Any History students, HistPol or History TSM students share their thoughts with me?

GOCathail

I am a sixth year student, and am torn between studying HistPol or History and English as a TSM. Could anyone please tell me what they think of theses courses - past experiences, comments on lecturers, the campus, and the like.
I would love to hear any stories/advice you have to help me decide which course to take. Thank you all very much.

maedhbh_mac

Hi there,

I'm first year TSM History this year and really enjoying it. Here's the link to the course handbook, in case you haven't had a look already: http://www.tcd.ie/history/assets/pdf/ug/SHTSMHPS1213.pdf

Presumably, you're doing History for the leaving and you already know that you enjoy it. When giving a little start of the year History pep talk, our coordinator stressed how the first two years of History at Trinity are about breadth, and the last two (if you choose to pursue it) are more about depth. That is definitely true.

TSM anything is tricky, because you're constantly juggling the two subjects - I didn't quite grasp what a balancing act that would turn out to be when I put it down for the CAO. It's an exercise in time management, especially if you enjoy both of your subjects a lot, and sometimes deciding what to study feels like picking a favourite child.

First term, TSM and HPS students have two compulsory modules (one is worth ten credits, the other is worth five - it's a sort of History 101 thing). Second term, there's more choice and you get to pick which modules you're interested in taking - they're broadly the same from year to year, but sometimes one or other won't be available because the lecturer is on sabbatical etc. Do check out the handbook, because you have quotas to fill in your first two years in terms of modules (TSM & HPS need to take 2 medieval (1 is in the first term and is compulsory), 2 European (that compulsory module is medieval and European, so you have a European already) and 2 Irish. It's a little confusing at first. Single honours students have 4 compulsory modules, and they also need 4 medieval, 3 European and 3 Irish modules over two year. All in all, we all saw each other this term for 2 shared modules.

For a TSM student, that works out at just 3 hours of lectures a week and 2 hours of tutorials. But that doesn't factor in the amount of time that you'll be spending reading if you pick any History related course. You'll read so much that you'll actually be physically tired from it and you'll get a distinctive library hunch if you're not careful. Your family members will actually forget what you looked like without your nose in a book. That being said, the history section of the library is huge, with something for everyone, and you'll be able to make very specific historical in-jokes, so that's always nice. Reading can be a b*tch though because everyone wants to read the same books, especially coming up to essay deadline time - sometimes you have to wait weeks for any particularly coveted titles that you can borrow or get in ridiculously early to find the shelf copy.

The 2 compulsory modules are a bit hit and miss, tbh. One is brilliant (10 credit one) and the other feels like a bit of a waste of time, sometimes. The work load isn't heavy - a 500 word tutorial assignment for each module once a week which doesn't count towards your grade and then, in the 10 credit module a 2,000 word essay worth 20% that you submit in December and in the 5 credit module a portfolio thingy. We don't do Christmas exams and the compulsory 5 credit module doesn't have an exam.

Personally, I think History is excellent. The lecturers are very personable and genuinely passionate about their fields of interest, which is so different from the trudge that is the leaving cert History course for the vast majority of people.

I can't tell you that much about English, other than it has slightly more hours (I believe, having spoken to a few English students) and a similar emphasis on reading. A lot of the information you might want is actually online - check out both the History and English departmental websites (some stuff you won't be able to access but you can get the course layout and stuff like that). I think you can even access the exam papers online, though I'm open to correction.

Anyway, good luck with your course choice and your exams - hope this helps.

Denerick

Read. When you think you've read too much, read more. Read again. If you don't like reading you will not have a good time!

gutenberg

I'd echo both Denerick and Maedhbh; all those courses are hugely reading-heavy, so be prepared for that!

