Handicap question

scubapro

I know If your handicap lapses you have six months before having to resubmit three cards, but what if one didn't want to transfer their handicap and wanted to resubmit three cards on the basis of trying to get a lower handicap?

GreeBo

scubapro wrote: »

I know If your handicap lapses you have six months before having to resubmit three cards, but what if one didn't want to transfer their handicap and wanted to resubmit three cards on the basis of trying to get a lower handicap?

I dont believe you can, perhaps talk to your handicap secretary if you think your handicap is incorrect, however without cards from qualifying competitions to back you up I dont think you will get far...

Almaviva

Even if you were to make that manoeuvre, it is not a strict average (or even the reduced to max double bogey per hole) of the 3 cards that determines the handicap. Playing history is taken into account. If you have a handicap that has been maintained with regular qualifying scores, then that would have greater standing than just 3 non competition cards, and you would likely, and correctly, just begiven the previous handicap back.

TGoodall

I moved clubs the start of the year. I had left my old club 4 months earlier and was told I could just get my hc cert fromthe old club and start playing comps as soon as that was cleared. I had done a good bit of practice in the winter between clubs so explained this to the secretary and he said I could submit three new cards.

Had been off 23 in the old club with about 5 comps in a row inside the buffer but felt I was due a big cut and didn't want to look like a bandit in my first comp in a new club.

Submitted three new cards, played well and got a new hc of 16. Just about starting to play to that regularly now.

I doubt they will mind you trying to get a lower hc if that's what you think you can play to.

onlyfinewine

scubapro wrote: »

I know If your handicap lapses you have six months before having to resubmit three cards, but what if one didn't want to transfer their handicap and wanted to resubmit three cards on the basis of trying to get a lower handicap?

It depends on why your handicap lapsed and what the present circumstances are. To give an opinion would require these to be clarified.

scubapro

TGoodall wrote: »

I moved clubs the start of the year. I had left my old club 4 months earlier and was told I could just get my hc cert fromthe old club and start playing comps as soon as that was cleared. I had done a good bit of practice in the winter between clubs so explained this to the secretary and he said I could submit three new cards.

Had been off 23 in the old club with about 5 comps in a row inside the buffer but felt I was due a big cut and didn't want to look like a bandit in my first comp in a new club.

Submitted three new cards, played well and got a new hc of 16. Just about starting to play to that regularly now.

I doubt they will mind you trying to get a lower hc if that's what you think you can play to.

Good bit of info here, I have been looking for a club for a while since my last one went under(enough said) and now I have finally bitten the bullet and decided on a club to join ,I played it yesterday and shot 90(par 72).
I'm averaging low to mid nineties per round with a few nightmares thrown in, I was playing alot of opens early summer but could never get a decent 18 in, would always destroy my round with 3 or 4 scratches, always trying too hard anyway played my last two opens October bank holiday weekend and won both of them, I suppose the crux of the matter is I am not be comfortable joining a new club with my existing handicap, as more often than not I am nearly always playing to it. Oh yeah I play off 25:eek:

PARlance

scubapro wrote: »

Good bit of info here, I have been looking for a club for a while since my last one went under(enough said) and now I have finally bitten the bullet and decided on a club to join ,I played it yesterday and shot 90(par 72).
I'm averaging low to mid nineties per round with a few nightmares thrown in, I was playing alot of opens early summer but could never get a decent 18 in, would always destroy my round with 3 or 4 scratches, always trying too hard anyway played my last two opens October bank holiday weekend and won both of them, I suppose the crux of the matter is I am not be comfortable joining a new club with my existing handicap, as more often than not I am nearly always playing to it. Oh yeah I play off 25:eek:

I think we'll have to have a word with the Boards G.S handicap secretary no matter what happens with this

scubapro

ajcurry123 wrote: »

I think we'll have to have a word with the Boards G.S handicap secretary no matter what happens with this

Well I did have two 2nd places and a 4th place:)

Keano

We are always watching, don't you worry :pac:

cackhanded

You can play off any handicap you like that is lower than your official handicap. It's whatever you put on the card & enter in the computer that counts.

