Raymond McCreesh Park v. Royal/Queen/King/Victoria

Rebelheart

I see on the BBC website that the Equality Authority in the Six Counties is probing whether Raymond McCreesh Park is an infringement on the equal rights of, well, unionists:

Inquiry into naming of Newry hunger striker playpark


Can we now expect them to investigate all the streets, parks and the like named after the British royalist cult in the northeastern part of this country? Victoria, Albert, King, Queen, Windsor and Royal this, that and the other. A park gets named after a hero of Irish freedom and suddenly, they're getting sensitive to names....

Or is it only the native Irish/nationalist community which can't name places in the northeast of Ireland after heroes of their side?

It's a ban on the names of both sides, or no ban at all. This nonsense reminds me of Queen's University's restaurant years back when unionists said they were discriminated against because signs in the restaurant were in both Irish and English. The spineless bástards in Queen's quickly removed the Irish and left the English. "Inclusivity", British colonial style.


In the meantime, as long as all the "royal" etc names exist, Sinn Féin should continue naming parks after heroes of the republican struggle. In terms of nomenclature across the North that is tribal, sectarian and triumphalist, Sinn Féin has a mountain of catching up to do on the bigotry stakes, in fact.

junder

Rebelheart wrote: »

I see on the BBC website that the Equality Authority in the Six Counties is probing whether Raymond McCreesh Park is an infringement on the equal rights of, well, unionists:

Inquiry into naming of Newry hunger striker playpark


Can we now expect them to investigate all the streets, parks and the like named after the British royalist cult in the northeastern part of this country? Victoria, Albert, King, Queen, Windsor and Royal this, that and the other. A park gets named after a hero of Irish freedom and suddenly, they're getting sensitive to names....

Or is it only the native Irish/nationalist community which can't name places in the northeast of Ireland after heroes of their side?

It's a ban on the names of both sides, or no ban at all. This nonsense reminds me of Queen's University's restaurant years back when unionists said they were discriminated against because signs in the restaurant were in both Irish and English. The spineless bástards in Queen's quickly removed the Irish and left the English. "Inclusivity", British colonial style.


In the meantime, as long as all the "royal" etc names exist, Sinn Féin should continue naming parks after heroes of the republican struggle. In terms of nomenclature across the North that is tribal, sectarian and triumphalist, Sinn Féin has a mountain of catching up to do on the bigotry stakes, in fact.

Dead on, so you won't mind a gusty spence park then, goose and gander etc

Nodin

...I've no problem with a Gusty Spence park, or a David Ervine park....

GRMA

Rebelheart wrote: »

I see on the BBC website that the Equality Authority in the Six Counties is probing whether Raymond McCreesh Park is an infringement on the equal rights of, well, unionists:

Inquiry into naming of Newry hunger striker playpark


Can we now expect them to investigate all the streets, parks and the like named after the British royalist cult in the northeastern part of this country? Victoria, Albert, King, Queen, Windsor and Royal this, that and the other. A park gets named after a hero of Irish freedom and suddenly, they're getting sensitive to names....

Or is it only the native Irish/nationalist community which can't name places in the northeast of Ireland after heroes of their side?

It's a ban on the names of both sides, or no ban at all. This nonsense reminds me of Queen's University's restaurant years back when unionists said they were discriminated against because signs in the restaurant were in both Irish and English. The spineless bástards in Queen's quickly removed the Irish and left the English. "Inclusivity", British colonial style.


In the meantime, as long as all the "royal" etc names exist, Sinn Féin should continue naming parks after heroes of the republican struggle. In terms of nomenclature across the North that is tribal, sectarian and triumphalist, Sinn Féin has a mountain of catching up to do on the bigotry stakes, in fact.

Can we expect Carson's statue to be torn down? The Prince of Wales avenue renamed? Well the latter is already known among some as the P.O.W avenue!

Unionists opening a massive can of worms here, they just want things back the way they used to be, can't even stomach the fenians naming things after Irish patriots. Do they burst into flames if they get the train down south and try to get off at one of the many train stations named after "terrorists"?


The local community chose to name the park after a great Irish hero.. should be the end of the matter.

Fr Tod Umptious

I suppose if you want to go naming places after common criminals then there would be thousands to choose from.

junder

Nodin wrote: »

...I've no problem with a Gusty Spence park, or a David Ervine park....

