First Time Buyer

RiderOnTheStorm

hi folks. I have just read Aidans weekly tips and they are great. But has anyone got any tips for a first time buyer? I have spent a lot of time in a mobile home, and I know the usual stuff about cars / engines, so what particular advice would you give for Camper Vans? What should I watch out for when looking to buy one?
eg if I buy one with engine below x litres, am I going to have to buy y to compensate for z? Can I use normal domestic plugs / appliances on all CVs? Is it worthwhile looking for 25 year old CV just to avail of the classic road tax? Or does an old van bring its own problems? Has anyone said 'sure it will be allright' when looking at the shower / toilet arrangement, and lived to regret it? Is it a big deal to install a satelite dish (so maybe look for one with it already in). Is a left hand drive too much hassle? Should a noobie like me get a CV from a dealer so I can get service / repairs easier ?

I know this is a broad asking thread, but any and all tips will be greatly appreciated!

zoltar_boi

For what it's worth, lhd is no issues in Ireland. Personally, I love being in the ditch. That way I know I can't move over any further in county lanes. I've heard nasty takes about people losing side Windows because they thought they could go in a little bit more.

Best of luck with your search.

Irishgoatman

All the best from me as well and welcome.

Let me just say that, WOW, you will be inundated with answers to your questions I hope. So reading glasses on and printer at the ready for the good ones.:D

One thing I think you forgot to add is: are you looking for something for one person, two people or a family of six?

RiderOnTheStorm

thx folks .... yup, hoping for loads of info ....

What We Will Use It For :
The 'van will be for my wife and I. Lots of weekends away, I hope. The occasional week here and there during the year. Nothing very long. We have 2 (almost grown) kids, so they may come with us from time to time. We also have 2 small dogs, if thats a factor.

Another I was thinking, if its just the 2 of us for most of the time, is it better to get one with a permanent bed so that I dont have to fold away table / seats every night. This might get old quickly ....

ta

Aidan_M_M

I'm biased so obviously I'm gonna say buy from a dealer (*Pat Horan Motors, cough cough..... Lol*) but whatever you decide, make sure you look at LOADS. for a couple, IMO a lo-profile with perm bed is the only choice, if you're active, maybe one with a rear storage area for bikes, boogie boards, wet gear, or even to house the dogs. As regards buying a classic..... The choice is limited, really limited to be honest and I don't think the gains are offsetting the the downsides. I mean , tax and insurance is as cheap on a new one as a classic. Also you've the issue of a classic that never had to do an NCT or doe before. Outdated heaters, fridges etc.
don't get me wrong , I'd love a Splitty Vw, a 17 window on Empi wheels, but it would be for day tripping , not holidaying!

spaceHopper

The DOE is new so even if the van passed DOE check all windows have the correct markings they weren’t that strict this time around.

If it is an old van plastic items like sky lights will be brittle and need replacing because of years of UV light. The same make will probably be close but more than likely have small changes that mean cutting into the van the make the new ones fit. This is ok once you are expecting it, remove the old one carefully so you can put it back worst case.

A van that hasn’t been driven in a few years will have problems from lying up, oil will have settled…..

Layout will make or break a van look at lots on line know what you want before you go looking.

Unless you know the history change the timing belt and tensioners, put in a new starter battery. Get the current owner to show you how everything works, there can be a few quirks.

killalanerr

I will start by giving you my standard answer when this thread comes up
set a budget then double it


If its just going to be the 2 of you most of the time go for a fixed bed all that setting up and taking down can be hard work,for me it would have to have a lounging area where you can relax with the glass of wine and not just the dinenet area
Also you need some decent outside storage/garage for all the bits chairs tables and dog stuff you will need for bikes i use a bike rack so if your plan on carrying bikes a rack would be a must,as for the sat dish if your only going to use the van in Ireland its not a must as long as the van has a working aerial with a saorview box or tv you will get all the tv you need,try and find one with a seprate shower its so much easier to live with
motortax is set €102 so no real saving for going for an older yoke,for engine size no smaller than than a turbo 2.5 and a 2.8 would be better and if you are new to motorhomes forget all you have heard about fiat for campers Fiat Ducato is king keeping in mind most of them sit on driveways for 10 months of the year with regular services they just dont brake make sure you get one with a current doe
As has been said look at loads their would be some saving to be made by buying private but if you prefer the piece of mind a grantee would give go for a dealer.
When you do start looking when you arrive at a van it should be spotless with all the sellers personal items taken out make sure every thing works get the owner/sales person to show you how to work things make a list you would be surprised the things you can over look when you see the big shiny van that you really like http://www.camping-canada.com/rv_buying_used_checklist_e.htm
I hope some of my ramblings are of help to you and all the best with your search

