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Is making a public death threat an offence?

Comments

  • #2
    seamus
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 68,317 ✭✭✭✭seamus


    I'm not sure if the threat has to be made against an individual, but I'm sure a general threat against a group of people would fall foul of several laws including anti-terrorism ones.

    The reason the Gardai don't swoop in immediately to shut these things down and carry out arrests is that it places members in unneccessary danger. Far better to observe and record and then carry out the arrests later on when the perpetrators aren't surrounded by their friends.


  • #3
    um7y1h83ge06nx
    Closed Accounts Posts: 5,029 ✭✭✭um7y1h83ge06nx


    Yeah, it's so disappointing that something like this is tolerated in our country.

    Disappointing and sad.

    The unfortunate thing is that if stuff like this goes unchecked we'll eventually reach a state where extremism will be needed to fight this extremism, and no decent person would want things to go that far. :(


  • #4
    AlekSmart
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 14,005 ✭✭✭✭AlekSmart


    Raven Abundant Thundercloud wrote: »
    I'm genuinely curious is the above considered to me an offence. The reason being is that the below happened yesterday in Limerick:

    http://www.independent.ie/national-news/dissidents-issue-chilling-threat-to-irish-in-the-british-army-3343751.html

    Good question Raven Abundant Thundercloud...

    I was under the (mistaken ?)impression that the Irish State had substantially strengthened its legislation regarding "Incitment to Hatred" but perhaps there are exceptions based upon past track-record or something ?

    I would suggest that had this gentleman directed his oration at members of the Black,Islamic,Jewish,Oriental or any other ethnic community in Ireland,he would have been whisked off his feet personally by Minister Shatter ?

    Still,it's a sad article to be reading in a 21st Century Independent European Democracy.

    Makes one wonder why French,Italian,Belgian or Dutch folks are not marching about their countries demanding German blood ?


    Men, it has been well said, think in herds; it will be seen that they go mad in herds, while they only recover their senses slowly, and one by one.

    Charles Mackay (1812-1889)



  • #5
    IRLConor
    Subscribers Posts: 4,076 ✭✭✭IRLConor


    They are presumably breaking the law anyway, as members of an unlawful organisation. Rather than trying to prove some sort of incitement crime, surely it would be better to go down the tried and tested path of arresting them under the Offences Against the State Act?


  • #6
    um7y1h83ge06nx
    Closed Accounts Posts: 5,029 ✭✭✭um7y1h83ge06nx


    Very true. It will be interesting to see if arrests are made.

    I understand to a certain extent why the Gardaí don't swoop in and arrest these people as it might turn into a street battle (I'll leave political views out of this) but allowing these things to happen is a huge propaganda coup for dissidents - it looks like they are in control and the Gardai are afraid of them.

    This in turns causes the general population to feel a certain about of fear towards these individuals and a certain amount of anger towards the government and the Gardaí.

    I think sometimes that this can get a little lost on people. A lot of countries would show less tolerance to this behaviour e.g. Columbia with FARC and other groups, Sri-Lanka and the Tamil Tigers. Even in Europe the German police take a hardline against neo-Nazis and I have never (but I'm open to correction) heard of ETA marching like this in France or Spain.


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  • #7
    King Ludvig
    Closed Accounts Posts: 640 ✭✭✭King Ludvig


    A threat to kill is only an offence where it is a threat made to a specific person: http://www.irishstatutebook.ie/1997/en/act/pub/0026/sec0005.html#sec5

    I'd imagine there'd be other offences to cover it though.


  • #8
    irishrgr
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 120 ✭✭irishrgr


    Sticky wicket there indeed...balancing free speech vs. incitment to hatred..we get that over here with the Klan, some of the "freemen" and various others on the fringe. Without knowing more, I'd say the Gardai probably did the right thing by just observing. In the absence of a specific threat against an individual, it gets tricky.

    Curious, in Ireland has anyone tried to sue any of the paramilitaries (or their affiliates) in civil court. Over the years we've had several successful law suits brought against the likes of the Klan and so on. They may not break the law but you can sure hurt their chequebooks.

    Regards,

    A


  • #9
    um7y1h83ge06nx
    Closed Accounts Posts: 5,029 ✭✭✭um7y1h83ge06nx


    No reports of any arrests yet, wouldn't be surprised if there wasn't any.

    Seeing user comments under the Irish Independent article there is quite a lot a people aggrieved by the incident, although it could be said that the march was a success and a propaganda victory for those that took part in it, gaining them publicity, a show of strength and a demonstration that they will not be challenged.

    You would have to wonder though what is there such a feeble attempt to oppose the paramilitaries by the government and the AGS? Is it fear, support or something else?

    The danger with inaction on the part of the government is that it could breed discontent among sections of society and encourage the rise of right-wing organisations in opposition, similar to the Ireland of the 1930's.

    Whatever happens, inaction seems a dangerous route for the government to take, for them to think anything different is just naive.


  • #10
    source
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 5,303 ✭✭✭source


    Raven Abundant Thundercloud wrote: »
    No reports of any arrests yet, wouldn't be surprised if there wasn't any.

    Seeing user comments under the Irish Independent article there is quite a lot a people aggrieved by the incident, although it could be said that the march was a success and a propaganda victory for those that took part in it, gaining them publicity, a show of strength and a demonstration that they will not be challenged.

    You would have to wonder though what is there such a feeble attempt to oppose the paramilitaries by the government and the AGS? Is it fear, support or something else?

    The danger with inaction on the part of the government is that it could breed discontent among sections of society and encourage the rise of right-wing organisations in opposition, similar to the Ireland of the 1930's.

    Whatever happens, inaction seems a dangerous route for the government to take, for them to think anything different is just naive.

    Load of codswallop, if Gardai had intervened in this situation there would have been mass public order issues arising from it.

    Remember Ryan's funeral in Dublin? There were people spouting similar tripe after that. Then once Gardai had put their case together, they arrested people for the incident. The same will happen here, policing isn't like on the TV, it isn't all tidied up in a neat package by the end of a tour, investigations like this take time.

    There will be an arrest from this, once a solid case has been put together.


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