How to handle a road incident and how to deal with Gardai?

pc11 · 10-01-2013 3:01pm #1

Note: I am not asking for legal advice, but for what you would to to handle this situation. I want to defuse this before it becomes a legal situation. It's really about how best to deal with the Gardai.

About 6 weeks ago, I was involved in what might be described as a little dispute with a pedestrian while I was driving. From my point of view he walked out in front of me, whereas he will say he was crossing the road before I got there. There was no collision, not even screeching of brakes as I was going slowly, no-one was hurt, no damage was caused. Realistically, it was a 50/50 mistake, we're both a bit wrong, no harm done and all that.

EDIT: I'll elaborate on what happened. The pedestrian walked out on the road without even looking. Yes, pedestrians have a technical right of way, but this guy did not even look. I beeped and came to a stop a good 9-10 feet short of where he was crossing. The pedestrian looked startled, presumably as he had not looked for cars. As I was stopped, he came towards me and started hammering the car. I was stunned and quite worried a window would break. So I just drove away. I was not "leaving the scene of an accident". There was no accident, and I was scared. He looked crazy and I wanted out of there. Afterwards I forgot about it.

Now today (6 weeks later) I saw the pedestrian again and he was photographing my car and licence plate. I stopped and asked what was going on. He made all kinds of wild claims about getting the guards, how he had called them at the time but didn't have my licence plate, how I tried to hit him, then how I actually HAD hit him (which is not true at all, and clearly made up on the spot while heated). And he finished today by making physical threats to me right on the street, so I left.

Now assuming he's gone to the guards today with his exaggerated complaint and my licence plate, what approach should I take?

It's "he said, she said", no-one was hurt, it was weeks ago with no witnesses, so I should just forget it.
Don't wait to hear anything, go straight to the guards myself and give my side. I can't identify him, but if he reports it too then he's identifying himself. I can calmly give my side and tell the guards it was all nothing in reality.
Or I can go to the guards myself and tell them this guy was nuts and tried to damage my car and make a complaint against him. Obviously it would be better to have made this complaint at the time, not now.
Since he couldn't identify me then, I could just say it wasn't me, how can he prove it was me??! I'm afraid this is risky as I'm basically lying.

Would the guards even take his complaint seriously given that there was no harm done, no witnesses, it was 6 weeks ago and it's only now he's got my licence plate?

I would be willing to apologise if it ended the situation, but I would worry it would make me look guilty.

MagicSean · 10-01-2013 3:08pm

Option 2 and 3 are the same thing. You give a statement about what happened. In your case it would likely be a cautioned statement and anything said in it can be used as evidence against you. You have potentially committed a crime in hitting the pedestrian, failing to report the accident and leaving the scene of an accident so consultation with a solicitor before taking such a step may be a good idea. There is also an obligation to report an accident involving any injury to the Gardaí. You are not required to make a statement when doing this.

pc11 · 10-01-2013 3:12pm

Maybe I wasn't clear enough. I didn't hit him, there was no accident or injury. I didn't leave any scene, I was trying to get away from someone attacking me and my car.

And I meant options 2 and 3 to be different. In #2 I'm saying nothing really happened, let's forget it. In #3 I'm saying something did happen and I'm making a complaint against him. As far as I'm concerned he WAS the one doing something wrong, as he approached my car and battered it and attempted to break the windows, all while I was stopped. I'm only considering #2 just to have done with it, I don't want trouble.

coylemj · 10-01-2013 5:00pm

You didn't hit him and he obviously he didn't report anything to the Gardai after the initial incident. If he had done so, they would now be chasing you for an alleged 'hit and run'.

Realistically I can't see the Gardai getting involved, he sounds like a nutter and unless he goes to them and makes a complaint (which I seriously doubt he will) there really isn't much to investigate as far as they're concerned.

You could report him for assault but the likelihood is that he will retort with wild allegations of dangerous driving against you - is it really worth dragging this out? I'd put it down to experience and do nothing, there are people out there who blow a gasket at the slightest provocation, he's clearly one of them.