In defense of old yolks (which I'll probably get slated for...:p);
I have 4 warning lights in a '94 Merc (not that old) the modern Sprinter some of them have over 36!!!
Modern vehicles are getting ridiculous...unnecessarily long and elaborate looms, EDU's, stupid beepers (grrr), pointless idiot proofing (eg. indicators that flash 3 times despite that you flick them off immediately), automatic gearboxes that think for themselves (like going into neutral when you open the driver door despite if you need the reverse lights to see what you're unloading, or won't go to second gear in low traction), digital accelerators, sub-standard rust-prone recycled metals, they blow their turbo's if you use the non regulation oil...i could go on...
4 of the last 4 problems my friends have had with their vehicles regarding warning lights were not faults in the systems they indicated but rather faults in the fault finding system, sensors mostly. What's the point?
It's my firm belief that the vehicles hitting the market today will not be on the road as long as those built 20 years ago.
Not to mention what a pain in the ar$e it will be to get a DOE on a ten year old vehicle with 36 warning lights.

In fairness keeping something old on the road will cost the same as buying something new and working so it's a personal choice not a financial one.

Irishgoatman

I'm with you on this one Sir Liam,

25 years, or so, ago I did all my own work on cars including stripping engines down to the bone. Today I wouldn't dream of it. The're mostly controlled by those nasty things called computers:eek:.

My camper is a 1984 and on a good day I can do all my own work/servicing. By a good day I mean me not the weather:D.

RiderOnTheStorm

killalanerr wrote: »

...set a budget then double it ...

yup, sounds like many other enterprises ;-)


Thanks for all the advice guys (gals?) .... its exactly what I am looking for.

camper guy

Hi RiderOnTheStorm you are getting some great advice from the guys and girls on boards.ie .
I would just like to add that if your going for a right hand drive be very carefull of rust underneath rotten cross members rotten brake pipes rusty sills .Most of the right hand drives in this country came in from England.
I recently had to change down from a motorhome to a camper van .

I brought my motorhome to be tested and I got a list the length of my arm. The repair and parts bill was massive and the trader who took my motorhome in an exchange got stung with it . He had terrable problems getting parts and he had to have a mechanic work on it for a week.
I would suggest you get it up on a ramp and get your own mechanic to check it out for you .

Irishgoatman

Although I don't disagree completely with camper guy, I went to the U.K. to get my camper and the paper work that came with it included the previous 4 years M.O.T. certs. I took it to a D.O.E. garage here and had it tested, before the new law came in, and it passed with flying colours.

Just make sure that a second hand vehicle has test certs is the answer as far as I'm concerned.

Mine came from the UK and had always had MOT because previous owners kept painting over/gluing/stone chipping/plaster of parising the rust.
I spent the bones of 4 months rebuilding it. MOT just means they didn't find it or couldn't push a bar through it.

Any transport minister who advocates salting the roads needs to be slapped in the face. It destroys vehicles shortening their lifespan, makes them pointless to recycle and ruins agriculture.

Aidan_M_M

Jeez Liam , I'd sooner worry about rust than sliding off an icy road.

paddyp

Aidan_M_M wrote: »

Jeez Liam , I'd sooner worry about rust than sliding off an icy road.

+1
Don't you remember what happened when the salt ran out. Even with snow Tyres we couldn't each our own house businesses closed deliveries stopped. Hardly desireable in a recession the alternatives e.g urea, potassium chloride, acetates etc are 3-20 times the price. Our friend went through a humpback bridge on ice a few weeks ago and wrote off his Camper I bet he would have been glad of some salt.

Snow plows :rolleyes:

paddyp

paddyp wrote: »

Don't you remember what happened when the salt ran out.

Yes didn't stop me.

paddyp

Sir Liamalot wrote: »

Snow plows :rolleyes:

Are you serious, Good luck snow ploughing the ice on the road :rolleyes:

Sir Liamalot wrote: »

Yes didn't stop me.

I'm delighted for you. Half the country came to halt but lets stop salting the roads because you were able get around.

Most countries that are continually sub zero don't use salt because it's ineffective it simply refreezes. There are alternative less harmful methods.
Also learning/adapting how to drive in the snow and ice plays a large factor in whether one is halted or not. I've no sympathy for anyone who can't move their BMW because they haven't enough sense to put a massive sandbag in the boot.

PS. sorry for hijixing your thread rider...promise I'll stop ranting or move to a new thread if I can't

RiderOnTheStorm

no worries guys. Its all good stuff. Have often wondered about salt v grit .... it seemed more imporant 2 years ago , I am less worried now.

I spotted a nice van in East Coast Campers at the weekend. A RHD Peugeot Sprinter Royale 1996. Layout is very good. 5 berth. Low milage, 1.9td with bike rack. Very few things I dont like, like no roof-rack and no captain chair. Are these very small things? We (my wife & I) really like it .... but we dont love it. I think we will have to keep looking.

