how much difference would a pro bike make?

M cebee

how much difference would a pro bike make to an average cyclist with a 700euro racer

are we talkin 2% ,or something more like 10% improvement in speed?:)

Beasty

M cebee wrote: »

how much difference would a pro bike make to an average cyclist with a 700euro racer

are we talkin 2% ,or something more like 10% improvement in speed?:)

It will make you feel better ...

Wouldn't even suggest 2% TBH - a bit lighter for the climbing, a bit more aero but that's mainly of benefit when going solo. Upgrading wheels is generally reckoned to be the best investment - they may well make a couple of percent difference, but the frame alone is unlikely to make a major difference.

TheBlaaMan

It will make you feel 100% more awesome.....

M cebee

thanks
i'll stick with the epo for now

buffalo

In my experience, a carbon vs alloy frame made a hell of a difference in two hill climb TTs that I did. Not sure if they're directly comparable, due to differences in my form, the parcours, competitors, etc. But I not what I'll be saving for over the next couple of months.

doozerie

buffalo wrote: »

In my experience, a carbon vs alloy frame made a hell of a difference in two hill climb TTs that I did. Not sure if they're directly comparable, due to differences in my form, the parcours, competitors, etc. But I not what I'll be saving for over the next couple of months.

You rode an entirely different bike on those occasions though, right? If so, then you were contending with potentially a huge number of differences from your own bikw of which frame material was only one: geometry, fit (by luck you might have ended up with a bike whose fit was better for you), wheels (possibly stiffer, possibly lighter, possibly "smoother" rolling), tyres (possibly lower rolling resistance), crankset (possibly stiffer), handlebars (possibly stiffer, possibly a better width), chain (possibly stiffer), etc.

None of these in isolation should really make a huge difference, some of them in particular should make miniscule differences at best, but in combination they could amount to something substantial. So swap your existing frameset for carbon and the net effect could still be a bike which falls short of the performance of what you rode for those hill climbs. (Or not, of course ).

Raam

It's nigh on impossible to quantify a speed difference. There is just far too much variance between conditions of a rider/weather on any given day. I'd rather ride a high spec bike than a lower spec one, but I'd rather ride a low spec bike than no bike at all. Having said that, I think that a more expensive bike will allow you to conserve your energy a little bit better, so whilst you might not go faster, you might be able to go a little longer and not feel as smashed. Maybe. Just buy the expensive bike, isn't that what you want to hear? :pac:

doozerie

Just to add, I have only ever had (or ridden) one carbon bike, a particularly stiff Canyon, which is fitted with a carbon crankset. Of my other bikes I've ridden steel, aluminium, and titanium, all fitted with an alloy chainset. I've used the same pedals on almost all of them, the steel one being the exception. The Canyon I find to be noticeably stiffer than any of the others, which I put down to the rigidity of the frame and crankset and possibly the wheels a little too.

When I put pressure on the pedals on my Canyon it feels like the energy mostly goes into moving the bike forward, with the others I perceive some amount of flex which gives a sense of wasted energy in that particular instant. Overall though, if there is a measurable difference in performance between the bikes I suspect it's very small. One thing that made a huge difference in performance and feel though was adjusting the fit on one of them to be closer to that of the Canyon (the Canyon was a very good fit for me off the peg).

It's all very subjective of course, but based on my experiences, I'm pretty sure that a half-decent bike would work better for me than a rubbish bike, but a top of the range no-expense-spared bike would make little if any improvement in my performance. Now, if I could buy a pair of pro legs, hearts, and lungs, then...

happytramp

Well if a pro level bike costs about 10x more than your current bike it stands to reason that it will be close enough to 10x better. Therefore I think we can deduce that it will make you approximately 10x faster. Sounds like good value to me.

ryan_sherlock

Having a bike that fits you like a glove will make you much faster - sort that one.

Having a bike that you really really like, will make you ride the bike more, that will make you faster.

Having a bike that is stiff enough (especially descending) will make you more confident on it -> faster.

Having a bike that is comfortable (sometimes very stiff bikes are not comfortable) will leave you less fatigued and make you faster.

Get the fit right, wheels/tires are usually a good upgrade.

High end bikes are faster but the fit must be correct.

billyhead

Lads, just a bit of topic but I commute 5 days a week 26km each way on an all alluminium bike including aluminimum forks. It takes rought an hour or just over it dependeing on the lights I have to stop at. The roads are for the first 7-8km smooth rural roads and then the rest of the journey can be rough an smooth. I was wondering how much of a difference in terms of speed, comfort etc would commuting on a bike with carbon forks make? I have a full carbon bike but do not want to use this on the commute and especially in the winter due to its value and the fact that I like to use this for weekend long spins and special events and when I am guranteed perfect weather I would occassionally commute on it

macnab

I have a 2010 Boardman Team Carbon, its still in standard trim with no consumables changed. It weighs about 8kg. I also have a Trek Madone 5.2 Pro built up with Dura-Ace group set. It weighs about 6.7kg.

I did a back to back test in June. Weather conditions were the same on each day and the effort was much the same judging by a Heart Rate graph and segment times. The route was from Dunboyne to Summerhill so a good mix of hills and flat sections. I did an average of 30.8 km/h on both spins with only a second in the difference.