Easy to say when the likely hood of something like ever happening like that is almost non existent

junder

GRMA wrote: »

Can we expect Carson's statue to be torn down? The Prince of Wales avenue renamed? Well the latter is already known among some as the P.O.W avenue!

Unionists opening a massive can of worms here, they just want things back the way they used to be, can't even stomach the fenians naming things after Irish patriots. Do they burst into flames if they get the train down south and try to get off at one of the many train stations named after "terrorists"?


The local community chose to name the park after a great Irish hero.. should be the end of the matter.

An Irish patriot who was handling the weapon ( and was most likely involved ) of one of the worst sectarian atrocitys of the troubles, is exciting workmen a patriotic act?

junder

Rebelheart wrote: »

I see on the BBC website that the Equality Authority in the Six Counties is probing whether Raymond McCreesh Park is an infringement on the equal rights of, well, unionists:

Inquiry into naming of Newry hunger striker playpark


Can we now expect them to investigate all the streets, parks and the like named after the British royalist cult in the northeastern part of this country? Victoria, Albert, King, Queen, Windsor and Royal this, that and the other. A park gets named after a hero of Irish freedom and suddenly, they're getting sensitive to names....

Or is it only the native Irish/nationalist community which can't name places in the northeast of Ireland after heroes of their side?

It's a ban on the names of both sides, or no ban at all. This nonsense reminds me of Queen's University's restaurant years back when unionists said they were discriminated against because signs in the restaurant were in both Irish and English. The spineless bástards in Queen's quickly removed the Irish and left the English. "Inclusivity", British colonial style.


In the meantime, as long as all the "royal" etc names exist, Sinn Féin should continue naming parks after heroes of the republican struggle. In terms of nomenclature across the North that is tribal, sectarian and triumphalist, Sinn Féin has a mountain of catching up to do on the bigotry stakes, in fact.

Seems you have things the wrong way around. How can Sinn Fein demand the removal of the union flag in Belfast to create a neatural enviroment and yet name a children's play park after an ira terroists and still insist that it is in the sprit of creating a neatural enviroment.

GRMA

junder wrote: »

An Irish patriot who was handling the weapon ( and was most likely involved ) of one of the worst sectarian atrocitys of the troubles, is exciting workmen a patriotic act?

junder you well know that weapons were kept in dumps and were used by many different people.

I assume you have evidence to back up your outlandish claim that he was "most likely involved" in that incident? Whats that, you dont? Thought as much.

junder

GRMA wrote: »

junder you well know that weapons were kept in dumps and were used by many different people.

I assume you have evidence to back up your outlandish claim that he was "most likely involved" in that incident? Whats that, you dont? Thought as much.

He was holding a weapon that had been used in the kingsmill murders, but even if he can't be directly linked to kingsmill there are others he can be

The PSNI Historical Enquiries Team linked McCreesh, along with two others, to a string of IRA attacks committed with the Armalite he was caught with:[citation needed]

The killing of RUC Constable David McNeice and rifleman Michael Gibson (Royal Jackets) at an ambush at Meigh in 1974; the attempted killing of Protestant farmer Samuel Rodgers at Camlough in 1975 who Raymond McCreesh delivered milk to as a milkman;the attack on a military helicopter and security force personnel at Carrickbroad, Forkhill, in 1976;{{cn} the attack on security force personnel at Mountain House, Belleek, Newry, in 1976, where the Armalite was recovered.[6]

So yer lets get boged down in what murders he was involved

junder

GRMA wrote: »

junder you well know that weapons were kept in dumps and were used by many different people.

I assume you have evidence to back up your outlandish claim that he was "most likely involved" in that incident? Whats that, you dont? Thought as much.

And know I don't know what goes on in illegal arms dumps since I am not part of an illegal organization, care to enlighten me?

gallag

I just can't understand the mentality needed to call someone who murderd innocent people a hero. Sad, bitter and twisted. Then to name a children's play park after him?????? Is is so sick. My kids will never be found in a play park named after a murderer.

woodoo

I don't think anyone that was in the provisional IRA should be getting a public park named after them. Same for any Loyalist, RUC man or British Army person. Try and keep these things as neutral as possible.

Sunnyisland

voodoo wrote: »

I don't think anyone that was in the provisional IRA should be getting a public park named after them. Same for any Loyalist, RUC man or British Army person. Try and keep these things as neutral as possible.

Yes we could call everything the george best or Barry mcguigan :)

JustinDee

As usual, something tribal to hack away at each other with. Its as if folk actually miss and pine for the grey, miserable, depressing not-so-long-ago version of a sh*theap known as Ireland.