One option if you want to get him off your back is to take a private prosecution against him for assault. By the time he gets the summons it will be too late for him to counter accuse you of dangerous driving because it will be seen as a malicious prosecution in response to your accusation of assault. Your choice.

pc11 · 10-01-2013 5:13pm

coylemj wrote: »

You didn't hit him and he obviously he didn't report anything to the Gardai after the initial incident. If he had done so, they would now be chasing you for an alleged 'hit and run'.

Realistically I can't see the Gardai getting involved, he sounds like a nutter and unless he goes to them and makes a complaint (which I seriously doubt he will) there really isn't much to investigate as far as they're concerned.

You could report him for assault but the likelihood is that he will retort with wild allegations of dangerous driving against you - is it really worth dragging this out? I'd put it down to experience and do nothing, there are people out there who blow a gasket at the slightest provocation, he's clearly one of them.

One option if you want to get him off your back is to take a private prosecution against him for assault. By the time he gets the summons it will be too late for him to counter accuse you of dangerous driving because it will be seen as a malicious prosecution in response to your accusation of assault. Your choice.

What if he reported it at the time but didn't have my licence plate until today? That's what he said.

Also, what if he takes a prosecution against me first? If there are no witnesses and no harm done, can it even go anywhere? Will the guards even take it seriously?

coylemj · 10-01-2013 5:25pm

I strongly suspect that if he does report anything, they will come to you and ask you for your side of the story.

Without an injury and with no independent witnesses it's very unlikely that the Gardai would prosecute you without giving you a chance to outline your version of the events and when you do, they will probably tell the other guy that they are not going to pursue it.

MagicSean · 10-01-2013 5:29pm

I don't think you understand how things work. You don't take a prosecution against someone or make a complaint about someone. You just give a statement and the Garda or DPP makes the decision on wether to prosecute.

coylemj · 10-01-2013 5:36pm

MagicSean wrote: »

I don't think you understand how things work. You don't take a prosecution against someone or make a complaint about someone. You just give a statement and the Garda or DPP makes the decision on wether to prosecute.

For a summary offence you can initiate a private prosecution in the District Court with no reference to the Gardai.

Procrastastudy · 10-01-2013 6:00pm

coylemj wrote: »

For a summary offence you can initiate a private prosecution in the District Court with no reference to the Gardai.

Sorry to go OT - but could you direct me to anything on this please? I've always been curious. Is this the common informant thing?

ThreeLineWhip · 10-01-2013 6:06pm

Yes, anyone can initiate a prosecution as a common informer.

MagicSean · 10-01-2013 6:10pm

coylemj wrote: »

For a summary offence you can initiate a private prosecution in the District Court with no reference to the Gardai.

ThreeLineWhip wrote: »

Yes, anyone can initiate a prosecution as a common informer.

Do you really think that is relevent to what the op was talking about?

NoQuarter · 10-01-2013 6:13pm

Procrastastudy wrote: »

Sorry to go OT - but could you direct me to anything on this please? I've always been curious. Is this the common informant thing?

Petty Sessions (Ireland) Act, 1851. Annotated version on Westlaw.

P_1 · 10-01-2013 6:18pm

Right so he was filming you the next time he saw you after the first 'incident'?

Seems to me that the most practical thing you could do to prevent any further 'incidents' would be to invest in a dashcam for your car.

Although I'm not too sure if the Gardaí can use dashcam footage when trying to sort through 'one person's word vs the other person's word' type cases.

coylemj · 10-01-2013 6:27pm

MagicSean wrote: »

Do you really think that is relevent to what the op was talking about?

It's relevant if the Gardai investigate and tell the pedestrian that they are not going to prosecute the OP. If he (the pedestrian) feels that this is unacceptable, the Gardai can tell him that he is free to initiate a private prosecution.

