Plyometrics - Plan by debate

ecoli

Noticed it is something never really discussed around here. With talk of sessions, strength, core etc seems really surprising that this doesnt come up

For anyone who doesnt know what this is here is a quick summary

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Plyometrics

http://www.runnersworld.com/workouts/get-jump-it

Usual format of a question every so often to spark the discussion

What exercises do you feel work best for distance runners (or sprinters)? How often in a week to do them?

Ceepo

ecoli wrote: »

Noticed it is something never really discussed around here. With talk of sessions, strength, core etc seems really surprising that this doesnt come up

For anyone who doesnt know what this is here is a quick summary

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Plyometrics

http://www.runnersworld.com/workouts/get-jump-it

Usual format of a question every so often to spark the discussion

What exercises do you feel work best for distance runners (or sprinters)? How often in a week to do them?

Probably them main reason that it is not discussed here to much is that very few people do them,

I am sure that more sprint/track guy's do them a lot, but distance runner's in the whole do not,

Distance runners want to run,

I would be a big fan of doing them as they are a great benefit to running form, now i don't think they will make you much faster as such but they will help with running form and will also improve technique which i turn will benefit towards the end of any race when you are getting tired, so i suppose by extension may help make you faster, well maybe not slow down as much,

The thing i would say is to start small and work up, as with anything new, i would suggest start with by doing 3/ 4 sets of 3 or 4 by any these over a 20/30 m course, high knees, (aim for speed), butt kicks, bound's, leap's (aim for high), fast feet, skip's one, leg skip's.
These are only a few load's more.

The biggest thing to remember when doing these IS TO KEEP GOOD FORM, if your form is not right stop and start again,

I would make sure you have no injury's or niggles starting out as these can be hard on the legs.

Typically i would say once a week would be enough for distance runner's more for sprinters maybe.

A session i used to do was 20 min easy run followed by 20 min Plyometric's 20 min easy run

Pisco Sour

I generally do drills 3 days a week. Before my 2 track sessions and then before a race. I only spend about 5-7 minutes or so on them because I’m usually pretty tight for time getting to training from work so don’t have time to be spending 20 minutes on them. On race day I then just replicate what I do before training.

Usually do the following:

- Hugh Knees
- Butt Kicks
- Skips
- Hurdle right leg (where every 4th step you do a sort of hurdling motion)
- Hurdle left leg (where every 4th step you do a sort of hurdling motion)
- Don’t know what this is called. Basically keep your legs straight and run
- Short sharps fast steps. Thinks it’s called pitter-patter but not sure.
- Also practice the motion of my stride but in kind of slow motion while walking.

I really should learn the names to some of these.

No idea if these would benefit a distance runner or not. All I know is that, rightly or wrongly, I never see any of them doing them. The only people I see doing drills are sprinters and jumpers.

Am no expert in distance running but if you were wanting to implement something new into your programme I’d go with increasing core work, and implementing some weights into your routine as opposed to drills. The amount of people who get injured because they don’t feel the need to do this stuff is ridiculous.

average_runner

Pisco Sour wrote: »

I generally do drills 3 days a week. Before my 2 track sessions and then before a race. I only spend about 5-7 minutes or so on them because I’m usually pretty tight for time getting to training from work so don’t have time to be spending 20 minutes on them. On race day I then just replicate what I do before training.

Usually do the following:

- Hugh Knees
- Butt Kicks
- Skips
- Hurdle right leg (where every 4th step you do a sort of hurdling motion)
- Hurdle left leg (where every 4th step you do a sort of hurdling motion)
- Don’t know what this is called. Basically keep your legs straight and run
- Short sharps fast steps. Thinks it’s called pitter-patter but not sure.
- Also practice the motion of my stride but in kind of slow motion while walking.

I really should learn the names to some of these.

No idea if these would benefit a distance runner or not. All I know is that, rightly or wrongly, I never see any of them doing them. The only people I see doing drills are sprinters and jumpers.

Am no expert in distance running but if you were wanting to implement something new into your programme I’d go with increasing core work, and implementing some weights into your routine as opposed to drills. The amount of people who get injured because they don’t feel the need to do this stuff is ridiculous.

We usually do the ones described above before our session on Tuesday and Thursday night.

RayCun

Pisco Sour wrote: »

- Also practice the motion of my stride but in kind of slow motion while walking.

