Bi-Polar and Memory Ditortions

LegacyUser

Hey all

I'm having a big problem with a friend of mine right now. We had an argument and he's bringing all these things up from the past that I was involved in but he's warped every scenario. He's gone from adjusting truths and exaggerating to downright lying and making things up and making out that I've said and done things that I would never dream of saying or doing.

During our argument I was so shocked at how much he had bent the truth. He went from lying and calling me a slut and a bitch and a c**t to analysing me to no emotion to begging for my forgiveness.

I know he has bipolar. he openly admits to that but what he doesn't openly admit to is the symptoms of bipolar. I've always known what bi-polar is and some of the symptoms but doing some more research into I can see that it does cause your recall memory to become distorted and warped.

I want to make things right with my friend. He called me some really awful things and at the time tried to lie to me but I understand that a lot of it is caused by his disorder. I'm just not entirely sure he's going to want to admit all this stuff I can see in him, especially his distorted memory. I myself suffer from Atypical depression so I understand how frustrating and hard it is to admit your faults. I don't use my depression as an excuse for bad behavior. It's only a few months ago that discovered some of the major symptoms of my type of depression. I've embraced them and am working on beating it. It's a struggle sometimes but I'm happier now than I've been in a while. I was ready to this though. I didn't have someone point it out to me. I'm worried if I bring up something like my friend's memory distortion he's going to take it badly and just snap and go straight into attack mode again. I don't know what he's telling other people either based on his own truth. I need him to stop this for the sake our friendship. Most people have walked away from him at this stage I'm one of the few friends he has left I want to try and salvage something.

Thanks for any advice x

Taltos

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All the best
Taltos

LegacyUser

I have a family member who sounds a lot like your friend but with no formal diagnosis. He calls everyone a liar. And I mean everyone. Cannot tolerate any kind of dissent from his own narrative and will freak out and hurl abuse at anyone who dares contradict his memory.

Huge fantasies of grandiosity too. So when you take him down and point out the facts, he goes really whacky and attacks attacks attacks.

What I came to fully understand is that he is not a liar, he is a fantasist and unlike mature people who know that memory is fickle and differs from person to person, that consensual reality is not always fixed, he cannot accept another's memory bank as having any validity. It makes one feel pretty awful at the end of it. And sometimes its like he has total blackouts, cant at all recall his aggressive outbursts. So then you cant resolve anything.

Whatever the cause, you have to take care of yourself. You are not under obligations to stick around for more personal annihilation.

Queen-Mise

First off I would be inclined to walk away until he gets more help. This is obviously your choice though

Secondly - I remember being told a piece of advice a few years ago by a professional when trying to deal with a friend with a lot of issues. They told me - at that moment in time the person believes what they are saying, this is their truth. From our perspective it is insane/wrong/etc - but from their perspective, it is an absolute truth.
At that time - this helped me a lot. I still had to pull away though, the girl needed an awful lot of help and support.

LegacyUser

My fiend has those fantasies of grandiosity too. Much of the time he just comes across as self righteous and arrogant. He keeps misreading situations and inventing his own realities. I'm really worried now because he's claiming I cheated on my ex boyfriend, which I didn't, with my current boyfriend. I don't know what he's telling mutual friends, my ex included.

I feel bad for just walking away from him. If he doesn't get more help soon the pattern is just going to continue and he'll end up alone. I don't want that for him. But he's so convinced I'm lying to him and that I'm trying to manipulate him that he's not listening to my genuine concerns for him. Even if he does go back to therapy I doubt he'd ever mention his memory to his therapist because he just won't accept it for the truth. I wish he'd just trust me enough to believe me. But I think he's not really left me with a choice but to walk away

awfulstuff wrote: »

I have a family member who sounds a lot like your friend but with no formal diagnosis. He calls everyone a liar. And I mean everyone. Cannot tolerate any kind of dissent from his own narrative and will freak out and hurl abuse at anyone who dares contradict his memory.

Huge fantasies of grandiosity too. So when you take him down and point out the facts, he goes really whacky and attacks attacks attacks.

What I came to fully understand is that he is not a liar, he is a fantasist and unlike mature people who know that memory is fickle and differs from person to person, that consensual reality is not always fixed, he cannot accept another's memory bank as having any validity. It makes one feel pretty awful at the end of it. And sometimes its like he has total blackouts, cant at all recall his aggressive outbursts. So then you cant resolve anything.

Whatever the cause, you have to take care of yourself. You are not under obligations to stick around for more personal annihilation.

thefeatheredcat

Op you're incredibly understanding and quite forgiving of your friend that he should consider himself very lucky and fortunate to have a friend like you.

henriettRhippo wrote: »

It's only a few months ago that discovered some of the major symptoms of my type of depression. I've embraced them and am working on beating it. It's a struggle sometimes but I'm happier now than I've been in a while. I was ready to this though. I didn't have someone point it out to me. I'm worried if I bring up something like my friend's memory distortion he's going to take it badly and just snap and go straight into attack mode again.

I don't know what he's telling other people either based on his own truth. I need him to stop this for the sake our friendship. Most people have walked away from him at this stage I'm one of the few friends he has left I want to try and salvage something.

