Ryanair on a sticky wicket in Germany?

RadioRetro

Seems the German authorities are looking at whether there's a discrepancy between declared and actual MTOWs. If so it could be expensive.

Madpaddy79

RadioRetro wrote: »

Seems the German authorities are looking at whether there's a discrepancy between declared and actual MTOWs. If so it could be expensive.

If you could hand a €10 note instead of a €20 note to a shop keeper and get away with it, you would!

That's the airports and authorities not paying attention. THEIR problem isn't it 😱

IngazZagni

If they are saying that ALL fees have been paid based on the lower 66.9T. placarded MTOW then yes there is a problem. The majority of flights would operate with an actual TOW of less than 66.9 and thus paying fees based on this MTOW is perfectly acceptable under IAA rules. Longer sector flights could operate above 66.9 up to 69.9t and above 69.9t up to but never above 75t. These flights would be charged higher ATC and airway fees. This has to be declared by the FR authorities. So again if the report is suggesting that ALL fees have been based on less than 66.9 then there is a big problem. If they are saying that only some flights pay more than this, then I don't think there is any issue here.

Milan Cobian

So, MadPaddy, what you're saying is that dishonesty and theft is the best policy in any situation.

Fully Established

These are fairly serious claims of fraud being made about Ryanair . This year Ryanair have been more under the scope of aviation authorities than any other time , I suppose their is only so many times you can insult the authorities before they react , great to see these types of investigations hopefully its only the start of exposing all the underhand tactics used by Ryanair .

LeftBase

How long will it be before the Spanish media etc are reporting that Ryanair are flying overweight? :rolleyes:

Madpaddy79

Milan Cobian wrote: »

So, MadPaddy, what you're saying is that dishonesty and theft is the best policy in any situation.

Is that what I said?

Cessna_Pilot

It's funny, the media and some authorities have really got on Ryanair's case this year. Especially the Spanish who turned out to be blatently on a witch hunt over the fuel issues during the summer.

Ryanair operate a variable weight program, which is very effective and well within the confines of the law. I think, once again, this is a witch hunt that will fall flat in the face of the accusers.

Tenger

Cessna_Pilot wrote: »

It's funny, the media and some authorities have really got on Ryanair's case this year. Especially the Spanish who turned out to be blatently on a witch hunt over the fuel issues during the summer.

Ryanair operate a variable weight program, which is very effective and well within the confines of the law. I think, once again, this is a witch hunt that will fall flat in the face of the accusers.

Well the German report states that the aircraft is charged on its declared MTOW under German regs. So variable weight does not seem to be an issue.

“Where an aircraft has multiple certified maximum take-off weights, the maximum one shall be used,” for levying fees. This explicit provision is the key point of the official charges document published by the German Air Navigation Services and applicable for all operators conducting flights to the country’s international airports.

Could very well be that the FR policy of no cargo and feck all hold baggage plays a part....but 8 tonnes in the difference?

Madpaddy79

Milan Cobian wrote: »

Yes that's what you said. You advocated deliberately and knowingly robbing a shop keeper of €10. Then you claimed it was acceptable to dishonestly undercharge those who don't "pay attention."



The scheme itself is within the confines of the law as long as the rules are followed. Ryanair have been caught flouting the rules and that's against the law.
I note the typical Irish reaction of law-breakers: sneaking regard. Ever wonder why the country is in the state it's in?

Word twisting will not replace your "bike". I suggest you head over to the "junkies" form and take it out on them.

"you claimed it was acceptable to dishonestly undercharge those who don't "pay attention" - - - not what I said, FR are not undercharging. Just maybe under paying. So If an airport is not checking, that's their loss.

This is how business is done in the cutthroat aviation world today. It's called survival mate. Everyone trying to get one over on the next. That's life and no one else is going to hold your hand through it.

You also say " it's in the confines of the law ", then you say " they are breaking the law". Get off the fence and make your mind up!! Flouting rules is just walking through holes that authorities leave for companies to take full advantage of. Nothing new here.

basill

This is how business is done in the cutthroat aviation world today. It's called survival mate. Everyone trying to get one over on the next. That's life and no one else is going to hold your hand through it.

You seem to be of the mistaken belief that because it is "alleged" that a certain loco airline is cutting corners then it is endemic, just and happens industry wide. It doesn't and it does not make it right nor legal.

As commercial pilots one of the first things we learn in basic flying training is honesty. we fess up our mistakes and we don't rush. There is no place within this industry for liars, cheats and cover ups. Accident reports are littered with instances of these sorts of events and people have died unnecessarily.

Madpaddy79

basill wrote: »

You seem to be of the mistaken belief that because it is "alleged" that a certain loco airline is cutting corners then it is endemic, just and happens industry wide. It doesn't and it does not make it right nor legal.

As commercial pilots one of the first things we learn in basic flying training is honesty. we fess up our mistakes and we don't rush. There is no place within this industry for liars, cheats and cover ups. Accident reports are littered with instances of these sorts of events and people have died unnecessarily.

How does this have anything to do with pilots?? Or how they behave ???

IngazZagni

There seems to be a difference in what Ryanair are approved to do by the IAA in operating Boeings flex weight programme. The German authorities believe it should be the max structural TOW while Ryanair are approved by the IAA to operate based on max certified. TOW. There seems to be confusion in how you define Eurocontrols policy.

Many major airlines operate Boeings flex weight programme for cost cutting so if I am understanding this correctly then this issue will not be confined to just Ryanair but many big operators as well. They just decided to pick a fight with their favourite airline first.