onlyfinewine

scubapro wrote: »

Good bit of info here, I have been looking for a club for a while since my last one went under(enough said) and now I have finally bitten the bullet and decided on a club to join ,I played it yesterday and shot 90(par 72).
I'm averaging low to mid nineties per round with a few nightmares thrown in, I was playing alot of opens early summer but could never get a decent 18 in, would always destroy my round with 3 or 4 scratches, always trying too hard anyway played my last two opens October bank holiday weekend and won both of them, I suppose the crux of the matter is I am not be comfortable joining a new club with my existing handicap, as more often than not I am nearly always playing to it. Oh yeah I play off 25:eek:

Unfortunately, you have been misinformed because your handicap is lost immediately if your club is no longer affiliated to the GUI.

Rule 24.7. A player's handicap is lost immediately he ceases to be a member of an affiliated club or loses his amateur status.

To make matters worse in accordance with rule 24.8

24.8 Whilst a player's handicap is suspended or has been lost, he shall not enter or compete in any competition which requires a competitor to be the holder of a CONGU handicap as designated by the UHS.

So your options are to join an affiliated club and then follow the correct procedure to obtain a handicap.

8under

onlyfinewine wrote: »

Unfortunately, you have been misinformed because your handicap is lost immediately if your club is no longer affiliated to the GUI.

Rule 24.7. A player's handicap is lost immediately he ceases to be a member of an affiliated club or loses his amateur status.

To make matters worse in accordance with rule 24.8

24.8 Whilst a player's handicap is suspended or has been lost, he shall not enter or compete in any competition which requires a competitor to be the holder of a CONGU handicap as designated by the UHS.

So your options are to join an affiliated club and then follow the correct procedure to obtain a handicap.

You are almost correct. According to the advice given by the GUI, (to members of an affiliated club recently gone bust), this is what they said.

Your handicap lapses if you are no longer a member of an affiliated club. If you join an affiliated club within 6 months you're handicap is re-instated to where it was at the time of your last affiliated club.

If you join an affiliated club after 6 months has elapsed, you submit 3 cards and the new club can also take into consideration your past playing history.

Until you join an affiliated club, you don't have a recognised handicap for competitions etc.,

onlyfinewine

8under wrote: »

You are almost correct. According to the advice given by the GUI, (to members of an affiliated club recently gone bust), this is what they said.

Your handicap lapses if you are no longer a member of an affiliated club. If you join an affiliated club within 6 months you're handicap is re-instated to where it was at the time of your last affiliated club.

If you join an affiliated club after 6 months has elapsed, you submit 3 cards and the new club can also take into consideration your past playing history.

Until you join an affiliated club, you don't have a recognised handicap for competitions etc.,

I'm not sure which part of my message you thought was almost correct?

On checking what I wrote, I can find no errors.

Unfortunately, you have been misinformed because your handicap is lost immediately if your club is no longer affiliated to the GUI.

Rule 24.7. A player's handicap is lost immediately he ceases to be a member of an affiliated club or loses his amateur status.

To make matters worse in accordance with rule 24.8

24.8 Whilst a player's handicap is suspended or has been lost, he shall not enter or compete in any competition which requires a competitor to be the holder of a CONGU handicap as designated by the UHS.

So your options are to join an affiliated club and then follow the correct procedure to obtain a handicap.

This was written in relation to a poster who had been in a club which had closed down and depending on the length of time the handicap had lapsed would have to join an affiliated club and go through the correct procedure for obtaining a handicap.


That is as you said either re-instated or allocated on submission of three cards and consideration of previous form.

8under

It's just a small point I had on the wording you used.

In the last line of your post you use the word " correct procedure to obtain" ... a handicap. My point is that within the 6 month period , your former handicap is simply re-instated, there is no requirement to submit 3 cards, no waiting on the determination of a new handicap etc.,

onlyfinewine

8under wrote: »

It's just a small point I had on the wording you used.