Problem is the people with no experience of what it was like before. Some latch on to the ill-informed vision of the harkers in a campus pamphlet-driven/boredom-driven deluded cause-du-jour.

Trust us, kids. What we've got now is far better. Quit trying to sod it all up again.

blahfckingblah

junder wrote: »

The PSNI Historical Enquiries Team linked McCreesh, along with two others, to a string of IRA attacks committed with the Armalite he was caught with:[citation needed]

citation needed

GRMA

woodoo wrote: »

I don't think anyone that was in the provisional IRA should be getting a public park named after them. Same for any Loyalist, RUC man or British Army person. Try and keep these things as neutral as possible.

Everything named royal or after any member of the British royal family would have to be renamed so.

You can imagine the reaction that would get.

Live and et live, let the locals decide what to name things.

woodoo

GRMA wrote: »

Everything named royal or after any member of the British royal family would have to be renamed so.

Personally i'd be glad to see the back of Royal this and Royal that.

junder

blahfckingblah wrote: »

citation needed

It's lifted from a quick 30 second search on wikipedatge validity of which can be argued to the cows come home, end of the day he was convicted of attempted murder, conspiracy to murder, possession of firearms with intent to endanger life and PIRA membersh, so hardly a model citizen. Interesting peice on slugger

http://sluggerotoole.com/2012/12/04/one-rule-for-the-city-of-belfast-and-another-for-the-city-of-newry/

TOMASJ

junder wrote: »

An Irish patriot who was handling the weapon ( and was most likely involved ) of one of the worst sectarian atrocitys of the troubles, is exciting workmen a patriotic act?

Probably should have done what the brit army did,
destroy all guns used in murders so no evidence,

TOMASJ

gallag wrote: »

I just can't understand the mentality needed to call someone who murderd innocent people a hero. Sad, bitter and twisted. Then to name a children's play park after him?????? Is is so sick. My kids will never be found in a play park named after a murderer.

Make sure they don't play in any parks with the name "Cromwell" over the gate then

junder

TOMASJ wrote: »

Probably should have done what the brit army did,
destroy all guns used in murders so no evidence,

Could of just not murdered people

blahfckingblah

junder wrote: »

It's lifted from a quick 30 second search on wikipedatge validity of which can be argued to the cows come home, end of the day he was convicted of attempted murder, conspiracy to murder, possession of firearms with intent to endanger life and PIRA membersh, so hardly a model citizen. Interesting peice on slugger

http://sluggerotoole.com/2012/12/04/one-rule-for-the-city-of-belfast-and-another-for-the-city-of-newry/

rather than arguing about the validity of your claims i was more attacking the way you provided an unverified source as fact... something that happens all too often

TOMASJ

junder wrote: »

Could of just not murdered people

Who, the brits or the IRA

junder

TOMASJ wrote: »

Who, the brits or the IRA

Whoever you suggested should have destroyed thier weapons and didn't. It was you who raised the subject, so why don't you enlighten me to who you where talking about?

GRMA

woodoo wrote: »

Personally i'd be glad to see the back of Royal this and Royal that.

You've seen the hassle with the flag, imagine if they started renaming stuff and tearing down statues! haha

If you (in general, not aiming this at any poster) don't have a problem with train stations etc being named after IRA men in the south you are a hypocrite if you object to naming something after one of the ten.

GRMA

junder wrote: »

It's lifted from a quick 30 second search on wikipedatge validity of which can be argued to the cows come home, end of the day he was convicted of attempted murder, conspiracy to murder, possession of firearms with intent to endanger life and PIRA membersh, so hardly a model citizen. Interesting peice on slugger

http://sluggerotoole.com/2012/12/04/one-rule-for-the-city-of-belfast-and-another-for-the-city-of-newry/

And he is a hero to a significant amount of people in Ireland, and abroad even.

I'm sure your community looks up to people who I don't like.

junder

GRMA wrote: »

And he is a hero to a significant amount of people in Ireland, and abroad even.

I'm sure your community looks up to people who I don't like.

Thankfully there are a significant amount of people in your community who don't see him as a hero

GRMA

junder wrote: »

And know I don't know what goes on in illegal arms dumps since I am not part of an illegal organization, care to enlighten me?

I reported this post rather than respond to it, but seen as nothing happened I guess I have to respond to it.