I did HistPol & graduated in 2011, so things have changed a little since I was there. Maedhbh has covered the basics for the Freshmen years (that has changed, since we didn't have any compulsory modules). However I think the real strength of History at Trinity is in the last two years, when you get to study the more in-depth courses. That's when you'll see the real interests and passions of the lecturers, as these courses are often based around their current or recent research, are highly specialised, and primary source-focused, so you get good sourcework training as well as becoming familiar with some topics in a very in-depth way, and there's usually a broad range on offer, from the medieval to the contemporary period. Then, if you're Single Honours or choose to major in History, you get to do an undergrad dissertation, which is easily the best thing about the course, as you get to research one topic in depth, really engaging with primary sources, and possibly even discovering something new!

I have to say, however, that I was not a fan of Trinity Political Science. I know there have been some personnel changes since I left (which was part of the problem) but you won't get the same level of attention that you get from the History department, as the PolSci courses will be shared with BESS, PPES, etc. Our tutorials were always relatively large groups, and taken by often-inexperienced teaching assistants (this is a feature of History too I should add, in the Freshmen years, but the PolSci ones were particularly poor for some reason). Many of the lecturers I had were quite uninterested in teaching, and saw it as a necessary evil; I always felt that PolSci was a department more interested in research than in teaching, though perhaps it has changed since I was there. Some of the courses they offer are incredibly interesting though, if you can stand the other stuff. International relations, political thought (basically a history of political philosophers from Plato to Marx) and Irish politics were some of my highlights. Some of the reading for PolSci is incredibly stimulating as well, and will get you thinking differently about things. Apart from perhaps Irish politics, there was never really much emphasis on current affairs in any of the courses I did, so be prepared for that; PolSci is quite an academic discipline. That being said, I gather some of the fourth-year courses were very current, but I majored in History (partly to get away from the PolSci department!!).

If you've any further queries please ask!

Justice!

One is brilliant (10 credit one) and the other feels like a bit of a waste of time, sometimes

"Doing History" I presume?

GOCathail

gutenberg wrote: »

I majored in History (partly to get away from the PolSci department!!).

Is PolSci really that awful? By that I mean, if I were a close friend, would you advise me to go for the HistPol or run a mile?
Be brutally honest please!
Thank you

maedhbh_mac

Got it in one, Justice

gutenberg

GOCathail wrote: »

Is PolSci really that awful? By that I mean, if I were a close friend, would you advise me to go for the HistPol or run a mile?
Be brutally honest please!
Thank you

To be honest I would advise anyone to do HistPol, it really is a great course. I enjoyed a lot of my politics courses, and as I said the reading was usually very stimulating, together with a couple of good lecturers. As I said, I partly wanted to get away from politics in fourth year, but we had an especially horrendous third year experience with PolSci on account of just one lecturer really, who has since left. The major reason I went with History alone in fourth year though was that I had completely fallen in love with it, and really wanted the chance to do some more of the specialist Sophister courses, and I was dying to do the dissertation. So partly to do with PolSci, and mostly to do with History - I've since done a Master's and am now doing my PhD in history, just to give you an idea of the depth of the obsession

PolSci I would therefore recommend, though perhaps with a bit of a health warning. First year in particular can be a bit off-putting as you only do one general politics course, alongside sociology & economic policy, but once you're through that the courses get better and more specialised, and like History I gather the fourth year ones tend to be the best, as you have the foundations to do very in-depth work.

Denerick

The first two years of the history course is great preparation for a career in table quizzes by the way. Nice and broad course parameters, you learn a little of everything. So there's always that.

zam

GOCathail wrote: »

Is PolSci really that awful? By that I mean, if I were a close friend, would you advise me to go for the HistPol or run a mile?
Be brutally honest please!
Thank you

No. HistPol is fantastic. As with most arts courses in Trinity, you can take and learn as little or as much as you want from it. You can keep going with both history and political science for all 4 years or specialise in one or the other in 4th year - quite a few people in my class have talked about majoring in political science so it's not all bad!

gutenberg

zam wrote: »

No. HistPol is fantastic. As with most arts courses in Trinity, you can take and learn as little or as much as you want from it. You can keep going with both history and political science for all 4 years or specialise in one or the other in 4th year - quite a few people in my class have talked about majoring in political science so it's not all bad!

