getting into sucklers

farmerman

hi i was just looking for some advice. i recently inherited 55 acres from my dad. the land is of very good quality and it is free draining. it is currently in tillage but i had hoped to get into spring calving sucklers as i have more of an interest in them. i had hoped to keep 30 Limousin cross cows selling the bull calves off the cows and keeping the heifers for the following summer fattening them off the grass under 18 months.i would also be keeping aprox 5 replacements. but i was wondering is this to much stock to be carrying on 60 acres. i dont mind spreading a certain amount of fertiliser but dont want to be constantly goin with the spreader. any advice would be greatly apreciated regarding weather it is to much stock or how i could tailor the system so i would not be over stocked. thanks for looking james

bogman_bass

Have you housing for stock? you wont get away with outwintering that many cattle on 55 acres without putting yourself under serrious pressure come spring

farmerman

wel i have a 4 span round roof shed with a concrete yard and i also hope to build a slatted shed before the end of the year.

yellow50HX

Might be a bit tight, espically if you have to keep more stock then you expecting like if the price is bad and you don't sell. I'd say start at about a dozen and as you get bigger you'll find out what numbers fit. Cut excess grass for silage or hay to sell. You might find that smaller numbers with silage or hay sold might work out better.

If you have the time it might be an idea to semi out winter them to save on storage and silage. We use fodder beet but I also know lads that use kale too.

hugo29

farmerman wrote: »

hi i was just looking for some advice. i recently inherited 55 acres from my dad. the land is of very good quality and it is free draining. it is currently in tillage but i had hoped to get into spring calving sucklers as i have more of an interest in them. i had hoped to keep 30 Limousin cross cows selling the bull calves off the cows and keeping the heifers for the following summer fattening them off the grass under 18 months.i would also be keeping aprox 5 replacements. but i was wondering is this to much stock to be carrying on 60 acres. i dont mind spreading a certain amount of fertiliser but dont want to be constantly goin with the spreader. any advice would be greatly apreciated regarding weather it is to much stock or how i could tailor the system so i would not be over stocked. thanks for looking james

Depending on land quality, I would say you are looking at 20 max and that is tight if we have another year like one gone by, if I was starting again I'd mix some simx cross cows and limx cross as herd

1chippy

You will run 30 no problem, holding the heifers if its managed right. housing would be your main issue, you will not get away with those no.s without giving the ground a good rest.
you will need a minimum of a five bay single slatted unit with lye back for the calves. Its handy to say you will calve them down in march and out to the field but i can guarantee you it doesnt work that simple and anything calving after march is a waste of money most of the time.
A bit of a mix like Hugo says through the limo i find throws a growthier calf. Simmental x limo is a particular favourite but im kinda leaning towards a bit of a blonde mix now.

iverjohnston

You would manage 30 cows, all being well. If you were unlucky enough to get locked up with TB however, and could not sell going into winter,things could get very ugly, very quickly. Iver in Cavan

pakalasa

iverjohnston wrote: »

You would manage 30 cows, all being well. If you were unlucky enough to get locked up with TB however, and could not sell going into winter,things could get very ugly, very quickly. Iver in Cavan

Get your annual herd test moved to early in the year. It's the best way to deal with this potential problem. Plenty of time then for clear repeat tests before selling in the autumn.

blue5000

Ya OP it's doable, but depends where you are in the country. If the farm is all in one it helps too. I wouldn't really worry about tb like others were saying, you could finish weanlings as bulls with bought in feed if it came to it. However I'd try keep into a bit of tillage, meal at first cost and straw would be useful. You could feed straw to dry cows to keep costs down.

Juniorhurler

Blue, on 60 ac I would think splitting your system to tillage and livestock is too small scale. Depending on where the OP is straw could be got for €8 a 4x4 bale. I would stick tilling for a year or 3 and build the sucklers slowly and see how it goes.

OP, the one thing you haven't told us is your own farming expertise and experience. For a start I would go angus if inexperienced. They are docile, easy on ground, easy fed, easy calved and idem for your suggested system of finishing heifers. If you are experienced you don't need our advice too badly and do your own thing regardless as you know your own circumstances best. Good luck with it all.

delaval

You have 22 ha of good land ther is no reason why you could not stock at 3lu/ha and cut some silage also with a good paddock system. My guess is about 30 cows 30 calves 10 replacement heifers or 40 cows and their calves selling all weanlings.
This would entail alot of fert which you are not fond of but it probably the best valve you will get for any input except for perhaps AI.
Don't shoot me I m only dairy farmer and don't know any thing about beef save the taste of it. But like any business you won't make profit without output.

mf240

delaval wrote: »

You have 22 ha of good land ther is no reason why you could not stock at 3lu/ha and cut some silage also with a good paddock system. My guess is about 30 cows 30 calves 10 replacement heifers or 40 cows and their calves selling all weanlings.
This would entail alot of fert which you are not fond of but it probably the best valve you will get for any input except for perhaps AI.
Don't shoot me I m only dairy farmer and don't know any thing about beef save the taste of it. But like any business you won't make profit without output.

