[Directions] Leixlip to Kildare Town

Tube

Trying to do this by public transport. My preference would be for the "Green Bus" from the Red Cow but there doesn't seem to be a way to get to the Red Cow without going to the city centre.

Alternative is train from Adamstown, but despite being only 3.5 miles away, there doesn't seem to be a way to get closer than 2 miles away (Lucan village).

Hazelhatch is further away and even harder to get to.

Again looks like train is only workable via the city centre.

Am I missing anything?

L1011

66 bus to Lucan, cross road, 67A back to Celbridge, shuttle bus to Hazelhatch (for certain trains), train from there.

Its a bloody nightmare - North Kildare and South Kildare are barely linked at all.

During college terms there are some buses from Carlow/South Kildare *to* Maynooth but not backwards until the evening.

Tube

Thanks. It appears even North Kildare isn't connected well to North Kildare! 66/67/Shuttle bus sounds like a recipe for disaster!

Victor

Any Route 66/a/b to Heuston + train to Kildare is the simplest.

Input you exact locations and times / dates here: www.a-b.ie

Does a cycle or taxi to Hazelhatch or Adamstown stations make sense? Note that the Kildare line services outbound in the morning are limited.

The Idyl Race

Least messy method would be to get a taxi to Hazelhatch and train to Kildare from there, but it would cost min €7 to get to the Hatch and then train fare on top of that.

It is a pain however that Dublin Bus can't or won't extend any 66 variant to Celbridge

Tube

Thanks all. I will prob just get a 66/A/B to Heuston.

Just FYI, Adamstown station is closer to Main St. in Leixlip than Hazelhatch station is, by about half a mile.

Tube

Victor wrote: »

Input you exact locations and times / dates here: www.a-b.ie

That's currently suggesting a 66* into the city centre and the 25B back out again. Those two routes almost overlap at Woodies on the N4, so I don't know why it doesn't suggest changing there?

Victor

Tube wrote: »

That's currently suggesting a 66* into the city centre and the 25B back out again. Those two routes almost overlap at Woodies on the N4, so I don't know why it doesn't suggest changing there?

At "my journey preferences" select "take neighbouring stops into account for origin and destination maximum X min walk"

Tube

Victor wrote: »

At "my journey preferences" select "take neighbouring stops into account for origin and destination maximum X min walk"

Actually makes no difference when set to 20 mins.

Earlier in the week that site was suggesting the 115 from Leixlip to Kinnegad, then catch a bus from Galway (can't remember which one) to Dublin city centre and then get they 25B to Adamstown Station, so I suppose this is an improvement!

Victor

Tube wrote: »

Actually makes no difference when set to 20 mins.

That seems strange, although for me, it is suggesting changing buses at Palmerston or Liffey Valley.

Earlier in the week that site was suggesting the 115 from Leixlip to Kinnegad, then catch a bus from Galway (can't remember which one) to Dublin city centre and then get they 25B to Adamstown Station, so I suppose this is an improvement!

You may have selected an odd time of day.

L1011

Victor wrote: »

You may have selected an odd time of day.

Based on my experiences of the site, not guaranteed to have been. Its atrocious with anything more than a literal A to B journey.

For instance, its obsessed with sending people from the city centre to Citywest by getting *off* the Luas at Bluebell, walking a bit, and catching the Mortons bus from there; can't find a setting to stop it doing that. This isn't quicker *or* cheaper.

Victor

MYOB wrote: »

For instance, its obsessed with sending people from the city centre to Citywest by getting *off* the Luas at Bluebell, walking a bit, and catching the Mortons bus from there; can't find a setting to stop it doing that.

De-select "Regional bus" or select "Routes with the fewest changes".

foggy_lad

Victor wrote: »

De-select "Regional bus" or select "Routes with the fewest changes".

Or use the "get there" journey planner which gives more logical options without the need to select and deselect several variables depending on the time of day you use the planner or wish to travel. It will also include all private buses whether they are fully compliant with the nta. Currently jj kavanaghs are not included in the nta planner for any journeys between Tramore/Waterford to Dublin airport as they are not fully complying with the route licence.

Victor

foggy_lad wrote: »

Currently jj kavanaghs are not included in the nta planner for any journeys between Tramore/Waterford to Dublin airport as they are not fully complying with the route licence.

In fairness, if there is confusion over what services they are running, it would be difficult to include them.

foggy_lad

Victor wrote: »

In fairness, if there is confusion over what services they are running, it would be difficult to include them.

They have highlighted any changes to the timetable but because they did not firstly wait a couple of years for the NTA to respond to a request to change the timetable they are now operating the Waterford-Dublin route without being properly licensed.

Leaving such important services out of the planner for such petty bureaucratic reasons smacks of some jobs-worth wielding the axe over the heads of Irish private companies.

The Idyl Race

foggy_lad wrote: »

They have highlighted any changes to the timetable but because they did not firstly wait a couple of years for the NTA to respond to a request to change the timetable they are now operating the Waterford-Dublin route without being properly licensed.

Leaving such important services out of the planner for such petty bureaucratic reasons smacks of some jobs-worth wielding the axe over the heads of Irish private companies.

I doubt anyone will go to the wall about being left out of any planner. Sure don't the cool kids go to boards.ie first?

L1011

Victor wrote: »

De-select "Regional bus" or select "Routes with the fewest changes".

Should be fixing the underlying data rather than requiring people to use arcane options to get the correct suggestions.

I'm tempted to actually *try* their recommendation some morning I don't actually need to be in Citywest to see if its even possible to get on that Mortons bus that far from its starting point (its the Sydney Parade -> Citywest shuttle) and how much more expensive it is than the Luas all the way. I'm pretty sure it won't be faster.