A-step
After a few of those you should do A-skip, the same motion but in a skip

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=aJ2ITke-8PE

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=pSkgR_qxvP8

Ceepo

Pisco Sour wrote: »

I generally do drills 3 days a week. Before my 2 track sessions and then before a race. I only spend about 5-7 minutes or so on them because I’m usually pretty tight for time getting to training from work so don’t have time to be spending 20 minutes on them. On race day I then just replicate what I do before training.

Usually do the following:

- Hugh Knees
- Butt Kicks
- Skips
- Hurdle right leg (where every 4th step you do a sort of hurdling motion)
- Hurdle left leg (where every 4th step you do a sort of hurdling motion)
- Don’t know what this is called. Basically keep your legs straight and run
- Short sharps fast steps. Thinks it’s called pitter-patter but not sure.
- Also practice the motion of my stride but in kind of slow motion while walking.

I really should learn the names to some of these.

No idea if these would benefit a distance runner or not. All I know is that, rightly or wrongly, I never see any of them doing them. The only people I see doing drills are sprinters and jumpers.

Am no expert in distance running but if you were wanting to implement something new into your programme I’d go with increasing core work, and implementing some weights into your routine as opposed to drills. The amount of people who get injured because they don’t feel the need to do this stuff is ridiculous.

I would probably describe the above as more dynamic stretching rather that Plyometrics,
When i said i used to do 20 min i would have built up to 20 min, and from 20m up to 80m. As i said you need to keep good form, if you can do 6 of these type by 6 sets over 80m it may take 20 mins.
Also agree on core work. But i would not neglect doing these especially if you are racing track as you are working each muscle in isolation,
If you start to run the first thing you do is lift your knee, so i would start with high knees and work through each movement after that.
I am not saying this is the best way to do them, just the way i used to do them.

dna_leri

Personally I think plyo's have a high risk of injury so should not be undertaken without a coach.

Drills (like PS described) are a different story and everyone should do them, though you may need a coach to show you how to do them correctly but I'm not sure that's what ecoli had in mind.

Probably the reason most distance runners do not do either is that they are self-coached.

I do not do plyos since I injured my knee a few years ago, contributed to by the plyos.
I do drills before every fast work-out - stuff I learned from my sprinting days and what I have picked up since.
I would start with skips (easier) and work up to high-knees (when warmed up) usually finishing with some combinations like straight legs into high knees into strides.

RayCun

dna_leri wrote: »

combinations like straight legs into high knees into strides.

straight from one to another without pause? That's interesting, what's the thinking behind it?

Ceepo

dna_leri wrote: »

Personally I think plyo's have a high risk of injury so should not be undertaken without a coach.

Drills (like PS described) are a different story and everyone should do them, though you may need a coach to show you how to do them correctly but I'm not sure that's what ecoli had in mind.

Probably the reason most distance runners do not do either is that they are self-coached.

I do not do plyos since I injured my knee a few years ago, contributed to by the plyos.
I do drills before every fast work-out - stuff I learned from my sprinting days and what I have picked up since.
I would start with skips (easier) and work up to high-knees (when warmed up) usually finishing with some combinations like straight legs into high knees into strides.

I do agree there is a risk factor with doing them and that is why i said i would start by doing a small no of reps over a short distance and the most important thing is to stop when you can NOT hold your form, also doing these can help with specific core muscles so there is the add benefit to doing them as your core is working harder to stabilize your upper body,
I can also see your point in not doing them due to your knee, however by doing these they can help built muscle and work on correcting muscle imbalance's, that said if comfortable doing them that fine,

dna_leri

RayCun wrote: »

straight from one to another without pause? That's interesting, what's the thinking behind it?

Not 100% sure on the theory, but I do know the straight-legs drill engages the glutes and the high-knees use the quads, then breaking into a stride brings them both together. I think it's also a good transition from drills to normal running.

ecoli

dna_leri wrote: »

Not 100% sure on the theory, but I do know the straight-legs drill engages the glutes and the high-knees use the quads, then breaking into a stride brings them both together. I think it's also a good transition from drills to normal running.

Not 100% on this and am only speculating (as I do not use this approach myself) but it sounds like you are working on the muscle firing sequence by doing this which can be crucial for running with dysfunction in Glutes and Hamstring