Aidan_M_M

That'd be sluggish enough to be honest. You'd really want to go over it with a fine tooth comb for rot and damp, we'd a couple of them before and they were nothing special IMO.

RiderOnTheStorm

ok, I have gone off the Royale .... I have gone to see a few dealers over Crimbo (even went up to Tipp for tea @ Aidans place) and saw dozens. So many of them were out of my price range, but they were fab. I would trade my house for the 98,000 one we saw last Thurs ..... if I was let!

So, we put a deposit on a 92 Fiat Ducato (2.5td with perm double bed in the back) and its going for DOE now. I will pick it up when it passes. It was very reasonable price, and if we get use out of it, and like life on the road as much as we think we will, then I will trade up in a few years.

Looking forward to a 2013 project (not much to do really, but re-org the furnature and put in some gadgets!)

thx all for tips ... I will be back for more during the year

RiderOnTheStorm

found a pic on my phone of the Ducato .... sorry for poor quality ....

if y'all dont mind, I will post here from time to time, and you can see the baby steps that a first time buyer goes thru (and feel free to throw in any advice or warn me off doing anything terrible!)



Thinking of naming her Crystal (as in Crystal Meth Lab .... Breaking Bad anyone?)

Aidan_M_M

RiderOnTheStorm wrote: »

found a pic on my phone of the Ducato .... sorry for poor quality ....

if y'all dont mind, I will post here from time to time, and you can see the baby steps that a first time buyer goes thru (and feel free to throw in any advice or warn me off doing anything terrible!)



Thinking of naming her Crystal (as in Crystal Meth Lab .... Breaking Bad anyone?)

Was it painted on the lower skirts? I don't recall them being blue ? Not a bad camper them older FFBs.

RiderOnTheStorm

i dont think that part was painted ..... it looks likes its the orig colour of the plastic trim .... didnt pay too much attention to it at the time. I will have close look when I get her.

Some details:
=it has 130k miles on the clock.
=2 double beds (one in back and one over cab), and a seating area that converts to a big single
=roofrack and bike rack installed
=storage under the rear bed (accessable from inside & out)
=3 ring hob but no oven
=fridge (3 way type .... I forget the name)
=truama heater
=there are some cracks in the outside trim, bumper, and a few on the walls. But no sign or smell of damp / must etc. I reckon I can tart up some of them. The step up to the ladder will be my first project, as it has a bad crack and I will be going up and down a bit in the beginning (to put on roof box, ariel, etc)
=the side windows have all been replaced recently

the rambler

best of luck with the new purchase/adventure,

hope you and yours have many happy and memorable trips,

happy camping:)

camper guy

Hi best of luck with your new purchase it looks great .
Walt and Jessy from breaking bad would love to be driving around in it.

Aidan_M_M

camper guy wrote: »

Hi best of luck with your new purchase it looks great .
Walt and Jessy from breaking bad would love to be driving around in it.

Best of luck indeed! I've a soft soot for them old Ducatos, puddin' to work on.

WildWater

Good luck and happy camping.

snailsong

Good luck and happy camping.

That van looks like a first cousin of ours, which we bought a few weeks ago.

Ours is a 92 oy Ducato 2.5d. 5 berth, no turbo, no power steering, no rust, no leaks..

Its in pretty good nick but we still have a list of 25 jobs. trying to do most if not all of it myself, based on 16 years working on boats. So far sorted oil leak, replaced engine mounting, sorted problem charging leisure battery, full engine service, washed all seat cushions and bought new curtains. Today's job was to fit two extra seat belts. I got two lap belts for free from a local garage for the rear facing dinette seats.

Already had two trips to the beach. Worked out good, had lunch in the van with friends while the kids played. Met people at the beach who dropped in for tea too, quite the novelty.

I think the suspension could be improved, its two inches lower on one side. still scratching my head about this, boats don't have suspension.:)

I'll be interested to see how you get on, Rider. Good luck.

Aidan_M_M

leaf spring either broken or weak.

snailsong

Thanks for the advice, Aidan.

I thought the same but the leaf springs look ok. How would I know if it was weak? Both springs are sitting flat or slightly above (smiling not frowning) and the clearance at the rubber stoppers is about equal, 100mm or so, both sides. There are coil springs (spring assistors?) between the chassis and axel and one of those is broken. However the broken one is on the high side, near the end of the spring and seems no more than 10mm shorter than the other. Any idea where I'd get one of those?

Could the problem be at the front of the van? The clearance at the wheel arch seems bigger at one side though the coil springs don't appear to be broken.

I need to do more investigation when weather and daylight allow. If anyone wants to give me diagnostic tips I'd be thankful.