Even if the Gardai did prosecute the OP, the only evidence they can present is that of the pedestrian so there wouldn't be much difference in the format of the prosecution whether it was initiated by AGS or the pedestrian himself.

Though as I'm sure you well know, most people prefer to get the weight of the state behind them if they're trying to haul someone into court.

pc11 · 10-01-2013 8:09pm

So, what would best for me to do right now? Do nothing and wait to see what happens, or take the initiative and go to the Gardai and get my side on record?

coylemj · 10-01-2013 8:57pm

pc11 wrote: »

So, what would best for me to do right now? Do nothing and wait to see what happens, or take the initiative and go to the Gardai and get my side on record?

If he hasn't gone in to complain about you then as far as the Gardai are concerned there's nothing to investigate. I expect that if you go into the local Garda station (covering the area where the 'incident' occurred) and say what happened, they will tell you that there is no record of the event and unless he comes to complain, they won't bother taking a statement from you.

Pat Mustard · 11-01-2013 2:52am

Was the law on prosecution as common informer amended sometime during the previous ten years, to restrict the general public from private prosecutions? I can't think of the relevant legislation. Anyone know?

OP, even though the angry pedestrian has photographed your car and taken your reg details, some six weeks after the initial incident, he will still have to go so far as to make a formal complaint to Gardai before they will investigate. You have not given reason to believe that this has been done.

In any case, I think that it would be a good idea to make a detailed written note of the incident, to include details such as the location, the time, the weather conditions and the description of the pedestrian. You should do the same in relation to the incident where said pedestrian photographed your car.

Were there any witnesses to the incident six weeks ago? Is it possible to track any down? Are there houses nearby? Is there CCTV anywhere nearby, whether attached to a shop, pub or petrol station?

If you decide to make a statement, you should consult a solicitor beforehand.

monkeypants · 11-01-2013 12:33pm

pithater1 wrote: »

Although I'm not too sure if the Gardaí can use dashcam footage when trying to sort through 'one person's word vs the other person's word' type cases.

I'm curious; why couldn't they? It's filmed in a public place.

ThreeLineWhip · 11-01-2013 2:55pm

Was the law on prosecution as common informer amended sometime during the previous ten years, to restrict the general public from private prosecutions? I can't think of the relevant legislation. Anyone know?

I don't think it was ever changed. Private prosecutions are very rare in Ireland. I have not heard of any in my lifetime.

ResearchWill · 11-01-2013 3:00pm

ThreeLineWhip wrote: »

I don't think it was ever changed. Private prosecutions are very rare in Ireland. I have not heard of any in my lifetime.

It was changed, a private prosecution can now only be for minor offences in the DC, Any indictable offence must be taken over by the DPP.

P_1 · 11-01-2013 6:38pm

monkeypants wrote: »

I'm curious; why couldn't they? It's filmed in a public place.

I don't know if they can or not tbh, I was curiously implying the question more than anything.

ThreeLineWhip · 11-01-2013 7:15pm

ResearchWill wrote: »

It was changed, a private prosecution can now only be for minor offences in the DC, Any indictable offence must be taken over by the DPP.

Who would promptly discontinue them no doubt.

hillviewfarm · 17-01-2013 9:33pm

Take the initiative and go and report what happened. Just get the garda to record what you are reporting in the occurrence book. If they try to fob you off tell them that you want it recorded that you called in and what you reported. Furthermore ask for a number, from the occurrence book, for the incident. Once you have this number you can always refer back to it should anything come out of this. Hope this helps!

MagicSean · 17-01-2013 9:38pm

hillviewfarm wrote: »

Take the initiative and go and report what happened. Just get the garda to record what you are reporting in the occurrence book. If they try to fob you off tell them that you want it recorded that you called in and what you reported. Furthermore ask for a number, from the occurrence book, for the incident. Once you have this number you can always refer back to it should anything come out of this. Hope this helps!

Most stations no longer have an occurence book.

How to handle a road incident and how to deal with Gardai?

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