dehorning

RoscommonTom

Any fella out there used horn up dehorner? Is it any good, thanks to all.

Bodacious

RoscommonTom wrote: »

Any fella out there used horn up dehorner? Is it any good, thanks to all.

dont have one, use portasol ii gas one but hornup didnt get great reviews on here,few rows over it though:mad: one lad had scurs/regrowth after it

ootbitb

http://www.boards.ie/vbulletin/showthread.php?t=2055287987

RoscommonTom

good man youself, i had a read and think i might go with the portosol again, thanks

RobinBanks

Hello all,
I have a 6 month old calf that needs to be dehorned. When I went to dehorn her at 2 weeks old I couldn’t find any buds but it turns out she has them. They are not big enough yet that you can see them but I want to dehorn her.
Just wondering should I just get the vet to skull her or is there any other option? I have a portable gas dehorner but I have my doubts it will fit over the horn at this stage. I plan to keep her for breeding and I would rather if she didn’t have stumps of horns when older.

yellow50HX

RobinBanks wrote: »

Hello all,
I have a 6 month old calf that needs to be dehorned. When I went to dehorn her at 2 weeks old I couldn’t find any buds but it turns out she has them. They are not big enough yet that you can see them but I want to dehorn her.
Just wondering should I just get the vet to skull her or is there any other option? I have a portable gas dehorner but I have my doubts it will fit over the horn at this stage. I plan to keep her for breeding and I would rather if she didn’t have stumps of horns when older.

there are no issues de horning 6 month old cattle. from what your saying the buds came late. we have AA/Lim calves and soemtimes the buds dont show for a few months. We used to have FR's and they would have massive buds after a few weeks.

what you need is a good handling crush, the small ones for young calves are too small. if you have a good skulling gate on the main crush that can be closed in enough to catch her head you can use this but you'll need to make a few temp mods.
1) put in pallets to narrow the crush width (also stops the calf from turning)
2) if the skulling gate is too wide you can bolt another pipe into the gate to make it narrow enough to hold her head.
3) you'll need a hardy young fella to stand in behind her to keep her tail up and keep her pushed forward (steel toes caps and shin pads would be a good addition)
4) a good hot gas iron
5) long handled pruning shears
6) aniestethic

get the calf into the crush and make sure she is well secured.
inject the aniesthic into her temples (soft spot between the ear and horn)
once that has taken effect cut the bud off with the shears (watch for the blood). only do one side at a time.
use the de horner to remove the remainder of the bud and to seal to wound.
she'll be sore for a few days but will heal up well.

RobinBanks

yellow50HX wrote: »

there are no issues de horning 6 month old cattle. from what your saying the buds came late. we have AA/Lim calves and soemtimes the buds dont show for a few months. We used to have FR's and they would have massive buds after a few weeks.

what you need is a good handling crush, the small ones for young calves are too small. if you have a good skulling gate on the main crush that can be closed in enough to catch her head you can use this but you'll need to make a few temp mods.
1) put in pallets to narrow the crush width (also stops the calf from turning)
2) if the skulling gate is too wide you can bolt another pipe into the gate to make it narrow enough to hold her head.
3) you'll need a hardy young fella to stand in behind her to keep her tail up and keep her pushed forward (steel toes caps and shin pads would be a good addition)
4) a good hot gas iron
5) long handled pruning shears
6) aniestethic

get the calf into the crush and make sure she is well secured.
inject the aniesthic into her temples (soft spot between the ear and horn)
once that has taken effect cut the bud off with the shears (watch for the blood). only do one side at a time.
use the de horner to remove the remainder of the bud and to seal to wound.
she'll be sore for a few days but will heal up well.

Cheer yellow. I have everything except the pruning shears. I might get away without it yet depending on how big they are. If I can get the top of the bud off I will be able to work away with the gas dehorner by the sounds of things.

yellow50HX

RobinBanks wrote: »

Cheer yellow. I have everything except the pruning shears. I might get away without it yet depending on how big they are. If I can get the top of the bud off I will be able to work away with the gas dehorner by the sounds of things.

this is what we have used. once the head is secured they dont move and its a clean cut. if the horn is big or very hard like in a FR then you need to cut it 1st other wise you have a stump. these are actually ideal as they have only one cuttign edge and the curved lower side fits under the horn with out cuttign the scalp.

http://www.amestruetemper.com/products/detail.aspx?ProductId=576&FamilyId=248&LineId=83

hugo29

RoscommonTom wrote: »

Any fella out there used horn up dehorner? Is it any good, thanks to all.

i have one and its pure ****e, they grow back and its a cnut to use

Midlandsman80

hugo29 wrote: »

i have one and its pure ****e, they grow back and its a cnut to use

We have one and have a few weanlings with horns now... but that was on first years use, calves need to be 4 weeks max or I would be going with old method, I think they are a great job on young calves if done in time, we got great success since learning this...calves much much less bothered after it than trad method.

hugo29

Midlandsman80 wrote: »

We have one and have a few weanlings with horns now... but that was on first years use, calves need to be 4 weeks max or I would be going with old method, I think they are a great job on young calves if done in time, we got great success since learning this...calves much much less bothered after it than trad method.

really, i did half the weanlings with it this year at approx 2 weeks old and half them grew back

did the rest the traditional method and all fine

Midlandsman80

Yeh full success this year so wont bin it just yet. I think its over priced though...