Victor

foggy_lad wrote: »

They have highlighted any changes to the timetable but because they did not firstly wait a couple of years for the NTA to respond to a request to change the timetable they are now operating the Waterford-Dublin route without being properly licensed.

Leaving such important services out of the planner for such petty bureaucratic reasons smacks of some jobs-worth wielding the axe over the heads of Irish private companies.

So, do anything you want and the state should cooperate?

foggy_lad

Victor wrote: »

So, do anything you want and the state should cooperate?

No but this quango are cutting their face off to spite their nose by making their planner almost useless as it doesn't include such important operators services. Also they have several stops in most towns and villages all referring to the same place that buses pull in, I was in ballybofey recently and there were 3 different locations listed for bus eireann route 64 route 490 and bus feda all of which use the only bus stops in the town.a

also in Carlow they used to have bus eireaann using a stop at barrack street which has not been used in years and all kavanaghs services using the bus park but the local services were on a separate stop at the bus park.

The whole thing is a mess and is years away from being user or tourist friendly and imho people are better off using getthere.ie which I have no links to.

Victor

foggy_lad wrote: »

No but this quango are cutting their face off to spite their nose by making their planner almost useless as it doesn't include such important operators services.

While ideally they would be included, ideally operators would fulfil their licence. Let's agree to disagree.

Also they have several stops in most towns and villages all referring to the same place that buses pull in, I was in ballybofey recently and there were 3 different locations listed for bus eireann route 64 route 490 and bus feda all of which use the only bus stops in the town.

This has been on the 'to do' list since 2 December, at least. Did you pass along any comments? It seems to affect routes 480, 487 (doesn't go to Ballybofey), 491, 494 also. Route 490 would appear unaffected (but has it's own problems).

The Journey Planner is dependent on information from the operators - bad information in, bad information out. Some operators call the stops "Ballybofey", some "Ballybofey (Shopping Centre)", some "Just Inn Cafe, Ballybofey" and others "Bus stop@Mc Elhinney’s Shop". All seem to fail to realise that roads have two sides and that some stops aren't where they claim. All a bit too provincial in the worst meaning of the word.

At the moment, a lot of information is drawn from operator's Automatic Vehicle Management systems. These seem to be quite happy with somewhat coarse data as it isn't intended for public consumption - a stop can easily be out by 100 metres and nobody cares. However, with the journey planner, that can suggest the stop is on another street. Gradually, user comments, systematic checking and data feeds from the RTPI project can point to where stops are wrong.

also in Carlow they used to have bus eireaann using a stop at barrack street which has not been used in years and all kavanaghs services using the bus park but the local services were on a separate stop at the bus park.

All appear to be now using the one stop in the Coach Park. The wrong data was provided by the operators. Many Bus Éireann timetables still list "Carlow (Barrack St)" or "Carlow (Bus Park)" or "Carlow (Bus Park, Barrack St)". The sign on site says "Hanover Weir Bus Park" (a bit useless) http://maps.google.ie/maps?q=carlow&hl=en&ll=52.834091,-6.927151&spn=0.000775,0.002642&sll=53.3834,-8.21775&sspn=6.26708,21.643066&hnear=County+Carlow&t=m&z=19&layer=c&cbll=52.834091,-6.927151&panoid=224S6lIxcgJhCUZyIgbS8Q&cbp=12,173.09,,3,0.99

http://www.buseireann.ie/pdf/1340979107-7.pdf

The whole thing is a mess and is years away from being user or tourist friendly and imho people are better off using getthere.ie which I have no links to.

Their information isn't magically any better.

Tube

Is a national journey planner too ambitious a project? Would it every be trustworthy, regardless of who wrote it?

Would it be better to just provide good maps and timetables and let people work out their own routes? I expect most people are already doing this rather than blindly trusting any route planner.

L1011

Tube wrote: »

Is a national journey planner too ambitious a project? Would it every be trustworthy, regardless of who wrote it?

No. Other countries can do it competently, with far more services than we have.

Tube wrote: »

Would it be better to just provide good maps and timetables and let people work out their own routes? I expect most people are already doing this rather than blindly trusting any route planner.

That should be provided *as well*, not instead.

Victor

Tube wrote: »

Is a national journey planner too ambitious a project? Would it every be trustworthy, regardless of who wrote it?

It is there. It is mostly right.

Would it be better to just provide good maps and timetables and let people work out their own routes?

The problem is that people would only look at the routes they know about and not consider the more obscure options or ones they simply don't know about.

There are about 400 routes with the Bus Éireann companies, a further 700 with the private operators and a further 2,000 with the rural transport scheme - nobody could analyse them all.

Not even me. It's taken 7 months for me to go through the 400.

Tube

MYOB wrote: »

No. Other countries can do it competently, with far more services than we have.

Just because other countries can do it competently doesn't necessarily mean we can though, does it?

I have no experience of any other multi mode journey planner abroad, but I think I would be reluctant to trust one either.

L1011

Tube wrote: »

Just because other countries can do it competently doesn't necessarily mean we can though, does it?

I have no experience of any other multi mode journey planner abroad, but I think I would be reluctant to trust one either.

Generally, when it comes to government/public IT systems, we actually do them better than other countries - you just need to ignore the media crying about PPARS till the end of all time and look at such oddities as other countries often only allowing access to major government systems during working hours for starters. In other cases, they charge for access for things that are free here or quite simply don't have equivalent services at all.

So yes, if other countries can do it competently, we definitively can.