GOCathail wrote: »

Is PolSci really that awful? By that I mean, if I were a close friend, would you advise me to go for the HistPol or run a mile?
Be brutally honest please!
Thank you

In my year of HistPol, no one majored in Political Science - I think it was a product of our bad third year experience though. In the year after us, quite a few majored in political science, suggesting that it had improved, something reinforced by zam's class then. So I wouldn't worry too much.

Horsovsky

gutenberg wrote: »

To be honest I would advise anyone to do HistPol, it really is a great course.

First year in particular can be a bit off-putting as you only do one general politics course, alongside sociology & economic policy, but once you're through that the courses get better and more specialised.

Basically this.

I'm in first year HistPol and I would recommend it to anyone who thinks the course sounds interesting. I don't really feel qualified to discuss the politics side, because so far I've only had one politics module (intro to pol sci) which I've really enjoyed (Incidentally, I quite like the economics and sociology modules too).

I can only repeat what Gutenberg, zam and maedhbh have said so far but if you have any specific questions about HistPol, particularly first year, that you want answered please feel free to post them!

History in Trinity really is excellent and HistPol is a really good combination that I personally think has certain advantages over TSM combinations.

Sgro

GOCathail wrote: »

I am a sixth year student, and am torn between studying HistPol or History and English as a TSM. Could anyone please tell me what they think of theses courses - past experiences, comments on lecturers, the campus, and the like.
I would love to hear any stories/advice you have to help me decide which course to take. Thank you all very much.

Unrelated to your question, but if you're in 6th year how did you know to call it 'HistPol'? I had no idea what people meant when they said that in my first week of term in TCD.
Related to your thread, can't speak personally, but I do the Intro to Political Science module and it's OK. It's not bad but it's not great either. I've a friend who does 'pure' History and has about 8 or so hours a week I think, but does a lot of reading. I imagine HistPol is quite good as the mix of PolSci and history would be interesting, I share tutorial groups with people doing HistPol and they seem to enjoy it, all I can offer, sorry.

caien

Nobody seems to have mentioned English yet. I'm a TSM History and English student (2nd year) and I was caught between English and Politics too.

The English department at Trinity is brilliant, the lecturers are great and really know their subjects. The tutorials are the best though, they're very informal and relaxed, and you just get to chat about the text (or just listen, if you're not into sharing you're thoughts). The tutors are very good at getting you to think for yourself and see things in a new way. Its a very basic set up (no Blackboard and online learning etc.) but very effective and engaging. They really know what they're doing and make you feel like you're part of an academic community.
There's also the fact that you have a lot of room to concentrate on what you like. The modules are all compulsory in 1st year, three each term, but they have a great variety of texts to choose from in each, so there will usually be something to interest you.

Also 3rd in Europe after Oxford and Cambridge...:cool:

The only negative thing I would say is that it is very reading heavy, but what are you doing English for, right? It also takes some time to get used to having to depend entirely on your own opinions and analysis. The lectures tend to give a brief overview and some context rather than discussing the text, and you need thoughts ready for tutorials, since some tutors call on you rather than let people volunteer. I had a secondary school teacher who basically taught us all the analysis, and since I had never had to have an opinion on a text before in an academic situation, the vagueness of the subject freaked me out at first. So if you're the type that likes concrete answers that can be verified, then English might not be for you.

People have already said a good bit about HistPol, so all I'll say about history is that it much more interesting, if challenging, than school and the staff can be a bit luck-of-the-draw. Both English and History are very different to secondary school, I much preferred History for the Leaving but I'm going to major in English.
As for Politics, I too have HistPol friends who love Politics, but they also complain an awful lot about it! The department can be a bit dodgy apparently. Its a lot more scientific than English and History.

Not sure if any of that was helpful (or very well phrased) but as someone who was in your situation, I would definitely recommend English. I was really into politics when I was in Leaving Cert, and just decided to go for English because I wanted to improve my writing (it hadn't been my best subject in school) and it really worked out for the best.