help required with stamp 4 and new baby

tonyheaney

Hi Guys

I really need your advice on this one. My wife's friends who are Chinese are having their second baby. The Chinese girl and guy (let’s call them Mrs X & Mr. Y are both Chinese.) got married in china and their first baby was born here in Ireland.

Mr. Y has got a stamp 4 and they are expecting a second baby. He is no longer in his job and intends on starting up his own business. (God knows why with a baby on the way) These kids are struggling to the point they have ask us and another friend for any clothing and toys for their baby.

I need to know the following:

1. Are they eligible to apply for a medical card not that both have no income.

2. Can they apply for social housing, dole or any social welfare if so what?

3. Does it make a difference regarding how he left his last place of employment i.e. Sacked resigned and made redundant.

4. As china have the one child policy the second child will not be considered Chinese but Irish how will this affect them in the future, will this child keep them here permanently?

5. As they are both unemployed and he has registered a name for a business (I believe its bio engineering or something to do with pollution) what are their options? I have sent a copy of this to citizen’s advice and I’m waiting for advice but I want to widen my field of advice before I even attempt to help these people.

Cheers

Monife

tonyheaney wrote: »

I need to know the following:

1. Are they eligible to apply for a medical card not that both have no income.

Yes.

tonyheaney wrote: »

2. Can they apply for social housing, dole or any social welfare if so what?

Yes. Provided they are legally resident they can apply for social welfare (subject to PRSI contributions or means testing). Although this may affect future citizenship applications made by them. If they are approved for a social welfare payment, they can then apply for rent allowance or asked to be placed on the social housing list, which is also means tested and investigated.

tonyheaney wrote: »

3. Does it make a difference regarding how he left his last place of employment i.e. Sacked resigned and made redundant.

I don't think so. With regards to social welfare, I think if you left your job voluntarily, there is a ban on applying for social welfare payments for a set number of days/weeks.

tonyheaney wrote: »

4. As china have the one child policy the second child will not be considered Chinese but Irish how will this affect them in the future, will this child keep them here permanently?

Having an Irish born child does not afford any permanent residency rights. Following on from the Zambrano judgement last year, non-EU parents who live in an EU country and have a child born there, will be entitled to live and work there. In Ireland, they are given a stamp 4. In order to live here permanently, they have a couple of options. Apply for citizenship after 5 years of legal residency or after 8 years of legal residency (this option would I suppose be if citizenship is refused or if they wanted to keep their citizenship if their home country doesn't allow dual citizenship), apply for a stamp 5 WCATT, Without condition as to time, which is basically permanent residency.

tonyheaney wrote: »

5. As they are both unemployed and he has registered a name for a business (I believe its bio engineering or something to do with pollution) what are their options? I have sent a copy of this to citizen’s advice and I’m waiting for advice but I want to widen my field of advice before I even attempt to help these people.

If the business is not yet set up, I believe he can apply for social welfare. After that, I am afraid I don't know. I am better versed in immigration issues rather than social welfare or revenue issues.

Best of luck.

tonyheaney

Hi Monife thank you for your help in this Matter it is very much appreciated.

petersburg2002

China has a one child policy but its not written in stone. They simply pay a fine for breaking the rule. A lot of middle class and wealthy families residing in China have more than one child.

Equality

This is my take on the answers, hope it helps.

1. Are they eligible to apply for a medical card not that both have no income. Yes, they should apply, but ironically the medical card section have a problem issuing a medical card to people with NO income, as they want to know what they are living on. If they are on social welfare, the medical card is easy to get, with no income it is a problem.

2. Can they apply for social housing, dole or any social welfare if so what? Yes, they can apply for everything. In practice, he can apply for jobseekers benefit (he may have enough cons) or allowance. While he is waiting for this to come through, they can go to the Community Welfare Office and apply for Basic Supplementary Welfare Allowance, which can be paid within a week if he qualifies. He can also apply for help with the rent or mortgage, also from the CWO. Drawing assistance may hurt the parents chances of Irish citizenship, especially if they draw it for a long period of time.

They can apply for child benefit for the two kids. Drawing child benefit does not hurt their chances of Irish citizenship.

If his mrs had the right to work, she may have been employed or self employed in Ireland. If she has enough cons from either employment or self employment, she can apply for maternity benefit. The immigration people usually don't count maternity benefit as a problem if they want Irish citizenship. She can claim for him on the maternity benefit, if she can get it, so in this case he should put off applying for the jobseekers until the maternity benefit is exhausted.

3. Does it make a difference regarding how he left his last place of employment i.e. Sacked resigned and made redundant. No. If he was at fault/resigned, he can be denied payment by social welfare for a max of nine weeks on this account, usually less. If he got a large redundancy payment, this may have an impact on means tested social welfare, he will be asked to show how he spent it.

4. As china have the one child policy the second child will not be considered Chinese but Irish how will this affect them in the future, will this child keep them here permanently? This is not related to the Chinese one child policy, as Irish law does not take that into account, except in circumstances so rare they are not worth mentioning.

The issue is the status of the parents in the years before either of their children were born. If the child(ren) were born in Ireland, then you need to know the exact immigration status of the parents in the 4 years before birth. If the parents were legally resident workers for 3 of the 4 years before the birth, then the child is likely to be an Irish citizen, so long as the parents were not here on student visas. If this is the case, they should apply for an Irish passport for either or both children, as if the children hold an Irish passport the parents cannot easily be deported. The parent of an Irish or Eu child has significant rights. I will go into these in more detail if you think it applies.

5. As they are both unemployed and he has registered a name for a business (I believe its bio engineering or something to do with pollution) what are their options?

It depends. If both have the right to work, one can claim jobseekers (assuming they qualify) and the other can be self employed. They can both be self employed if they want, but there is probably less chance of getting social welfare if both are self employed. They need to register with revenue as self employed (this is free) and send in their accounts each year. If the mrs is self employed and gets pregnant again, she can get maternity benefit, if she has enough cons paid. They can try for any available grants.

Equality

PS

It is the birth of an EU/Irish citizen child that confers rights on the parents.

Some children born in Ireland are not entitled to Irish citizenship, in these cases the parents acquire no rights, as the rights are based on the child being a citizen.