The stuff that he's saying is incredibly hurtful and destructive to your life, and you don't know what he's saying or how far a distortion from the truth everything is being presented to others. While for you I'm happy you were able to realise some things about yourself, perhaps, while you intend in a well meaning kind way to point out the flaws and faults re his memory distortion, it may be something that he himself needs to acknowledge himself and take responsibility for. His behaviour is damaging not just to you but to him too, because it is costing him friendships but he probably won't really want to hear what you say, even if it is the truth. There is every chance he may interpret what you say as an attack on him rather than the kindness of a friend in trying to salvage the friendship.

henriettRhippo wrote: »

I feel bad for just walking away from him. If he doesn't get more help soon the pattern is just going to continue and he'll end up alone. I don't want that for him. But he's so convinced I'm lying to him and that I'm trying to manipulate him that he's not listening to my genuine concerns for him. Even if he does go back to therapy I doubt he'd ever mention his memory to his therapist because he just won't accept it for the truth. I wish he'd just trust me enough to believe me. But I think he's not really left me with a choice but to walk away

Don't feel bad if you feel that you have to take a step back or walk away. You really must put yourself as a priority and worry less about him. I know that's not easy, I've been there in a similarish situation, but your happiness and well being is more important to you and should come first. You'd be kicking yourself in the future having perhaps worried too much about him (while he seems unconcerned and not taking responsibility for himself and his actions and behaviours and how it affects others) and not worrying enough about yourself, and that's what I'd be afraid of for you.

It is distressing to know or witness others are going through a rough time, but it's not up to you to fix it for them, it's really up to them to acknowledge their own situation - just as you did - and do something about it. If his life is falling to pieces and losing friends left right and center, it's really not your problem to deal with, but for him to stop and ask himself why that is, and take on board what you have said and face some home truths rather than for him to remain in denial or avoid dealing with how things actually are.

There probably is a support group of some sort re bi-polar and how friends and family can help. You are incredibly understanding of your friend, but you need to know your own limits of that understanding before you find yourself excusing the behaviour of your friend across the board. Perhaps a support group would be better equipped to offer support to you if perhaps you want to confront the situation or persuade him to continue getting help. It may be counter productive to point of the flaws, but could be detrimental to you if he does see it as an attack and you might undo all the hard work you have achieved yourself on yourself, because I'd worry that his reaction if negative, could potentially make you unhappy or force you to deal with negative emotions that could be unhealthy for you and deal with, or that you end up going a few steps back on yourself (and if that does happen you have to see the positive aspect of that, a couple of steps back means you have the opportunity to take a few more steps forward and there's nothing wrong with doing just that) or impact you in a negative way.

Letting yourself take a step back and focus on yourself is probably what you need, like a good friend you are worrying but perhaps that too much that may hinder you and progress on your life, overall. You can leave the door open to your friend to get into contact by offering that to them and just completely taking time and energy back for yourself to focus on you, and keep yourself occupied with fulfilling your life.

Don't feel bad about walking away or that he'll end up alone. Maybe ending up alone might help him acknowledge his own issues or realise something and have him work out for himself how his life got to that point. Maybe he will stay in denial and take it that he is right and that everyone else is at fault and care little about what he has lost. There's no way to answer that, but for your own sake and health, you need to worry less about him.

LegacyUser

I want to thank you all for your advice and concern with my situation. I tried to offer my support to him but as I suspected he refused to listen. He instead tried to get me down and unravel the good work I've done for myself. He expected me to crash into despair from this whole situation.

I've decided to take the advice you all and my boyfriend has given me and step back from the situation. Maybe give it a few weeks and check in on him, just to make sure he's OK. I'm concerned that he might be suicidal at times but you are all right, I need to take care of myself as well. I just feel like I've failed him but I know I don't really have a choice. I can't force him to take my help.

I was considering finding a support group that we could go to together but as I said he won't accept that his disorder is worse than he thinks so I know he won't go for that. I've also considered letting his parents know how bad he actually is but again I think it will backfire on me as his ex girlfriend did something similar when they broke up because he went off the rails then too.

Thank you all again for being so supportive. I really appreciate it

Queen-Mise

henriettRhippo wrote: »

I've decided to take the advice you all and my boyfriend has given me and step back from the situation. Maybe give it a few weeks and check in on him, just to make sure he's OK. I'm concerned that he might be suicidal at times but you are all right, I need to take care of myself as well. I just feel like I've failed him but I know I don't really have a choice. I can't force him to take my help.

Don't let his illness or potential suicide risk guilt you into basically being abused.

You can lead a horse to water but you can't force it to drink. I had a friend in England who was a serious suicide risk and was told to do specific things like not drink and take his meds. Needless to say he drank and didn't take meds - this went on for about 7/8 years. Rather than help himself, he actively hindered his own life. He committed suicide and there was nothing any of his family or friends could do. They had been trying to help him for 15 years.

The same thing is the same for alcoholics, gamblers, drug addicts, overeaters etc. You can get them into treatment and detox them and teach them tools, skills etc. on how to life without 'whichever problem they have' BUT you can't force them. At the end of the day it is still the persons choice. I know people who were told if they drank again, they would die and they drank again and died.

You can only help someone who wants to be helped. You are better of banging your head on a concrete wall that trying to help someone who doesn't want help.

I will say that the greatest tragedy I have seen are the drinkers/addicts/suicides who have died without knowing that help is there. And incredible help at that. People will bend over backwards to help you if you really want it.