R. J. George on the danger of secret societies to the state

SoulandForm

Was there ever a serious effort made by the Republic of Ireland to ban secret societies?


http://reformedcovenanter.wordpress.com/2012/12/31/r-j-george-on-the-danger-of-secret-societies-to-the-state/


"Although Covenanters have traditionally dissented from recognising immoral civil governments as the ordinance of God for our good, nevertheless, they have always sought the prosperity of their nations. For this reason the American Covenanter, R. J. George, reasoned that secret societies should be avoided by Christians partly because they are a danger to the good of the state. His comments are very relevant to organisations such as the Freemasons and the Orange Order:

(5) The secrecy of the lodge is prejudicial to the State.

It is frequently said in defense of secretism that the State itself has secrets: that there could be no diplomacy without secrecy: that it would be impossible to conduct a successful war without secrecy. So far as the privacy is that of true statesmanship, dealing with genuine State secrets, it is inherent in the State as a divine institution, and, just as in the case of the family, the secrecy of the lodge is its deadly enemy, because it invades that privacy and, for sinister ends, betrays it. The argument from the secret councils of war is an unfortunate one for the advocates of the lodge, because it calls attention to the fact that they are at war with human society and are using against their unoffending fellow citizens the stratagem which war justifies only against an enemy. But the secrecy of the lodge is perilous to the State. Scarcely a government of the old world but has been shaken by them. At the present time they endanger the stability of our own government. They manipulate our elections; they tamper with our courts of justice; they invade the jury box and turn aside righteous judgment; they engender strikes and riots and endanger life; and are a constant menace to the peace and good order of society. In time of war their ramifications may bind them by oath to citizens of our enemy country.

R. J. George, Lectures in pastoral theology (3 vols, New York, 1917), iii, 276-7."

Torakx

Interesting theory.
I believe the secret societies of that day were in direct opposition to the church, who had much more control over government and countries before the secret societies took that from them.
Now its the reverse in many ways and i would think we are heading down a similar road again.
This time with secret groups heading things, instead of secretive religious groups.

To me they are both bad influences, although we may have needed one to get away from the other, now we need ourselves to get away from both.

The real danger to the state of Ireland are the idiots who vote and perpetuate a system of democratic slavery.While also voting away our legislation making abilities, to a centralised power in europe.

Anyone reading this and has voted in the past...please stop! for the love of mankind!
If all the choices are bad, dont choose,until they decide to represent us again or enough wake up and we represent ourselves.

I think the priest of woever wrote that about secret societies was completely correct.
And i think the secret societies were completely correct about taking out religion.

I just dont agree like both do, that they are the rightfull, capable leaders they think they are, or want to be.

SoulandForm

I dont know enough yet about the south to make any judgements about the influence of secret societies here but I can tell you that in the north where I come from they are a hugely dangerous influence. I was going to post this in the Christianity section to show that traditional Presbyterians were against secret societies but it seems discussions about such isnt allowed there. I do think though with the Republic's intergration into the EU that probably leading figures have been brought into various secret societies.