people's choices, from what you've already recognised to be shít choices. So in all instances, it's going to be based on what's listed in the card regardless of who chooses to vote or not.

mickydoomsux

We expect far too much too soon from our politicians. Getting anything meaningful done in Government takes ages and the results usually take years to become apparent.

We expect the new crowd we elect to be in and have 'fixed the economy' within a fortnight without doing anything that effects our own stack of chips. There are undoubtedly some useless arseholes in the Dail but there are a number of politicians who are trying to sort out the country by making unpopular but necessary decisions. We usually just whinge about them and heap praise on whoever stands up and gives the prettiest meaningless tirade about 'de vulnerable'.

Ush1

Dravokivich wrote: »

I get what you're saying, but that's an effect. People feel they need to vote. So when they've shíte choices, they'd pick who they think is less shít. Abstaining from the vote is no different, as mentioned by another guy above, that means you are accepting other people's choices, from what you've already recognised to be shít choices. So in all instances, it's going to be based on what's listed in the card regardless of who chooses to vote or not.

If you can vote no confidence it will still show that perhaps even though somebody won, the majority of people were not happy with the choices. Seems like a flawed system.

This is all presuming that the electorate are disatisfied with all choices, which I don't believe is the case for the majority.

Richard Hillman

I dont think it helps that the vast majority of media outlets are purely anti-government. No matter who they are, what they do or say the media outlets will criticise them just to sell some papers or boost the ratings. Everyone is out to appeal to the lowest common denominator.

hyperborean

Politicians do what politicians do, to say they are incompetant is missing the point, Irish politicians are good at being Irish politicians, very similair to the civil service where there is 0 accountability tightly wrapped around big salaries and privalages. This is the way it is and generally they are good at keeping the status quo, there probably are a few altruistic guys doing it for the good of the country-politicians but they are side shows with no power.

The real problem with this country is the voters, complaining about the politicians they voted in is rubbish, time and again the irish voters have proven to be a shallow lot,,,

FF are a prime example, while they dished out tax reductions and let the banks deal in their credit the voters happily gacve them powerm and once it was apparent that the gravy train was over they jumped ship to the next bunch of promising politicians, needless to say once FG get a majority they will use every FF trick in the book to keep it, there will be targeted bribes for the voting public and the circle will start again.

Dont worry, thats just the way it is,

Princess Consuela Bananahammock

Dravokivich wrote: »

I get what you're saying, but that's an effect. People feel they need to vote. So when they've shíte choices, they'd pick who they think is less shít. Abstaining from the vote is no different, as mentioned by another guy above, that means you are accepting other people's choices, from what you've already recognised to be shít choices. So in all instances, it's going to be based on what's listed in the card regardless of who chooses to vote or not.

But this is what they rely on: us voting in one of them when they know there is little or no difference.