The van is driving pretty well and handling is not bad since it rarely exceeds 80kph.

Apologies, rideronthestorm for hijacking your thread.

dickwod1

Looks great, best of luck

(Second cousin of my Talbot Express!)

paddyp

Rubber on the top shock mount might have failed so the top of the shock is sticking up. They're only about 17 euro spurious. worth changing the strut bearing and seal at the same time if they're not perfect. My friends one failed dismounting a kerb mine failed on the way to doe when I hit a pothole in a flood. Both vans were down on one side.

snailsong

Thanks, that seems a contender. Do you access the shock top from inside the cab by removing the trim over the wheel arch etc.?

RiderOnTheStorm

thx for all the nice posts folks .....

the CV has passed the DOE and we are picking it up tomorrow ..... yeah !!!

RiderOnTheStorm

ok, did a few small jobs to the camper



Biggest one was to put down a laminate wood floor. There were a couple of soft spots (one just inside the door, and another infront of the sink. I reckon they were high traffic areas. The laminate will give a lot of support / strength.

We also replaced the old worktop on top of the hob / sink and replaced it with new wood one to match the floor.

Next job is to replace the shower hose. There is selotape on it .... not a good sign! .... and it doesnt reach from the sink to the shower-head-holder on the wall. I have a new kink-resistant hose and new head ..... hope it goes through the hole in the sink or it will be a very short DIY job!

snailsong

nice job, bro'.

Aidan_M_M

snailsong wrote: »

Thanks, that seems a contender. Do you access the shock top from inside the cab by removing the trim over the wheel arch etc.?

Yup.

munsterabu

RiderOnTheStorm wrote: »

ok, did a few small jobs to the camper



Biggest one was to put down a laminate wood floor. There were a couple of soft spots (one just inside the door, and another infront of the sink. I reckon they were high traffic areas. The laminate will give a lot of support / strength.

We also replaced the old worktop on top of the hob / sink and replaced it with new wood one to match the floor.

Next job is to replace the shower hose. There is selotape on it .... not a good sign! .... and it doesnt reach from the sink to the shower-head-holder on the wall. I have a new kink-resistant hose and new head ..... hope it goes through the hole in the sink or it will be a very short DIY job!

Hello Rider,
Van looks good,I have an A -Class Dethleffs version of this base model plenty of power if needed ,LHD good for small roads which a lot of beach roads in ireland are, gear change and general manouverability v.good,as a first timer i made the mistake of running the leisure battery low on a few occasions which does reduce the max output each time it,s recharged and will eventually fail..i keep mine topped up when idle..see ya around and enjoy you,re future holidays let's hope this summer is at least warm and a bit dry..

Aidan_M_M

munsterabu wrote: »

recharged and will eventually fail..i keep mine topped up when idle..

It's not advised to leave them plugged in constantly.

munsterabu

Aidan_M_M wrote: »

It's not advised to leave them plugged in constantly.

Thanks for the concern is this a safety practice or for another reason ? the documentation that was enclosed with battery states otherwise?

Aidan_M_M

munsterabu wrote: »

Thanks for the concern is this a safety practice or for another reason ? the documentation that was enclosed with battery states otherwise?

It would be the case with an intelligent charger, but I've never seen one in an MH that was truly "intelligent". A good battery wouldn't need that anyway. I put a proper good quality one in a car last year, and it still showed 12.5 volts after a year of standing without driving or charging.

paddyp

Aidan_M_M wrote: »

It would be the case with an intelligent charger, but I've never seen one in an MH that was truly "intelligent". A good battery wouldn't need that anyway. I put a proper good quality one in a car last year, and it still showed 12.5 volts after a year of standing without driving or charging.

Thats a good battery! Also must be an old car as all modern cars have a standby current of a few to tens of milliamps for various things, keep alive memory in the bsi, ecu, radio, keyless entry unit, alarm etc.


In terms of starter battery if you measure the standby current with a multimeter you can estimate how long between recharges.

5mA x 24 hours = 3.6Ah per month

Cars with aftermarket stereo, alarm etc could easily be 30mA -80mA

Standard flooded starter battery will have a self discharge too of 5% a month for a good battery to 20% for an old battery.

So with a decent 110Ah starter battery at 5mA standaby you're talking about losing 9Ah per month. Should still start no problem after 6 months idle.

A decent leisure battery agm, gel only loses are 1-2% per month. So after 6 months you'd still have over 80% charge. Usually people with problems have left their distribution panel tuned on or the batteries are shot.

As for leaving plugged in 24/7 our friend plugged in a caravan with an automatic charger and went to bed woke up at 4am with caravan on fire then the house caught and 4 firetrucks failed to put it out the house is a writeoff.

Aidan_M_M

Yes, it is a good battery, I never feck around with bad ones. It's in a 1999 Ford Ka.