I really resent your implication. And reject it.

As a member of the security forces I hope you don't go around making dark hints like that about people being members of paramilitary groups.

That type of carry on gets those people murdered.

junder

GRMA wrote: »

And he is a hero to a significant amount of people in Ireland, and abroad even.

I'm sure your community looks up to people who I don't like.

GRMA wrote: »

I reported this post rather than respond to it, but seen as nothing happened I guess I have to respond to it.

I really resent your implication. And reject it.

As a member of the security forces I hope you don't go around making dark hints like that about people being members of paramilitary groups.

That type of carry on gets those people murdered.

A bit flippant I know but then you did make the assertion that I somehow knew what went on in illegal arms dumps, I was just responding in kind, for your benefit and so you don't make any wrong assumptions again. I am a political loyalist, I am not, have never been a member of any proscribed organisations, so no I don't know what goes on in illegal arms dumps or what loyalists are doing in prisons or any other of the countless assertions made about me. If you don't like it, don't do it to other people.

GRMA

junder wrote: »

A bit flippant I know but then you did make the assertion that I somehow knew what went on in illegal arms dumps, I was just responding in kind, for your benefit and so you don't make any wrong assumptions again. I am a political loyalist, I am not, have never been a member of any proscribed organisations, so no I don't know what goes on in illegal arms dumps or what loyalists are doing in prisons or any other of the countless assertions made about me. If you don't like it, don't do it to other people.

I'd assumed you had read some books like I have, plus it was said to you in other threads by Nodin I believe.

You are a member of the British army, do you really know nothing about how the IRA operated and stored weapons? Sure you would have seen TV reports about decommissioning and people inspecting IRA arms dumps at the least?

As for the prisons I assumed you and "political loyalists" would have a general idea of what happened with loyalists in jail and the conflict they had within. I'm a republican living in the south currently and I have a bit of an idea, as a loyalist who lives in Belfast I'd assumed you'd know more than me. That was all, I wasn't saying you were a member of any loyalist paramilitary group.

Why would I? You're in the British army... thats bad enough in my eyes, no need to cast you in a worse light! haha

gallag

Did the IRA really reuse weapons out of their vast arsenal knowing it would implicate them if caught? Seems a bit silly. Probably more an excuse if caught. Killing workers due to their religion = hero. Sad. I don't think I have ever meet a unionist who would call a loyalist who murderd someone because of their religion a hero. Not saying it did not happen I just know their would not be a kiddys play park named after them, gives me shivers. I guess we are a bit more evolved than to indoctrinate our children into the obvious blinding hatred. I suppose they have to make sure the army of voters they breed vote the right way.

Death and Taxes

Rebelheart wrote: »

I see on the BBC website that the Equality Authority in the Six Counties is probing whether Raymond McCreesh Park is an infringement on the equal rights of, well, unionists:

Inquiry into naming of Newry hunger striker playpark


Can we now expect them to investigate all the streets, parks and the like named after the British royalist cult in the northeastern part of this country? Victoria, Albert, King, Queen, Windsor and Royal this, that and the other. A park gets named after a hero of Irish freedom and suddenly, they're getting sensitive to names....

Or is it only the native Irish/nationalist community which can't name places in the northeast of Ireland after heroes of their side?

It's a ban on the names of both sides, or no ban at all. This nonsense reminds me of Queen's University's restaurant years back when unionists said they were discriminated against because signs in the restaurant were in both Irish and English. The spineless bástards in Queen's quickly removed the Irish and left the English. "Inclusivity", British colonial style.


In the meantime, as long as all the "royal" etc names exist, Sinn Féin should continue naming parks after heroes of the republican struggle. In terms of nomenclature across the North that is tribal, sectarian and triumphalist, Sinn Féin has a mountain of catching up to do on the bigotry stakes, in fact.

As an Irishman, and a nationalist let me tell you the Ray Mc Creesh and his ilk are no Hero's of mine, try speaking for yourself please , don't claim to speak for everyone else.
naming a park after a terrorist just shows how far some people will go to derail any chance of reconcilliation in N.I.

southsiderosie

MOD NOTE:

Wow, this thread descended into a shítshow quicker than usual. Perhaps this was to be expected, given the tone of the OP.

OP, I don't know how many times you need to be warned about posting in such an abrasive manner. Perhaps this is not the forum for you.

Everyone else, please try to last more than two pages without digging into the usual trench warfare next time.

Thread closed.