Margins in beef are a lot less than in dairy so be wary that extra output is not negated by extra cost.

delaval

I know I'm only a dairy farmer but just thought that the more kg beef sold per ha (at reasonable cost) the better. Afterall the amount of land is his limiting factor. If margins are so low why do people stay at it or are they using their SFP to subsidie their hobby.

Cattle men around here paying big money for grass land, just wondering are margins that bad?

I do accept your point

farmerjack

Cattle men around here paying big money for grass land, just wondering are margins that bad?



This in my opinion is up there with the third secret of Fatima, it is a complete mystery to me how some of these men can be giving this big money for grazing,

yellow50HX

Juniorhurler wrote: »

Blue, on 60 ac I would think splitting your system to tillage and livestock is too small scale. Depending on where the OP is straw could be got for €8 a 4x4 bale. I would stick tilling for a year or 3 and build the sucklers slowly and see how it goes.

OP, the one thing you haven't told us is your own farming expertise and experience. For a start I would go angus if inexperienced. They are docile, easy on ground, easy fed, easy calved and idem for your suggested system of finishing heifers. If you are experienced you don't need our advice too badly and do your own thing regardless as you know your own circumstances best. Good luck with it all.

good point re the angus's. easy calving is a god send espically if your only starting out. like the lads say try to match your cows and bull to your system. SIM and CHAR cows tend to be big animals so need more space (watch this is your going to put in cubicles, no point spending big money and the cows dont use them cos they are too small). the bull would also need to be able to service the cows. Breeding in AA to your cows is worth in IMO. angus cows might not be the biggest animals in the world but we have a good few AAX in our herd they do throw great cavles when the bull is right. Also we find them to be great mothers and with a bit of FR in them have loads of milk.

most important thing with having sucklers is having good handling facilites, we put in a new shed a few year back and that was one thing we tried to get right. You should have plenty of pens (there can never be enough gates) get a caving pen with either a caving gate or crush gate. be able to seprate the milking and dry cows, and be able to have a pen to have a calf and cow on their own for a day or so after calving. We also put in a lockabale feed barrier, well worth it as we have used it for loads of things, (holding the cows for dosing & injections, C-sections, hand milking and drawing of mastistis, hoof checking and taking out stones, double suckling, weaning cows from calves etc).

If your serious about the cows then i wold suggest getting your car and driving around to a few local lads to see their set up, everyone is a bit different but you'll see a few ideas that you can use in your own set up. You may find that the 4 bay shed as it is may not be ideal but you can easily build a leanto on one side and put in a feed passage and lieback/cubicle shed to suit, and have the shed for storage or penning. buy your self an A4 pad and start sketching out possible layouts and see how they would work

farmerman

hugo29 wrote: »

Depending on land quality, I would say you are looking at 20 max and that is tight if we have another year like one gone by, if I was starting again I'd mix some simx cross cows and limx cross as herd

the land would be of very good quality and would remain relativly dry even on a wet year. ya i was thinking of having some simx as they tend to have good amounts of milk.

farmerman

Juniorhurler wrote: »

Blue, on 60 ac I would think splitting your system to tillage and livestock is too small scale. Depending on where the OP is straw could be got for €8 a 4x4 bale. I would stick tilling for a year or 3 and build the sucklers slowly and see how it goes.

OP, the one thing you haven't told us is your own farming expertise and experience. For a start I would go angus if inexperienced. They are docile, easy on ground, easy fed, easy calved and idem for your suggested system of finishing heifers. If you are experienced you don't need our advice too badly and do your own thing regardless as you know your own circumstances best. Good luck with it all.

regarding my experience i have always have had good interest in stock but never kept many as all my da had interest in was tilage. i kept some weanlings when i was younger but never cows although i have worked on many suckler and dairy farms so i no all the hardship that comes with farming.

Muckit

Why not try drystock first?? No hassle trying to get them in calf and if you can keep them alive they will at least leave you a few pound.

Learn to crawl before you try walk.

moy83

One thing I would say about sucklers is to try and build up numbers without spending big money because they wont leave an awful lot after them . The cow can be high maintenance just to get a calf once a year ( hopefully ) .
If you have an interest in producing a nice calf and enjoy working with them for a small return then its grand , but if its money from cattle you want dont expect too much for the first few years