Dreading the thoughts of getting the weanlings that it didnt work right done in a month or two, horrible job.

Sam Kade

RobinBanks wrote: »

Cheer yellow. I have everything except the pruning shears. I might get away without it yet depending on how big they are. If I can get the top of the bud off I will be able to work away with the gas dehorner by the sounds of things.

A hacksaw or tenon saw will do as well.

yellow50HX

Sam Kade wrote: »

A hacksaw or tenon saw will do as well.

takes too long and is a bit awqward, cut is not as clean either. shears will do it in a second and leaves a nice clean cut. we put the blade into water after each cut to prevent any infection. once you cut the buds you can put on the dehorner and finish the job

Sam Kade

yellow50HX wrote: »

takes too long and is a bit awqward, cut is not as clean either. shears will do it in a second and leaves a nice clean cut. we put the blade into water after each cut to prevent any infection. once you cut the buds you can put on the dehorner and finish the job

But with 1 animal it won't make much difference, you do need to be very fast though.

yellow50HX

Sam Kade wrote: »

But with 1 animal it won't make much difference, you do need to be very fast though.

they are a handy yoke to have anyway, cutting back branchs, furze bushs and around fencing. cutting of horns is just a bonus.

pakalasa

From day one I asked Vet the ideal size of bud to dehorn and he told me about 7mm. I burn off and flick off bud with electric hot iron and make 'X' shape across raw area to seal. I've never had a horn grow this way. Use spray of iodine then on area.

Bodacious

yellow50HX wrote: »

there are no issues de horning 6 month old cattle. from what your saying the buds came late. we have AA/Lim calves and soemtimes the buds dont show for a few months. We used to have FR's and they would have massive buds after a few weeks.

what you need is a good handling crush, the small ones for young calves are too small. if you have a good skulling gate on the main crush that can be closed in enough to catch her head you can use this but you'll need to make a few temp mods.
1) put in pallets to narrow the crush width (also stops the calf from turning)
2) if the skulling gate is too wide you can bolt another pipe into the gate to make it narrow enough to hold her head.
3) you'll need a hardy young fella to stand in behind her to keep her tail up and keep her pushed forward (steel toes caps and shin pads would be a good addition)
4) a good hot gas iron
5) long handled pruning shears
6) aniestethic

get the calf into the crush and make sure she is well secured.
inject the aniesthic into her temples (soft spot between the ear and horn)
once that has taken effect cut the bud off with the shears (watch for the blood). only do one side at a time.
use the de horner to remove the remainder of the bud and to seal to wound.
she'll be sore for a few days but will heal up well.

+1

I don't use the pallet though or go behind her I throw a rope around the kidney and tie her to middle bar of crush.. takes the thrashing out of her

yellow50HX

Bodacious wrote: »

+1

I don't use the pallet though or go behind her I throw a rope around the kidney and tie her to middle bar of crush.. takes the thrashing out of her

Trying to get them into the crush and keeping there is the hard bit. Find without someone in behind they pull their heads back

reilig

Stopped dehorning young calves this year as it's just too hard on them. They lose thrive for a week or 2 after it. It's an awkward job to hold the calf if you have no crate or to load the calf into the crate if you have one. Most calves that we have aren't fit to dehorn till about 8 weeks old. So everything had to get anesthetic.

Bought a barnes dehorner last year to finish the job on 2 calves that I had missed. This year I did every calf at about 5 months old with it. Put them in the sculling gate, gave anaesthetic and just chopped off each horn with the barnes. There was no haltering as we have a bar on sculling gate to keep the head down, there was no holding, and most importantly there was no blood. At this stage the hair has grown back on each calf and you'd never know it was done. It had no adverse affect on calf thrive. They didn't even know that the horns were gone as no skin was burned - unlike dehorning!

It's a 1 man job and each animal can be doone in under a minute and it's a very safe job.

bbam

reilig wrote: »

Stopped dehorning young calves this year as it's just too hard on them. They lose thrive for a week or 2 after it. It's an awkward job to hold the calf if you have no crate or to load the calf into the crate if you have one. Most calves that we have aren't fit to dehorn till about 8 weeks old. So everything had to get anesthetic.

Bought a barnes dehorner last year to finish the job on 2 calves that I had missed. This year I did every calf at about 5 months old with it. Put them in the sculling gate, gave anaesthetic and just chopped off each horn with the barnes. There was no haltering as we have a bar on sculling gate to keep the head down, there was no holding, and most importantly there was no blood. At this stage the hair has grown back on each calf and you'd never know it was done. It had no adverse affect on calf thrive. They didn't even know that the horns were gone as no skin was burned - unlike dehorning!

It's a 1 man job and each animal can be doone in under a minute and it's a very safe job.

