Cyclng vs. Baseball

LeftBlank

We all know that cycling has (and possibly continues to be) been tainted by doping in the past. Another sport that has been struggling with doping has been baseball.

Curious about this, I checked out the testing policy for baseball, and found the following.

- There is no in season testing. Testing is only performed during off season/spring training. (This changes this season but only for testing for HGH)
- Testing is only performed with reasonable cause and has to pass a committee first before a test can take place (e.g. no random testing)
- If a player is found positivie, the results are kept confidential

Compare this to the regimen that is now in cycling and it seems to be that cycling has got a bit of an unfair rap.

Seaneh

Angel Heredia (BALCO Chemist/PED designer) claims to have worked with some of the top Basketball, baseball and football players in the US and some professional footballers in Europe. He claims in all of those sports, doping is rife.

I'm inclined to believe him.

shaka

I agree with you Seaneh , and considering Spain's attitude to doping I think we can look forward to some interesting stories emerge in the future relating to football teams there. Probably come too late for cycling which will remain tainted.
It amazes me that more rugby guys aren't getting caught either!

Hazys

TBF i think in Cycling and Athletics the use of drugs would have a lot greater impact on a participants performance than in baseball or other "non-performance" sports.

Steroids in baseball allows you to hit the ball further but has nothing to with hand eye coordination. If you could never hit the ball in the first place, you are suddenly not going to be able to hit it. Fair enough it allows decent batters now get more home runs but you wouldn't have many Michelle Smith scenarios where people go from Zeros to Heros.

Beasty

TBH I don't care about the doping that takes place in the major American professional sports. I just want Cycling to clean it's act up. If that means people think Cycling gets an "unfair rap" they are welcome to that opinion - I prefer the pressure is kept up until the sport sorts itself out (as for example athletics has largely done since the Ben Johnson affair)

kumate_champ07

there are sports like football,tennis,baseball etc that are highly skilled but involve alot of training, 'practice makes perfect'- with PED's you can train harder and longer and recover quicker, it does offer a big advantage. also sprinting speed and power can be of benefit in these sports. its true that you need the talent but drugs can give you an extra 'edge'

ROK ON

I'd like to offer another viewpoint - I do not view professional sports of any code to be sports in the sporting meaning of the word.

Increasingly pro sports are nothing more than athletic entertainment.

To my mind sport is very different - it is to me, amateur, local/parochial and to a certain extent visceral. It has very little to do with entertainment but more to do with a representation of local pride.

Pro sports is big money entertainment with relatively a lot at stake financially.

The later is an increasingly ripe ground for doping and to my mind will always be so.

In local sports there is cheating but I believe at a completely different level.

I heard a wonderful piece on Off The Ball last nights. The lads were discussing the decision by 19 year old Dublin GAA star to give up his trial at Aussie rules football.

He does not think that pro sports can ever recompense him enough for Joe much it means to him to tog out in his local club jersey. The presenters effectively questioned his sanity, whereas I was delighted for the kid.
Fair dues. It brought home to me what sport is.

I actually detest the concept of pro sports. The battle against doping in big money sports will never be won due to the vested interest of stakeholders.

Imagine if that award winning soccer player or that very fast Olympic athlete ever tested positive. While it has happened in the past it is very quickly forgotten about - like baseball.

dave2pvd

Hazys wrote: »

TBF i think in Cycling and Athletics the use of drugs would have a lot greater impact on a participants performance than in baseball or other "non-performance" sports.

Steroids in baseball allows you to hit the ball further but has nothing to with hand eye coordination.

You're contradicting yourself.

Hitting the ball further in baseball is a massive increase in performance. Just ask McGwire and Bonds.

Regarding hand-eye coordination: MLB players ALL have incredible hand-eye coordination.

Baseball, and many US pro sports has a serious PEDs problem.

Hazys

dave2pvd wrote: »

You're contradicting yourself.

Hitting the ball further in baseball is a massive increase in performance. Just ask McGwire and Bonds.

Regarding hand-eye coordination: MLB players ALL have incredible hand-eye coordination.

Baseball, and many US pro sports has a serious PEDs problem.

Contradicting?

All i was saying as there is more to baseball than power.

"MLB players ALL have incredible hand-eye coordination." Yes they all have the exact same hand-eye coordination ability, the only difference between a good batter and a bad batter is power. :rolleyes:

Taking steroids wont help you catch better, hit the ball more frequently, most likely won't make you pitch better either, while in cycling it will increase your endurance which is 80% of the sport.

Brian?

Hazys wrote: »

TBF i think in Cycling and Athletics the use of drugs would have a lot greater impact on a participants performance than in baseball or other "non-performance" sports.

Steroids in baseball allows you to hit the ball further but has nothing to with hand eye coordination. If you could never hit the ball in the first place, you are suddenly not going to be able to hit it. Fair enough it allows decent batters now get more home runs but you wouldn't have many Michelle Smith scenarios where people go from Zeros to Heros.

There's more to PEDs than steroids. I can name a few prescription drugs that will help hand eye coordination. That's on top of HGH actually improving eye sight as well as adding muscle.

There is simply no way of quantifying whether you can make a "hero from a zero" in baseball with PEDs. In fact for all we know it's been done, they just weren't caught.

dave2pvd

Hazys wrote: »

Contradicting?

All i was saying as there is more to baseball than power.

"MLB players ALL have incredible hand-eye coordination." Yes they all have the exact same hand-eye coordination ability, the only difference between a good batter and a bad batter is power. :rolleyes:

Taking steroids wont help you catch better, hit the ball more frequently, most likely won't make you pitch better either, while in cycling it will increase your endurance which is 80% of the sport.

I agree that there's more to baseball than power. But come on, you can't minimize the reward resulting from more power. Sure, it won't improve an outfielder's chance of catching a fly ball. That's obvious.

You used the word 'impact'. Think about this: what is the monetary reward for being able to hit 20yds further than last year's average? It's huge! That's quite an impact. Much more than the PED impact for cycling for a typical rider. Monetarily.

And what about pitchers? More power can mean faster fastballs. Roger Clemens found this out, no? What about recovery for pitchers? Synthetic HGH is an awesome way to help that arm recover. Especially as you get older and and produce decreasing quantities of natural HGH.

Lastly, there's the career extending effects of PEDs. You get older and slower, so you can't steal bases or run down pop flys like you used to, but hell, you can start hitting the ball harder. Sammy Sosa comes to mind.

Bottom line, I do not believe you can say:

(in) Cycling and Athletics the use of drugs would have a lot greater impact on a participants performance than in baseball