In the last line of your post you use the word " correct procedure to obtain" ... a handicap. My point is that within the 6 month period , your former handicap is simply re-instated, there is no requirement to submit 3 cards, no waiting on the determination of a new handicap etc.,

I see where you are coming from and you are correct. That is the procedure for handicap allocation within 6 months.

I had not covered the procedure because there was every likelihood from the context of the post that there had been scores submitted which were not covered by a current handicap. The poster believed that they had 6 months grace before their old handicap expired instead of understanding that the handicap lapsed immediately. That is why I suggested that the correct procedure should be followed which is to firstly join a club and then get a handicap. I felt that the handicap secretary or committee would be better able to deal with any situations that might arise solely within the confines of the club.

8under

I agree with you. An important point you make is that once you are not attached to an affiliated club, your handicap lapses immediately. You don't have a handicap during the lapsed period.

ballyk

scubapro wrote: »

I know If your handicap lapses you have six months before having to resubmit three cards, but what if one didn't want to transfer their handicap and wanted to resubmit three cards on the basis of trying to get a lower handicap?

Has your existing club done their Annual Handicap reviews yet? I got notificed of a 0.6 cut to my handicap so you might be heading for a much larger cut.

ernieprice

ballyk wrote: »

Has your existing club done their Annual Handicap reviews yet? I got notificed of a 0.6 cut to my handicap so you might be heading for a much larger cut.

The Leinster Branch only approved the cuts/increases this week and informed clubs in writing. If you had a lot of NR's then it's possible these were removed by virtue of a cut.

ballyk

ernieprice wrote: »

The Leinster Branch only approved the cuts/increases this week and informed clubs in writing. If you had a lot of NR's then it's possible these were removed by virtue of a cut.

I had no NR's. My membership is in Munster rather than Leinster.

ernieprice

ballyk wrote: »

I had no NR's. My membership is in Munster rather than Leinster.

Every Branch conduct handicap reviews and a branch will give a recommendation of cuts/increases to clubs. I know from dealing with the Leinster branch that our club had to reply to the list they gave us. We received a phone call to ask the reason we declined to cut a members handicap. It was because he is 79 years young and plays off 14. He tries in every competition. They were satisfied with our explanation. Maybe you handicap secretary could explain the reason for the cut and if it was on the recommendation of the Munster branch.

ballyk

ernieprice wrote: »

Every Branch conduct handicap reviews and a branch will give a recommendation of cuts/increases to clubs. I know from dealing with the Leinster branch that our club had to reply to the list they gave us. We received a phone call to ask the reason we declined to cut a members handicap. It was because he is 79 years young and plays off 14. He tries in every competition. They were satisfied with our explanation. Maybe you handicap secretary could explain the reason for the cut and if it was on the recommendation of the Munster branch.

I'm happy to get cut. I was mentioning it to Scabapro that he might get a much larger cut in their Annual Review.

PARlance

ballyk wrote: »

I'm happy to get cut. I was mentioning it to Scabapro that he might get a much larger cut in their Annual Review.

Well done BallyK.

I'd be in the same boat and I get the impression that anyone I've met on here would be too, but being honest, my first thought has always been "bandit" when I hear of this someone getting a cut under review.
I need to change that cynical default setting in me

Almaviva

Anyone got any stats, for club, or colated by regions, on whether the ESR system resulted in a decrease of the number of handicaps being flagged by the system at annual review? You would have expected it to decrease due to some of the fast falling handicappers having been brought into line more quickly.

In our club about have the review handicap changes are genuine. The other half are bandits. And are the same cohort every year - bandits who have played ahead of their handicap through the summer, mopped up in the winter league and turkeys. And then are cut. Only keeps them quiet until qualifying comps return - and they 'correct' matters to their satisfaction pretty quickly, ready for the summer for a repeat season of loot plunder. Review system has no reference to repeat review cuts which seems to be letting them off the hook. Rather than cut one or 2 shots, that should eb multiplied by the number of years in a row that they have had an end of year cut. Or similat progressive cutting calculation.