I'm sure just like dehorning it can be poorly done.
I've never noticed much drop in thrive with dehorning but it's definitely a two man job round here.

The only time I saw problems here was getting it done by BIL, he insists in gouging out the root, flesh and all - totally OTT !

Quick 10-15 second sizzle with a circling motion does it. The key is th have the iron as hot as possible. Ours has an extended cable so it remains plugged in all the time. Heat for 20 mins before use.

RobinBanks

bbam wrote: »

Quick 10-15 second sizzle with a circling motion does it.

I have being doing this way for years but for whatever reasons its not always successful. Sometimes butts of horns will appear. Has this ever happened you?

I might not be going deep enough every time maybe

bbam

RobinBanks wrote: »

I have being doing this way for years but for whatever reasons its not always successful. Sometimes butts of horns will appear. Has this ever happened you?

I might not be going deep enough every time maybe

Not once.
The two problems I've seen is not waiting till the iron is hot through and plugging it out to dehorn, it's amazing how much heat is lost in a short time.

RobinBanks

bbam wrote: »

Not once.
The two problems I've seen is not waiting till the iron is hot through and plugging it out to dehorn, it's amazing how much heat is lost in a short time.

Mine is a Ritchie gas dehorner so the heat is always there but as you say might not be hot enough.

Bodacious

reilig wrote: »

Stopped dehorning young calves this year as it's just too hard on them. They lose thrive for a week or 2 after it. It's an awkward job to hold the calf if you have no crate or to load the calf into the crate if you have one. Most calves that we have aren't fit to dehorn till about 8 weeks old. So everything had to get anesthetic.

Bought a barnes dehorner last year to finish the job on 2 calves that I had missed. This year I did every calf at about 5 months old with it. Put them in the sculling gate, gave anaesthetic and just chopped off each horn with the barnes. There was no haltering as we have a bar on sculling gate to keep the head down, there was no holding, and most importantly there was no blood. At this stage the hair has grown back on each calf and you'd never know it was done. It had no adverse affect on calf thrive. They didn't even know that the horns were gone as no skin was burned - unlike dehorning!

It's a 1 man job and each animal can be doone in under a minute and it's a very safe job.

Hi reilig,

I feel your pain with the late developers (high % lim breeding) but it's still better younger than using the Barnes dehorner and sealing it with the iron .

I've like bbam done them but unless you kill all of the root you can/ will get a nasty scur/ regrowth.. Not you but the next man is walking into trouble... They grow funny turn in towards the head/ are unsightly and hurt like hell if you get a belt off of one while dosing !!

Doing one tonight for a neighbour that was missed, a late calf and twice he handled but not enough on him to burn, to be honest if u can at all I'd get them as soft in the root as practically possible !

Bod

reilig

Bodacious wrote: »

Hi reilig,

I feel your pain with the late developers (high % lim breeding) but it's still better younger than using the Barnes dehorner and sealing it with the iron .



Bod

I don't have to seal with the hot iron after using the barnes dehorner. I find that if i take off the horn before the calf is 5 months old, then there is rarely any blood from it at all. The animal definitely does not suffer as much as a calf that is dehorned with the hot iron!

yellow50HX

reilig wrote: »

I don't have to seal with the hot iron after using the barnes dehorner. I find that if i take off the horn before the calf is 5 months old, then there is rarely any blood from it at all. The animal definitely does not suffer as much as a calf that is dehorned with the hot iron!

proably much easier as a 1 man job too. do notice that is we dont have the iron hot enough and dont get the root it'll come back as a bit of a stump. as for trive once they are well secured and you dotn have to go mad with the iron they are ok, sore for a few days but once they can still drink from the mother they are ok. we still have some AA blood so not all the calves need to be done. compare the calves for trive and very seldom see any go back

Muckit

reilig wrote: »

I don't have to seal with the hot iron after using the barnes dehorner. I find that if i take off the horn before the calf is 5 months old, then there is rarely any blood from it at all. The animal definitely does not suffer as much as a calf that is dehorned with the hot iron!

Hi Reilig

I think Bod has a point. Your dehorning horns that aren't fully grown. Your not killing the root at all. Yes they'I look good for sale, but the next lad is going to have to do them again if he's selling through the mart.

reilig

Muckit wrote: »

Hi Reilig

I think Bod has a point. Your dehorning horns that aren't fully grown. Your not killing the root at all. Yes they'I look good for sale, but the next lad is going to have to do them again if he's selling through the mart.

I did 2 last year that we kept and they have no regrowth. Barnes will cut right at the skin - even closer than if you were sculling with a wire or a saw because of the shape of the blade on the barnes.

Bodacious

reilig wrote: »

I did 2 last year that we kept and they have no regrowth. Barnes will cut right at the skin - even closer than if you were sculling with a wire or a saw because of the shape of the blade on the barnes.

Handle them for the crack the next time you have them in the chute .. I wouldn't choose Barnes for any heifer definitely as root still there. .. Only flattened out the top of them... If I bought a heifer @ 5mts to keep, I'd anaesthetic, Barnes to expose root ... And out with root.. Take no chances!