Beasty

billyhead wrote: »

Lads, just a bit of topic but I commute 5 days a week 26km each way on an all alluminium bike including aluminimum forks. It takes rought an hour or just over it dependeing on the lights I have to stop at. The roads are for the first 7-8km smooth rural roads and then the rest of the journey can be rough an smooth. I was wondering how much of a difference in terms of speed, comfort etc would commuting on a bike with carbon forks make? I have a full carbon bike but do not want to use this on the commute and especially in the winter due to its value and the fact that I like to use this for weekend long spins and special events and when I am guranteed perfect weather I would occassionally commute on it

Well I do a similar commute along many of the same roads on a carbon bike, and I average around 30kph ....

When I moved from aluminium hybrid to carbon racer it really didn't make that much difference to my speed. It was a lot more comfortable though. I don't see much point in upgrading a commuter unless it is for more comfort. Some of those roads are rough as hell and you may find you can get a bit more comfortable by running slightly wider tyres.

billyhead

Beasty wrote: »

Well I do a similar commute along many of the same roads on a carbon bike, and I average around 30kph ....

When I moved from aluminium hybrid to carbon racer it really didn't make that much difference to my speed. It was a lot more comfortable though. I don't see much point in upgrading a commuter unless it is for more comfort. Some of those roads are rough as hell and you may find you can get a bit more comfortable by running slightly wider tyres.

Cheers for the advice Beasty. I was thinking there woudn't be a huge difference in the speed or time it takes if I got a winter bike/commuter with carbon forks. I will stick with what I have as its quite a comfortable ride.

seve65

macnab wrote: »

I have a 2010 Boardman Team Carbon, its still in standard trim with no consumables changed. It weighs about 8kg. I also have a Trek Madone 5.2 Pro built up with Dura-Ace group set. It weighs about 6.7kg.

I did a back to back test in June. Weather conditions were the same on each day and the effort was much the same judging by a Heart Rate graph and segment times. The route was from Dunboyne to Summerhill so a good mix of hills and flat sections. I did an average of 30.8 km/h on both spins with only a second in the difference.

That would seem to roughly correlate with the calc.s here.
http://www.kreuzotter.de/english/espeed.htm.

Put in 180 watts, 100km, then do the 2 different bike weights, leave all the other stuff the same, and it ends up with only a few seconds difference.If it was 100km at an 8% gradient, if such a climb existed, the difference would be 15 minutes.

kincsem

macnab wrote: »

I have a 2010 Boardman Team Carbon, its still in standard trim with no consumables changed. It weighs about 8kg. I also have a Trek Madone 5.2 Pro built up with Dura-Ace group set. It weighs about 6.7kg.

I did a back to back test in June. Weather conditions were the same on each day and the effort was much the same judging by a Heart Rate graph and segment times. The route was from Dunboyne to Summerhill so a good mix of hills and flat sections. I did an average of 30.8 km/h on both spins with only a second in the difference.

Which was faster?

buffalo

The below is all true, I shouldn't have singled out the frame. My general point remains - the bike made a difference. So though fit and geometry might be an influence, a "pro" bike helped me go faster.

I would say I went 1.87234 times faster, if I had to quantify it. Approximately.

Could've gone even faster if those gates were open!

doozerie wrote: »

You rode an entirely different bike on those occasions though, right? If so, then you were contending with potentially a huge number of differences from your own bikw of which frame material was only one: geometry, fit (by luck you might have ended up with a bike whose fit was better for you), wheels (possibly stiffer, possibly lighter, possibly "smoother" rolling), tyres (possibly lower rolling resistance), crankset (possibly stiffer), handlebars (possibly stiffer, possibly a better width), chain (possibly stiffer), etc.

None of these in isolation should really make a huge difference, some of them in particular should make miniscule differences at best, but in combination they could amount to something substantial. So swap your existing frameset for carbon and the net effect could still be a bike which falls short of the performance of what you rode for those hill climbs. (Or not, of course ).

Brian?

When it comes to improving myself as a cyclist I would take a mediocre carbon bike with a power meter over a high end carbon bike without. I've had the use of a power meter recently and the data can come in extremely handy. I can see how it would be very helpful in analysing reace performance and planning for races.

ryan_sherlock

Brian? wrote: »

When it comes to improving myself as a cyclist I would take a mediocre carbon bike with a power meter over a high end carbon bike without. I've had the use of a power meter recently and the data can come in extremely handy. I can see how it would be very helpful in analysing reace performance and planning for races.

Totally agree too.

Good tires (fast rolling) can make a big enough distance. A few Watts if you compare best to worst.

manwithaplan

ryan_sherlock wrote: »

Good tires (fast rolling) can make a big enough distance. A few Watts if you compare best to worst.

Just out of curiosity, what tyres do you race on?

ednwireland

i was going to buy this



cant see anyone taking the P**s me turning up on that and doing a 29 min 10

bert grabsch world champion tt frame at kinetix

OP go to kinetix produxts buy yourself an ex pro frame /bike and let us know

ryan_sherlock

manwithaplan wrote: »

Just out of curiosity, what tyres do you race on?

A mix depending on what I bought/found good deals on... Schwalbe. Mavic tubs, Vittoria (if dry).

CramCycle

I race on a steel frame. Single biggest difference were the wheels and the tyres. Found, for me, GP4000S Continental to be my preferred tyre and I currently ride a pair of Aksiums, cheap(as far as racing wheels go), reliable and roll alot better than my last few wheels. I can hand on my heart say they improved my speed by at least 20% and my endurance at speed almost doubled.

Just opinion though.